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So perhaps a stiff question and one that's been answered before (I searched, but couldn't find it on my phone): I know that the tune and pulleys are relatively easily removable, but how noticeable is it that the car had been modified after reversal? I'm in a lease, and I know some companies are fine with modifications on leased cars so long as everything is reverted to stock at the end and some companies make it a huge deal. Anyone have any idea if Jaguar would give me grief at lease-end if I were to do pulleys and tune (and maybe exhaust if I could find a place to store OEM for a couple years)?
How else are you supposed to increase airflow without going to a K&N or BMC? From people I've talked to that have experience racing they all have pushed me to install a high-flow filter. They also noted that over oiling is far too common... some of the Lambos and Ferrari's they race they don't even re-oil... they just blow out the filter with compressed air and throw them back in.
When I was racing normally aspirated engines, I wouldn't run any kind of air-filter, but I certainly wouldn't do that with an engine I want to last longer than a single season of racing. A lot of tests have been run showing that the oil soaked filters do not capture as much particulates as the typical paper elements. Also, MAP/MAF sensors are now quite sensitive and are easily fouled by the K&N style filters even if they aren't over oiled. I've also seen the accelerated ring and cylinder wear resulting from long-term use of K&Ns.
We have seen no data proving additional horses can be attained by replacing the filters on the F-Types. Certainly nothing to be achieved on the V6 since it's the same intake as on the V8. If the cost weren't so high and I had a V8, I personally would test the Eventuri Intake with before/after dyno runs. It will filter as well as the OEM, but may benefit from the larger filter surface area and the more laminar flow of the air ducting. Check out these two threads: https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f...5/#post1590633 https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f...9/#post1402731
Originally Posted by Arne
Are the intake airflow a bottleneck? If not, there are no gains modifying...
This is much more of an issue with normally aspirated engines and not so much with forced induction.
That I do not know. I do know that Hennessey offers the HPE600 package which includes high-flow filters. I've been told that when increasing HP increasing airflow is a given. I'd prefer not to change them if it really didn't make a difference.
I wouldn't trust anything Hennessey says; they are not a company you want to trust or deal with. The general consensus here is that an intake system will not do much if anything, however there may not be enough data to back that up.
That I do not know. I do know that Hennessey offers the HPE600 package which includes high-flow filters. I've been told that when increasing HP increasing airflow is a given. I'd prefer not to change them if it really didn't make a difference.
It's not a given; it depends on the HP that the stock setup will support. Be VERY wary of blanket statements like "K&N's increase power".....it just isn't so across the board. I know of at least two dyno tested applications where such filters made ZERO difference in power.....and then there is their dubious filtration performance.
It's not a given; it depends on the HP that the stock setup will support. Be VERY wary of blanket statements like "K&N's increase power".....it just isn't so across the board. I know of at least two dyno tested applications where such filters made ZERO difference in power.....and then there is their dubious filtration performance.
Dave
I'm not considering the filters for power, rather just for increased air flow to support the new tuning and higher performance of the engine. My rational was more air, better cooling.
I'm not considering the filters for power, rather just for increased air flow to support the new tuning and higher performance of the engine. My rational was more air, better cooling.
The only reason you'd increase airflow on the intake side is if your vehicles performance was suffering as a result. A vehicle with plenty of airflow already will have no benefit from additional airflow; you can't put anymore air into the engine as is...
Think about it this way; if you're trying to drain a bathtub full of water, making the bathtub bigger isn't going to help the water drain faster. Your bottleneck is still the drain. There's been no evidence that ive seen that these engines need additional airflow at high rpm. No odd tapering off of power as you go up or changes in the location of peak power post tune that would suggest the vehicle needs more air at the filter.
In addition, more air potential at the filter isn't going to do anything for cooling. You're not putting any of that addition airflow potential into the engine; it's just being wasted.
I've spoken to at least half a dozen local car shops, most of whom work on exotics and so far every one of them has suggested BMC filters. Even the owners themselves use these filters in their own cars. When I asked about the oil issue they all said the same thing in regards to most people leaving too much oil on the filters which causes the issues. I've never felt so torn on which way to go!
On a separate note... has anyone in the states ever ordered from supertweaks.com?
Did you Dyno your car before and/or after? The advertised HP increase is claimed somewhere between 630-640 so I'm curious why you're saying 600HP.
Just to interject here - Taino has the Supercharger pulley, 65mm-62mm. This increases output on an FType R by 52WHP when paired with our tuning. We recently posted independent dyno data in our tuning thread:
We have also provided independent dyno documentation verifying 42WHP gains on the software alone, which is posted on our website, and in that same thread.
What I believe the OP has been discussing with us is the crank pulley, which does produce a greater overdrive than the upper pulley, and also produces more power & torque. Yet to have dyno verified on the V8, however with the preponderance of evidence Lance has produced for the V6, coupled with our other data I think it is safe to say maybe 65WHP is a reasonable expectation.
It's not a given; it depends on the HP that the stock setup will support. Be VERY wary of blanket statements like "K&N's increase power".....it just isn't so across the board. I know of at least two dyno tested applications where such filters made ZERO difference in power.....and then there is their dubious filtration performance.
Dave
Dave, the weather is getting nice we gotta get your tune on that beast!
Just to interject here - Taino has the Supercharger pulley, 65mm-62mm. This increases output on an FType R by 52WHP when paired with our tuning. We recently posted independent dyno data in our tuning thread:
We have also provided independent dyno documentation verifying 42WHP gains on the software alone, which is posted on our website, and in that same thread.
What I believe the OP has been discussing with us is the crank pulley, which does produce a greater overdrive than the upper pulley, and also produces more power & torque. Yet to have dyno verified on the V8, however with the preponderance of evidence Lance has produced for the V6, coupled with our other data I think it is safe to say maybe 65WHP is a reasonable expectation.
Hello. You seem to be an expert in the performance area. What is your take on the air filters? Yay or nay?
Hello. You seem to be an expert in the performance area. What is your take on the air filters? Yay or nay?
Absolutely not an expert but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night
Filters are a horses for courses kind of thing - there's some performance benefit. Usually 3,4 perhaps 5 BHP. Do the performance types let in more particulate? Yes. Will you ever experience the effects of that... well, hard to say, we may well all be driving electric cars before it becomes apparent.
As far as MAF fouling, there's zero basis to this apart from my own anecdotal experience and conjectures, however, the only instances I have ever come across of MAF contamination were after someone cleaned and re-oiled their filters. Undoubtedly OVER oiled their filters. You can clean them effectively most of the time just by blowing them out with an air gun.
Absolutely not an expert but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night
Filters are a horses for courses kind of thing - there's some performance benefit. Usually 3,4 perhaps 5 BHP. Do the performance types let in more particulate? Yes. Will you ever experience the effects of that... well, hard to say, we may well all be driving electric cars before it becomes apparent.
As far as MAF fouling, there's zero basis to this apart from my own anecdotal experience and conjectures, however, the only instances I have ever come across of MAF contamination were after someone cleaned and re-oiled their filters. Undoubtedly OVER oiled their filters. You can clean them effectively most of the time just by blowing them out with an air gun.
So if I was going to buy your tune, sport cats and pulley would you recommend BMC air filters as well? I can careless about the 3-5 HP but if there are other benefits then I want to make sure I make the right decision. Thank you!
As Unhingd mentioned, I'm guessing that coated filters aren't great? I remember buying a K&N for my C43, then hearing about the oil killing the mass airflow sensors. Probably same here? (BTW, anyone need a K & N for a C43? It's still sitting in my garage )
Edit - Nevermind... Saw Unhingd's post re: K & N/MAF after I posted about it. Not sure how to delete a post...
But I'll leave this part...
(BTW, anyone need a K & N for a C43? It's still sitting in my garage )
Dave, the weather is getting nice we gotta get your tune on that beast!
Thanks Stuart; getting close but still waiting for the street sweepers to finish.....probably insure it in the next week or two; book it for service and then I'll be calling...... :-)
I've spoken to at least half a dozen local car shops, most of whom work on exotics and so far every one of them has suggested BMC filters. Even the owners themselves use these filters in their own cars. When I asked about the oil issue they all said the same thing in regards to most people leaving too much oil on the filters which causes the issues. I've never felt so torn on which way to go!
Do they sell filters and airboxes? ;-)
Here's a couple things in point form;
- NOBODY can make a blanket statement that an aftermarket filter will increase power in every application; it depends on the car in question. Any different contention would make me seriously question the person uttering the statement.
- As Stuart said, typical gains may be 3,4 or maybe 5 HP.......as the expense of filtration. You are NEVER going to feel that little difference. Gone are the days when cars were so poorly designed that there are huge power increases for such minor changes.
- for a relatively inexpensive outlay, a good quality performance tune can add 50 - 100hp without any worry about your engine ingesting more particulates.....and that amount of power you CAN feel.
unless you're building a track monster where longevity is less of a concern, I'd stick with the stock filters myself.
It just seems like everything in regards to tuning is this grey area. Even something as simple as removing the engine cover to allow the engine to release more heat (I read through another thread on here) seems to have so many mixed opinions. Decisions decisions decisions... haha!
For those with the ECU tune how many miles have you put on the car since the tune and has anyone had any mechanical issues either now or in the past? Thanks for the feedback!
03-22-2017, 04:06 PM
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