+2

 

The Cliff's Notes version:

What matters is the records of Jaguar North America.

Get that straightened out, worry about Jaguar Driving Academy afterwards.

First clue:

More than likely a clerical error. But, JF can't fix that. Only the dealer or Jaguar North America.

 

Does a current Car Fax show you as the 1st owner or 2nd? With regards to the title, if you are not the original owner, than that in itself is a big deal, as it depreciates the value of your car significantly.

 

Does a current Car Fax show you as the 1st owner or 2nd? With regards to the title, if you are not the original owner, than that in itself is a big deal, as it depreciates the value of your car significantly. Really? Exactly how much does purchasing a car with 12 miles from a Jag dealership significantly depreciate your resale? are we talking 40%? 80% Is he sitting on a car that is only worth maybe $8K now? That would be significant. I think that is a HUGE stretch and this whole concern is blown way out of proportion. He can show that he has owned the car since mile 12. Perpetuating that gross exaggeration with no merit only makes the problem worse. There is absolutely zero truth to that statement.

Two things could have happened here:
#1 - like said above it was simply a clerical issue that the dealership should happily address taking their time to do
#2 - it is also possible that the dealership did, in fact, put the car into service on that date so as to get it off their book allotment. This is not a deceptive or new scheme

It seems the original poster is screaming that the sky is falling here with systematic deception. Sit down with either the GM and/or get Jag on the phone, explain your "concern" without the panic and it'll be taken care of quickly and easily. You've already stated how happy you are with the car but yet you're in a panic over such a minor issue I'd hate to see what you'd do if something actually went wrong. Handle like an adult looking for a way to get this minor concern taken care of versus someone hysterical with threats of returning the car or otherwise.

I've known this industry for some 25 years VERY well I can tell you these things happen as it does in whatever business you're in, go to them with a chance to look like the hero versus screaming/demanding attention with threats of "returning the car" and it'll work out... you'll get your driving experience. Tell them that all you are looking for is three things:
#1 - that this car purchase warranty reflect your purchase date so as not to incur any possible future warranty issues with the 42 days in question
#2 - that the car history show that you are, in fact, the only purchaser of the car, that it was never registered to another person or company. Get that in writing of course
#3 - that you want to qualify for your drivers experience ASAP

 

So very well stated.

 

leeeper has it right. I purchased my new car under similar circumstances except the in service date and my purchase date were 10 months apart. The car is new for all practical purposes. This was disclosed to me by the dealer, where nin this deal it was not. Leeeper has it right.

 

Really, significantly? 12 miles. Give me a break. As a car buyer, I wouldn't even consider it. Absolutely, ridiculous. Join the humane race and live the way people live. I think this whole thread is ridiculous, unreasonable and out of touch with how the real world works. Now if the car was in an accident and repaired the buyer would have something to cry about. There is nothing wrong with the car or anything that should make it less valuable or less enjoyable.

 

What's wrong with it is that it was advertised to come with the Driving Academy, and that advertisement was false. Simple concept. How wrong depends on how much the OP values that incentive. I would value it quite a bit, myself.

 

If the car history shows you are the 2nd owner, I'd be livid and return the car right away. Keep pressing for all 3 items, ownership history fixed, in service date, and the driving academy.

If all three aren't resolved to your satisfaction; just return the car. Enough of that dealership giving you the run around. They are the ones who should be jumping through hoops to fix this; no you.

 

I seriously doubt with 12 miles on the car this owner TEXASXKR is the 2nd owner. Impossible I say, and say no more.

Looking forward to seeing the outcome.

 

I bought my 2013 XKR last year from Braman Bentley, West Palm Beach with only 258 miles on it. It was originally sold by Jaguar Palm Beach, which is across the street. A 75 year old billionaire bought the car off the Jaguar dealership lot. Sold the car back to Jaguar and rebought it again. Then he traded it in on a new Bentley. When my car was being picked up from the Bentley dealership his Bentley was on the lot for sale again. Consequently, I'm the recorded third owner of my car which I bought with 258 miles on it. Does this bother me? Hell, no. I got a great car. A very rare find. The original owner took the new car depreciation hit and handed the car to me at a considerable discount. Being the paper third car owner of my car doesn't bother me at all. To me, and a lot of other realist, I'm the first owner. So what if I'm recorded on the carfax report as the third owner the car hasn't changed which is the subject of this conversation.


I was going to trade in my car for an AWD high performance car and the dealer loved the car and was willing to give me above fair market value on a fair market valued discounted car they had for sale. I asked them if they checked out the history of my car and they said, "we did, we are very happy with it". They wanted me to leave the Palm Beach plate frame and key tag with them. If a cars history can be traced to the original owner to show no accidents, no rental or lease history or something negative then the car stands on its own condition and should be valued as such. My car now has 5,000 miles on it, has never been driven in the rain, or during the winter and looks like new. Would you rather buy my car or an off lease car, same miles, which may have had several repairs, with no ownership pride and care, and who knows what abuse. The off lease car would show 1 owner and my car shows me as the third owner.

 

Thank you all for your advise and comments. I never had any idea that this forum with members that have been so helpful with their knowledge and advise could take on a life of its own. As it was my money that paid for the car based on the purchase order that we signed and having been told that the XKR that I purchased (I really do know the difference between a Xk series and a KXR series) would allow me to attend the Driving Academy this was a big deal to me. I am not a former race car driver and this is the first fun car (sports car) I have owned for over 35 years. I haver never complained about the mileage on the car as I also have bought several new cars and trucks that had well over 100 miles on them. What the dealer did was take the MSO that Jaguar provides and purchased the car from Jaguar I'm MARCH 31, 2014. This is a practice that is done by many dealers not just Jaguar. We bought the car on MAY 12, 2014 which was 42 days later as a new car. The problem was when I called the Driving Academy, Jaguar USA and another dealer in Dallas and gave them my Vin number and was then told the car was put in service on MARCH 31, 2014 and was considered by Jaguar to be a used car. The issue is this was never disclosed to us and that in fact is considered fraud. I am working with the dealership now and believe that we will be able to work through this. I guess unlike some I expect to get the full warranty on this car that I was told I would have 4 years or 50000 miles starting on May 12, 2014. This may not be important to some of you but it is to me. Again thank you all for your advice and when this is settled I will post the results. Once again NO buyers remorse as the XKR is a awesome machine that I enjoy every time I drive it,just expect to recieve what I paid for.

 

That's the long & short story right here. That is not considered fraud, it is fraud.

 

When you purchased the car did they give you a title or a certificate of origin? It would be considered used only if titled. There is a difference between a punched car sitting in inventory & a used car.

 

Texasxkr - I am in 100% complete agreement with you. The situation describe above IMHO constitutes a fraudulent act committed by the dealer. Right on!!!

 

FACTS: The OP (texasxkr) bought his "brand new" XKR based on the dealer's representations that (1) it was brand new and (2) it qualified for the Jaguar Driving Academy. As it turned out, neither (1) nor (2) was true since the dealer took title to the car prior to selling it to the OP, which disqualified it from the JDA.

ANALYSIS: It appears that the dealer committed fraud in the inducement, since the OP relied on the dealer's representations to close the deal and suffered economic harm as a result thereof, including (1) loss of value of the car since, ordinarily, a used car is worth less than a previously untitled new car and (2) loss of the free JDA experience, which otherwise costs $895 for Level 1. See: Performance Driving Academy: Level 1 Courses | Jaguar USA

In Texas, a contract entered into as a result of fraud in the inducement can be rescinded because there was never a meeting of the minds of the buyer and seller. See: Fraud and Fraudulent Inducement Claims in Dallas, Texas | Disclaimer: I am not a practicing attorney and have no interest in the law firm identified in the previous link.

CONCLUSION:
What should the OP do? Because the OP wants to keep the car, he has some leverage against the dealer who under no circumstances wants to unwind the deal, take the car back, and refund the OP's money. What other remedies are available to the OP? Keep the car and ...

1. CPO Warranty. Because the dealer was the first to take title to the car, it thereby became a used car eligible for CPO status. Many dealers do this for their service loaner cars so they can sell them as CPO cars with extended warranties. Jaguar has a great CPO warranty - it runs with the car and not the owner and is an additional 2 years after the new car warranty runs out up to 100,000 miles, whichever comes first. So, instead of a mere 4-year/50,000 mile factory warranty, the OP in in a position to get a 6-year/100,000 mile factory warranty at no charge. I recommend that the OP press the dealer to add the CPO warranty in lieu of voiding the contract. Having a CPO warranty adds value back to the OP's XKR.

2. Have the dealer pay for (or reimburse) the OP to attend the Jaguar Driving Academy.

Combining 1 and 2 would put the OP almost in the position he would have been in if the dealer's representations were true.

SUMMARY: Tell the dealer to CPO the car and pay for you to attend the JDA, otherwise, you will seek to rescind the deal, get your money back, and have him pay your attorney's fees.

If the dealer has any common sense, he will agree.

Just my

Stuart

 

So easy to throw the word "fraud" around. The car had 12 miles on it. It was not used. A premium car dealer like Jaguar does not make a living defrauding potential customer.

I doubt that any dealer would commit fraud like this to make a few bucks on a sale. The risk to the dealership could be enormous and costly. It was a 2013 MY bought in almost mid 2014, so I am sure the dealer sold the car at a great price to get it off the floor.

All the dealer has to do is make good for the JDA and the warranty and issue resolved.

This whole situation appears very strange to me. Sales contracts were signed. Any conversation between the 2 parties becomes a "He said, She said" thing.

Hopefully TEXASXKR will keep us posted. If the owner really considers this fraud, he should seek legal counsel, which I doubt that he will consider to bear the expense of attorney fees or litigation.

Best way is to contact the dealer, (owner, or GM). many times the owners are not present as they may reside out of state or own multiple dealerships.

Is so easy to determine when and if this car was registered to the dealer, as State agencies like the DMV report that information to companies like Carfax and Autocheck.

I already suggested that TEXASXKR ask the dealer to supply with the CarFax and AutoCheck reports as dealers pay Carfax and Autocheck for unlimited reports. These reports can be sent IMMEDIATELY to TEXASXKR for his review.

This should be his first starting point. He will know immediately. He can even spend the $39.99 tonight and get the report within minutes. But I bet he doesn't do that.

It apears that he may have failed to do this on my first suggestion. Never the less, I am sure there is some kind of mis-communication somewhere. As American consumers we tend to over react to many situations and this in my opinion is one of them.

So easy to throw "fraud" around and look at the negatives. In addition, it appears that the present owners took over 6 months to investigate and find this problem.

It will be most interesting to see the final resolve. My guess, the dealer doesn't shut down due to fraud allegations. My guess the dealer resolves the problem. TexasXKR gets to go to the JDA, which to me is no big deal at all.

If the owner wants to track his car for a few laps, he can do that anywhere.

This whole situation is quite wierd in my opinion. I am very interested to see what happens.

Just spend the $39.99 and buy the Carfax now!...tonight! Get with it.

 

Richard,

You miss the point. In the automobile industry, "New" means previously untitled, regardless of age or mileage. If a dealer takes title to a car with zero miles, it is no longer a "new" car and when it is sold the title is transferred to the new, second owner even if that car still has zero miles. It is now a used car with 2 previous owners. The mere fact that it now has 2 owners makes it worth less than an identical car that has never been titled.

If, as the Op stated, he has it in writing from a the dealer that it was "brand new" and was eligible for the complimentary Jaguar Driving Academy, it appears that the OP has a strong case for a "fraud in the inducement" cause of action against the dealer.

The OP has a gripe against the dealer. I'm just suggesting that a CPO warranty and trip to the JDA might remedy the situation, and provided the rationale to do so.

Stuart

 

I still want to know if he received a title or a certificate of origin. I will double check at work tomorrow, but I am pretty sure the warranty starts on any Jaguar after sitting in a dealers inventory more than 18 months. It used to be a year.

 

How do you personally know that the car was titled to more than one owner?
I doubt you even have that information.

The 2013 Jagaur XKR Coupe that TEXASXKR bought will suffer "massive" depreciation over the first two years, which all of us Jaguar owners know so well. So the alue regarding the titling has nothing to do with it.

I agree with the poster above. Did he get a title?

Show me the Carfax please. That will end any questions.

The State of Texas (DMV) reports to Carfax.

Interesting thread no doubt. I am sure it has allot of Jaguar owners quite interested. The old saying "inquiring minds want to know".

"Now for the rest of the story."