97' X100 82k miles just changed timing chain tensioners, slipper guides, timing chain and i took the fuel pump out craned it for 1 minute and started the vehicle and theres a nock and a squeek, suspecting its the idle pulley i removed the ancilary belt and now i removed the crankshaft. last night i stripped it all down to ask if you guys can maybe identify where i went wrong. i thin i may have put my slipper guides on backwards? is the slot on the secondary guides at the top?



turning the crankshaft clockwise by hand until i can lock them down




stopper for the cranshaft pulley




stopper for the cranshaft pulley










are the top slipper guides upside down, does the slot go to the top? so the chain guard rain is against the timing chain cover?








































1/2 tooth out of alignment?




1/2 tooth out of alignment?




1/2 tooth out of alignment?




1/2 tooth out of alignment?




1/2 tooth out of alignment?

 

I'm at the same point you are and it looks like we have the same timING kit. I have mine time and ready to reinstall timming cover. Because of your post I checked my guides for play. I noticed thar the guides with the tensioners have play in them. Especially the left, drivers, side. It seems like too much. If yours is the same this might be your problem.

I have to leave for work now but when I get back I'm going to do a little checking to see if this is a problem. Also looking at another motor I have here that the slot on the other guides should be on top, but when installing mine they wouldn't work the other way because the guide was too long. We may have problems with these guides. Harvest14 on X308 side of the forum used these guides a year ago. I'll contact him and see if he has any input.

This may not be the problem , let me research.

 

This is what concerns me. The pho to of yours showing the top of the inner guide drivers side. See if yours has a lot of play here. Also grab the guide at the bottom and see how much it moves in aND out. I don't know if the guide will move that much with the engine running. I checked another motor I have and it doesn't move that much. It has play but not to this extent.

 

I think you may have them them wrong way around- look up some pics on the ole Google and check, I don't see any pictures where the guides overlap, and yours seem to in the center. Maybe try flipping the straight ones to opposite sides?

I am sure folks that do this every day will chime in.

 

I believe dsnyder586 is correct about the chain guides. The elongated slot on the rail needs to be installed on the smooth peg, not fastened with the bolt. The chain guide 'ridge' should be on the inside (engine side) not the timing cover side.

The secondary tensioners are not identical, they need to be installed on the correct sides as they have different part numbers. The newer tensioners need shorter bolts as well. I can't really see the secondaries in the pics so check them.

bob

 

i didnt thin it would make it squeak and knock so bad




I read this is a pretty defined procedure it is well documentated and was very useful. black onyx. it also states outer guides the slot should be positioned at the top

 

ok, i am going to relocate the the chain guides so the slot is positioned on the smooth peg (top) and not fastened. thanks guys.

 

this is the noise with the current slipper guide and possible timing chain tensioner configuration

 

i have the shorter bolts, and the bolt spacing is offset (keyed) with the compression (spring pushing down) on the left and up on the right. i think....

 

Motorcarman, I tried to fit the guides in the reversed position as this member did aND because of the lenght of the guides, from a lincoln ls, they were right up against the VVT sprocket and put the chain in a bind.

I'm starting to think we need to use guides made for a Jaguar aND not a Lincoln. I don't think the Lincoln has VVT so it would have more room for the longer guides. Also the guide on the studed post I showed earlier in this post has too much play. I'm going to order the Jaguar guides and I think this will solve the problem.

 

Got back to my shop and I turned the guide around. The first photo shows it in place and you can see how it is too long and is up against the VVT sprocket. Second photo shows origional and the one I'm attempting to fit. The new one is 1 1/2" longer.
Just ordered a new set from Jaguar of Sacramento for $140 and I get them tomorrow. I know I might find a cheaper price online but I want to get this car running.

Does anybody have a trick on keeping the primary tensioners retracted when I take the guides off. I understand that the are ratcheted and you can't retract them afterwards.

 

The primary tensioners can be retracted by moving the little lever and re-installing the golf-tee looking pin to lock it retracted. Use a vise with some padding and go slow.

Those Ford guide parts look REALLY LONG!!!!! I've never tried them so I guess I WON"T.

bob

 

Yes they are long. I tried to save a nickel but it cost me a dime.

Thanks for the procedure to retract the tensioners. Only problem is I had some free time yesterday waiting for parts and I cleaned up my shop. Looks like I'm going dumpster diving to recover the tees.

When I finish this project I will make a list of what Lincoln LS parts work and which ones don't.

 

The kit I ordered was a Jaguar specific kit, not the Lincoln kit. Even so, the guides went up closer to the VVT than the old ones, if I remember correctly. It also seems to me that the early years (97 to 99 maybe?) used a different kit. Maybe not, it has been almost a year since I did that job.

I used zip ties to hold the secondary tensioners in place when I had to remove the chain later.

 

Dan02xk8, sorry if I stole your thread but I wanted to keep it here so you could benefit from the discussion. Looks like we both have the same kit and problem. I really appreciate your posting today because I was about to put my timing cover back on and I would probably have the same issue.

Thanks again

 

Thank you for your input and help, do you think i could machine the difference off of the new slipper guides? i'm thinking hacksaw with a fine tooth blade, should i consult the guy on ebay for replacement which are correct.

 

I dont know what to do, i might just put the old ones back on for a bit, seeing as i've become quite adept at the mechanics and there not in bad shape, it was actually the compression on the left bank primary tension adjuster which failed on my car, but i wanted to make it right, only 82k miles full Jaguar service history im the 3rd owner. can you explain regarding the re compression of "ratcheted" tension adjusters, do they twist back into there housing once the little lever has unlocked whatever stopping mechanism is in there?

 

I would use the old ones, if they don't show any signs of cracking or deterioration, instead of cutting the new ones. New is preferred but if it's not in the budget use the old ones. As I understand quite often the tensioners are changed only. My guides I took off are cracked badly so I don't want to reuse them.

Can you give me the name of the maker of your kit and the part number so we can make it known to the forum so others won't make the same mistake we did.

Thanks Bob

I forgot about resetting the tensioners. I was going to follow Motorcarman's procedure closely. I have never done it but I'm sure he has and he would probably know better than anyone else.

 

Dan, if you put the old ones in how about taking pictures after you do that. I find this extremely interesting.

 

Well I got my chain guides from three dealer and you guessed it. They are the exact same ones that were in the kit. I told the parts man that it was for a 2000 xk8. But he knew from me being there before that the block is a 03 4.2L. He checked before he ordered that the part and numbers for both were the same. So back to the dealer and I took the old ones so we could match them up.

Told parts man that these guides don't work or I don't know how to put them on. Suggested he find me a mechanic or service manager who can show me how these will fit my engine.

Parts man did some research and found an older part number for 4.0L engine. He tried to find photos of the guides in his database. He couldn't find it so I did a Web search on my phone and found photos of his older part numbers. And they were the ones I need. His database showed these part numbers only till '99. So I ordered them and they will be here on Saturday morning.

Did some more research and found that older guides go to engine build date 8/12/01. But the engine block I'm working on has a build date of 08/23/02. I don't understand it but if you have the shorter guides order ones for a 98 and you should get the right ones.

The correct part numbers:
To engine date 08/12/01
NCA1988AB
NCA2025AB
These are the shorter guides.

After engine date 08/13/01
C2A1456
C2A1497

Did a little more research and I could only find SNG Barratt with a kit with the shorter style guides. Part number TCK8MAJ/1 for about $550. The more cost effective way would be to get a 2000 Lincoln LS 3.9 for around $200, TK4162, and buy the guides from Sng for about $30 ea × 4 = $120.

Hope this helps. I spent a week trying to get the parts figured out. Maybe it will save somebody else a wasted week.