So, after about 2 weeks of research I found a place that will not only rebuild superchargers, but also do rotor re-coating. For those who don't know, the rotors inside the supercharger have a Teflon coating from the factory. The coating serves as a seal basicly, so when they turn they don't have blow by similar to a piston ring and skirting. After aging the rotors will start to flake or when using E85 it eats away at the coating pretty aggresively.OK, so here's the deal, the average price for rotor coating is about 300$ plus shipping. The place I found has a guy in Colorado that only does superchargers, the majority is cobras and lightning's which is the same supercharger used on the STR & XKR (Eaton M-112). These guys have rotors already coated, you send yours in, they ship the new ones out as soon as they get yours, total price...$150 + shipping. The people are quick to respond, very knowledgeable, and very kind. Here's an E-mail they sent with all the prices just in case you need coating and gears timed, snout rebuild, or needle bearing.

Rebuild snout and rotor pack and timing $150.00
Internal parts for snout/rotor pack $149.00 which includes all new snap ring, snout seal, snout front and rear bearings, snout coupler, rotor pack bearings and seals, needles bearings, gasket maker and 8 oz. of supercharger oil.
Coated Rotors $150
Shipping back to you $25.00

That would be the total for everything stated here. You would send it to;
SPINNINGWHEELS-WEST
ATT; MIKE
5490 W. ONTARIO AVE
LITTLETON, CO. 80128

He will get it done as quick as possible. I will send him your request and ask for the time line for delivery back to you. I will let you know when I hear back from you.

Thanks and take care,
Victor and Diane

Hope this helps someone

 

Brett @ Jokerz Performance.

He is the eaton guru. Just google his work or find him on FB.

Really nice guy with loads of experience. Very good reputation.

 

Interesting. Can you say where that info came from? E85 has been discussed many times in this forum, but I don't recall ever hearing that before.

 

Dupe

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/p...oating-140708/

No Jag runs on E85, nor does the fuel pass through the supercharger.

Having the rotors recoated for $300 plus labour sounds like an expensive way of regaining minimal HP.

 

E85 is right way to go. We have XJRs using it.

 

News to me- it would be an aftermarket modification, not factory stock. I wasn't aware that E85 was sold in Europe

Using E85 here, if you can find it, is a money-losing effort. The price is never low enough to offset the loss of mileage.

Still doesn't address the issue of wear on the rotors.

 

I was just sharing info that I found in my experiences. Mikey has trolled me from post to post about this. Is there an issue with posting some prices from a specific person because of site sponsorship or something? And just because an application is not common amongst 65 year olds in the biz, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist or isn't practical. I'll post a pic of an engine and how it's being done now days as opposed to traditional applications, and then a pic of our 200 mph 1/4 mile car that went mid 6's with Nitrous injected befofore the twin turbos. I was trying to help the newer folks, as some of the moderatorsand Admins here helped me when I first bought my STR. As far as alcohol and E85, it's aggressive in it's chemical makeup and will eat Teflon. As far as minimal horsepower loss, you have no idea what you're talking about Mikey. In the m112 with uncoated rotors you loose a ton on the bottom end not to mention what's called rotor clatter which sounds like a broken coupler. In the sale section at the bottom of my relpy to Mikey I left links to companies that specialize in these applications. Apparently he becomes illiterate after reading E85 so I'll do it here to with some additional links. Thanks for the support XJR-99, you didn't have to chime I but I'm glad you did. Moderator or not, you don't have to troll people or just knock what anyone says because that s not what you do.

 

I'm curious from a technical point of view, hardly 'trolling'.

You're promoting a repair process for a problem that is virtually unknown on these cars, caused (supposedly) by an engine modification that might be done on maybe 1 in 50,000 cars.

If so, it's worth helping 'the newer folks' know that this is not a standard or routine part of owning an S-type.

The mods, not me, will decide if a post breaks the rules about selling stuff.

 

Injecting before the turbos or at the intercooler

The link to car & driver

The Physics of Injectables: Hypodermic Horsepower ? Feature ? Car and Driver

Link to E85 injection system for supercharger

DRS SC Pre-Injection Kit 30+ Hp Increase

A link to alcihol injectionsystems.com

Water injection for Vortech supercharger & ProCharger Supercharger

And the lightning forum which Cobras and lightnings use an M112

Stripped Rotors vs Coated? [Archive] - Lightning Forum | LightningRodder.com

And to answer your question Mkey, yes, I know street and professional racers who use e85 and alcohol spayed before supercharger or turbocharger. And we raced professionally NMCA with Tweaked II and nitrous before our our huge turbos.





Lawrence and Chris Conley in front of Tweaked II





And original Tweaked, fastest single turbo car in the nation

 

First of all, I'm not promoting anything, as it's not my business or anyone I know. I shared factual info that you continually rejected, and which I stated was general in nature. I have studied, researched, and compiled plenty of data on the subject, not only for myself, but for others too. I don't use methanol or E85, but it has been shown to eat upt Teflon coating on rotor packs. So now I ask you, if not to troll or objectively deminish my post, what's wrong with informing others, even if 1 in 50,000, of the damage that can unknowingly be done? I searched, found a good price, good turn around, and quality work being done and gave someone props for it. Some people do their own work, or try to and it would appear as though the rotors are covered in carbon and the pulley is hard to turn when the belt is removed. If you clean the coating off, the pulley turns really easy especially when you replace all the seals and bearings. And again, if not to troll why follow to a second post and again make smartass comments? What difference is it to you whether or not Someone is informed? Fact- rotors are Teflon coated from factory.
Fact- coating does flake over time and will get sucked in
Fact- alcohol and e85 injection is real,not used as a fuel source (which is where you obviously miss the point) but rather a cooling agent.
Fact- it does deminish longevity of the coating
Fact- it is used in race applications and street apps
Fact- you can run uncoated rotors but it will deminish low end HP and torque by 18 to 20 HP dyno proven by fastlabs
Fact- your intensive questioning of myself only reflects that you're either behind times, don't care for yourself or others to learn something new or money saving, or that you have a very poor attitude towards others or the ability to research it yourself.

I sent the rotors off today, I have before pics and I'll post after pics, the vehicle was experiencing rotor clatter due to stripped coating and loss of low end power. I expect to see nominal gains in HP and torque low end and quieting of the rotors at all RPMs. If you had a question that's fine, especially if you're unfamiliar with something. Don't be the clown you were and come off as knowing everything, "no jag runs e85 and you wouldn't spray anything into a supercharger." And for a problem that is unknown on these cars, why would Eaton recommend it after certain mileage? Unknown to you maybe, not to those who can turn a wrench. And because of the unknown is the exact reason I posted it. There, I taught you something you didn't know. Now you can see what shape yours are in....you're welcome.

Here's an IDEA...... Read a book! Or, a link for that matter.
Plenty of professionals doing this and plenty of professional companies make a kit for it.

I bet the first guy who heard about nitrous said the same thing. Aaaahhhh nitrous, you can't do that.

 

Your initial posts were sparse on background info, confusing and misleading- not just to me if you read the other replies.

Now you just sound angry. Have a nice day.

 

Below are pics of rotors that are flaking on the blades edge, what the carbon buildup looks like, and the rotors cleaned up before being sent for recoating. Just for knowledge sake, this supercharger had never been opened up, never had E85 or alcohol through it, and definitely no nitrous. This is a 2003 STR that is all stock, coatings won't last forever and time is the enemy. I posted to save time and heartache for those who will eventually face the same thing. No, it's not routine maintenance but I did find it helpful to know about recoating and the prices. If you didn't know, maybe I helped. If you are unsure, I've posted several links. If its not a problem for you Mikey, why bother with me? I hope people get some useful knowledge about the superchargers out of it. I also understand that if you choose to rebuild your charger that the gears have to be timed and I think it has to be a certain way. You can change the snout bearings and seal without pulling the gears but there is a bearing behind the gears also. If this bearing is changed you will need the gears timed. If anyone has any questions you can pm me, or mentioned near the beginning of the post someone referenced a Eaton guru with his info as well.

 

Sparse??? Others who commented?
One person said
" interesting where did you find the E85 info"

Another disputed you and said
"E85 is the way to go"

You said
"no jag runs e85 nor is a fuel passed through a supercharger"

Are you dillusional or just have a short memory?
I provided clear cut data, links, and dyno sheets on these links, yet you say I sound angry and you were the first to comment on both my posts with just a straight up you're stupid kid "no jag runs on e85 nor does a fuel pass through a supercharger." You didn't inquisitively ask a curious question, you stated what you know as fact. Guess what, you're wrong.
I responded cordialy the first time thinking you just might not know and it was curiosity until you replied shitty again and followed me to a second post. What's your goal? You want the post down? You want me to go away? Tell me, I'll do it as long as you stop!

Oh, and have a nice day.

 

Calm down guys.

 

Yes, several links have been posted now. I tried to find the most informative ones. It seems as though the cobra and lightning guys talk more about it and I included that link in a reply to another member in the post. It the lightningrodder link and the info on the E85 is an DRS injection kit. I'll update with anything else I find.

DRS E85 Pre-Injection kit - LotusTalk - The Lotus Cars Community

 

Still interesting, and informative too.

Kevlar, I for one never realized that supercharger rotor blades were teflon-coated, that alcohol attacked teflon or that cooling materials were injected into the airflow ahead of the supercharger, and all this possibly on an '03 STR. It's nice to know what goes on at the absolute cutting edge, even if I don't belong there.

So I thank you for that, and have one (possibly dumb) question...

What might be the power difference between injecting water and E85 and, in any event, does the standard ECU adjust to this injection, or is special tuning required?

 

On it's own, virtually nothing other than from a minor reduction of air inlet temperature. Maybe 1% power increase on a hot day.

Water/meth (or E85) injection might allow additional ignition advance on engines that are otherwise detonation inhibited or help avoid pre-ignition issues in other borderline cases but the liquid itself does not make 'more power'.

The STR engines do not suffer from detonation or pre-ignition issues on standard pump fuel. The injection modification is intended for 1/4 mile drags on cars where other engine modifications have also been incorporated, not the standard cruising that 99% of owners use the cars for.

 

This.

I would say 99.99999999999% of people on the S-Type forums do not use some sort of pre-supercharger injection (Nitrous, Meth, E85) so focusing on HAVING to get your lobes re-coated because of E85 is a bit misleading if you don't really read into it. Even running straight E85 is going to ruin your lobe teflon, its only if it is a pre-injection device. I am glad we got that straightened out

 

Thanks Robinb, you were part of the target audience. The people who just want to learn more. The link I put up earlier to DRS is seeing Dyno results of 30+ HP with their E85 pre injection systems and claims to do it with a hot air or non intercooled car. It sounds substantial to me considering the first few Bolt on's is where you see the most horsepower gains for the cheapest price. Those being generally cold air intake, exhaust, etc. After those mods you normally don't hear of substantial gains of 30 or 40 HP in a single mod. Even stated on Mina and eurotoys, a supercharger port and polish with ecu tune is somewhere around 45 HP and you pay a boat load like $1500 I think. So people have developed ways to gain decent power for around 1/3 the price. A snow performance Methanol kit for the stage 2 or 3 is like $6-800 free shipping and easy to install with a trunk mount tank and all the hardware. A stage 1 can be had for even less, its just dependent on what you want to do. The timing retard is not an issue, another member here, Jameson Kilpatrick is spraying nitrous at a 200 shot and the car adjust accordingly on its own through the ECU. Hes been pouring a lot of time into it and suggested retarding the timing for anything over a 200 shot. That being said, I dont think a little Methanol before the charger would require timing retard. Even if not running one of these applications, the coting will and does still flake off just like mine did, and its the reason I delved into it so deep. If youre doing supercharger maintenance like bearings, check the coating. The coating alone has proven 18 hp over chipped, flaking, or just stripped rotors, and thats straight from fastlabs. As stated beforehand, and cleared up by the above user, its being used as a cooling agent rather than a fuel and I believe that E85 is injected on its own. When speaking of Methanol however, water is an additive. I could be wrong, but the post started as a simple info bit that I learned after pulling my supercharger out to replace bearings and seals. Noticed the rotors were flaking and decided to look into it. Like you, I don't use E85 or alcohol injection, I threw that in for the off chance someone might be who's reading it.

 

Sorry, kept saying fastlabs and its thehighspeedlab.com
And the specialize in rotors and coatings. I save some of you the time and they back it up and its under warranty...here ya go,


Our Performance-Maximizing Rebuild Services
are performed with Premium replacement parts and materials.

Embree Specialty Machine is a High-Performance Supercharger Research and Development Machine Shop. The High Speed Lab is our online store. We offer Supercharger Rebuild Services for ALL Eaton M-Series Superchargers. Some of our ESM Premium Services include replacing the rotor assembly bearings and seals, then retiming the rotors. With this Rotor Assembly Rebuild Service, you can ADD-ON our High-Tech Rotor Coating Service. Also available for damaged Eaton rotor bores we offer Internal Rotor Bore Case Coating Services. ESM Eaton M-Series supercharger rebuild services include a 1-year Warranty.

Maximize your supercharger’s performance potential by adding our High-Tech Coating to any of our Rotor Assembly Rebuild Services. ESM uses these special coatings to tighten up the case-to-rotor clearances. Does that mean we offer Rotor Coating Services for your Eaton supercharger? To answer your questions; Yes we re-coat all Eaton rotors. Our Internal Rotor Bore Case Coating Services are designed to control heat and can be used to repair scratches and some gouges on damaged internal rotor bores. This Case Coating service is available with all of our Supercharger Rebuild Services that include replacing the rotor needle bearings. Both these coating services give blower owners more choices to rebuild to their specific application.

Yes, we are aware of the black coating on the Gen5 Eatons. It is a rubbery interference fit coating that wears in over time to establish the correct clearences for the rotors and case. Our coating is different than this. Ours is similar to the coating applied to piston skirts.

Compared to uncoated rotors, this special coating process significantly reduces metal-to-air heat-transfer. It also gives air a much smoother surface to pass over, creating less friction, thereby requiring less supercharger drive horsepower. That puts more horsepower to the rear wheels, where it belongs.

When we are preparing your supercharger for the coating process, we check the assembled supercharger's clearences first. Then we coat to achieve the correct clearences with our multi-layered dual coating process. After the rotors are coated, during reassembly, the rotors are set to optimum clearences related to your case. We can rebuild part or all of the supercharger, depending upon what is needed to bring it back to operating status. The rotor assembly will need to be rebuilt in order to coat the rotors. Here is a link to our Eaton Service Price List.
http://www.thehighspeedlab.com/Eaton_Price_List.html

There are two distinct coatings applied. The first coating is TLMB, a polymer for adhesion and wear-resistance. This coating will not scuff if the rotors make light contact at high RPM. The second coating is TLML, which is fused to the first coating. The second coating is slippery and will not gall. It provides a slick surface for the air to slide over to reduce friction and heat. The clearance between the rotor flutes and case tightens up because of the coating’s .005 thickness. Leakage is reduced, increasing the roots-type supercharger’s efficiency. Minor scratches can be rejuvenated with coating, as well. These coatings and the application process are supplied by JCM Machine & Coating. www.JCMmachine.com