You will get better fuel economy using gas without ethanol. Ethanol contains a significant amount of oxygen which produces very little power compared to the oxidation of hydrogen and carbon.

Shell V Power 91 contains no ethanol in Canada.

 

Would you be in a position to explain the failure mode? Such events are traditionally caused by seizure of the big end bearing due to lack of lubrication. I've heard anecdotal stories of two stroke carbs and fuel systems suffering indirectly from ethanol, but never internal engine damage.

 

With incorrect fuel air ratio not allowing for oxygenated gas the engine would run very lean. That would very likely seize a two stroke in short order. The conrod failure would be inevitable. Often when the engine block cools down after the seizure the true cause isn't evident without careful examination of the internals.

 

I'm surprised. On a stock motor in good condition, the fuel air ratio is so far on safe (rich) side of stochiometeric that plug fouling is more likely than piston seizure, especially at part throttle operation. This is done to accommodate for variations in fuel that occur even in pure gas, errors in oil fuel mixing/injections rates, etc etc. Two strokes are still very popular in the snowmobiling crowd, engine problems due to the use of E10 are unheard of.

I guess it's moot point now however.

 

Just noticed this thread today.. I live in central Ontario, Canada and most of the major fuel companies sell the 91 octane without any ethanol. The lower grades are generally, 5% and then lower again at 10% ethanol.
Shell for instance, has stated that they have 87 octane at 10% ethanol and they blend in some 91 to make the next grade up and then 91 is pure gas.
On our ranch, we buy 91 for any of our older or small engines, and my Jaguar gets the 91 as well, of course.
I'm all for ending the subsidy on corn made ethanol, but good luck with that one.
Lawrence.

 

There is no 89 gas. The mid grade is just a 50/50 blend of 87 and 91 made right at the pumps, only two tanks underground.

There never has been "pure" gasoline as that never existed.

Gasoline is a blend of various petrochemicals to begin with. Since at least the invention of tetra ethyl lead additives no "gasoline" has been sold anywhere in the industrial world.

Naptha gasoline is used for camping fuel etc and is as pure as you get, do not put "white gas" in your engine.

Ethanol is fine to burn in your engine it is the fuel delivery system you worry about. ALL modern fuel tanks and lines are ethanol compatible up to 10% ethanol.

As far as I know only Shell 91 is ethanol free in Canada.

 

Huh?

Three way catalysts cannot work without fuel air .ratios oscillating from lean to rich around stochiometric.

The only time a modern engine runs really rich is at full throttle (defined as more than 75% open).

In fact, the O2 sensor feedback sends signals to the ECU to oscillate the O2 content of exhaust from rich to lean to alternately catalyze CO and N2

 

Mikey was replying in the context of 2 stroke engines presumably blowing up due to going lean. If they are controlled 2 strokes, they won't go lean anyway, will they?

I gotta tell you, if e-10 caused problems for Jaguars, there would be a bunch of broke Jags here in Georgia, since it is nearly impossible to get non ethanol gas anywhere but the marina dock!

 

Exactly.

 

And I wasn't so we were quoting and commenting at cross purposes.

Sorry about that.

So, modern four stroke car engines run at stochiometric most of the time, on average by oscillating to lean and to rich in a pulse pattern monitored by the O2 sensor inputs to the ECU.

Modern 2 strokes burn oil.....just like they always did and will soon be museum pieces.

 

I'm surprised that they're still being made at all.

 

Well, I am sure you two know this, but a 2 stroke give more power for the same displacement since it fires on each downstroke- at the expense of fuel efficiency and emissions. But "mo power" is good too, sometimes!