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Hi there fellow jag owners, I have an X300 3.2 with a weep around the pinion bearing, I’ve had a lot done to the car to get it upto perfect and this is the last niggle. It’s being done by a mechanic I trust but don’t think he’s done one on a jag before, I’m hoping I can get some advice on here!
I’m getting the parts for him as I’m sure the usual suppliers won’t stock them at such a good price as I can get online given a bit of notice, so firstly I wanted to know what parts are required, is it just a pinion seal? What other parts are likely to be needed? Also what oil should I get, wanted to use Castrol but are these cars limited slip or not?
I’ve read that a blocked breather pipe on the diff can cause it to force out around the pinion seal so was wondering are these easy to unblock and how?
Finally but most importantly is there any advice you guys would give the mechanic that makes changing the pinion seal different on a jag compared to other cars?
There is a TSB on removing the bearing retainer Jaguar # JLM615 as it must be destroyed to remove
The vent comes off from the inside of the rear cover with a certain square drive .
The torque bits on the outside of the seal in question are the more rugged torque plus
The job can be done without removing the whoke differental
There are some marks on the Diff to say if it's a LSD or not . Do you have a set of 3.77 Crownwheel and pinion gears for I don't need the whole differential ?
You might try cleaning the vent and see if that stops the weep ( no more pressure pushing the oil out ) and keep the original seals and bearings in place for ever how much service life left in them . Something about the different greases are not compatible ( ? ) .
Don't go cheap with a Ebay kit for there is one available .
Last edited by Lady Penelope; 04-07-2018 at 05:08 PM.
Hi there fellow jag owners, I have an X300 3.2 with a weep around the pinion bearing,...
Hi Jagguyx300,
Is your mechanic planning to replace the pinion seal with the differential still in the car by disconnecting the driveshaft/propshaft and removing the pinion locknut and companion flange? If so, it is critical that the orientation of the locknut and pinion shaft be carefully marked with a center punch so the nut can be returned to its exact position. The nut is torqued under great force to compress a crush sleeve that establishes the preload on the pinion bearings, and there is no easy way to recheck the preload with the diff in the car and the axles attached, so the only way to reestablish the preload is to mark the position of the nut to the shaft and return it to its original position.
On the rear cover is a striped label. On our diff, it was yellow and red stripes. If you have a black line or black X through the stripes, you have an LSD.
Off the top of my head, I think the original gear oil spec was 90W. I have successfully used the Lucas conventional 85W-140 and their synthetic 75W-90 and 75W-140, all available at many auto parts stores.
Do you have any differential noise that may indicate the pinion bearings are failing, such as a whine when you lift your foot off the accelerator pedal?
Hi and Thankyou lady Penelope and Don for your quick responses, have looked at the tsb lady Penelope, are those the four parts I need; oil seal output shaft (jlm12138) o-ring output shaft (jlm621) bearing output shaft (jlm11527) and retainer (jlm615)?
The mechanic is planning on doing it with the diff still on the car, there is no whine from the rear but the weep is constant. What is the best way to clear the breather and can it be replaced as I can’t seem to find that part?
I was looking to order the above parts from British parts but they recommend I need 2 of each part, is that correct? Thanks again
There is the thing about one bearing going bad puts debris into the whole system getting over to the other bearing and compromising that side as well . So it's a juggement and money call . You don't have any bearing noise so I would lean toward 0 bearings at this time and see if you have a weep later as new oil can rejuvenate seals sometimes .
Yes on the part #s
The vent is apparently NA and I think I saw one cleaned from the outside with carb cleaner and poking with a toothbrush's brisels
Hi and Thankyou lady Penelope and Don for your quick responses, have looked at the tsb lady Penelope, are those the four parts I need; oil seal output shaft (jlm12138) o-ring output shaft (jlm621) bearing output shaft (jlm11527) and retainer (jlm615)?
The mechanic is planning on doing it with the diff still on the car, there is no whine from the rear but the weep is constant. What is the best way to clear the breather and can it be replaced as I can’t seem to find that part?
I was looking to order the above parts from British parts but they recommend I need 2 of each part, is that correct? Thanks again
Hi Jagguyx300,
Those are parts for the output shafts, part 9 in the diagram, not the pinion shaft, part 22. If your weep is at the pinion shaft, where the driveshaft connects, then you need the pinion oil seal, part 6, part number CBC6923:
The vent has a plastic cap on the outside that snaps on and may break when you try to pry it off, but if you can get the cap off you can run a pipe cleaner through the vent and flush it with brake cleaner before draining the old oil from the diff. If the plastic cap or part of the vent pipe breaks, you can attach a piece of vinyl tubing (off the top of my head I think the vent pipe is about 1/2 - 5/8 inches in diameter). Run the tubing down to the underside of the car, tie it in place with zip ties, and trim it an inch below the subframe undersurface. This will allow diff air pressure to be relieved through the vent but prevent debris from entering the diff.
I would advise that the pinion seal should be PACKED with fresh grease (on the inside) to keep the seal spring from dislodging during installation. The hammer strikes on the seal driving tool can cause the spring to fall out of it's groove.
I witnessed a young mechanic replace the 15HU pinion seal and saw the little spring swinging on the pinion shaft after driving the seal 'home'.
He went to the parts dept. and got ANOTHER SEAL. After tapping the seal in, he noticed the same thing had happened with the second seal. He was screaming mad!!!!
I walked over and he told me what happened. I told him to pack the back side of the seal with GREASE and the spring will stay in place.
He got ANOTHER seal from the parts dept and installed the seal as I advised.
Success!!!!
[left]Hi there fellow jag owners, I have an X300 3.2 with a weep around the pinion bearing, I’ve had a lot done to the car to get it upto perfect and this is the last niggle. It’s being done by a mechanic I trust but don’t think he’s done one on a jag before, I’m hoping I can get some advice on here!
You received a lot of good advice. I'll add my own....but you probably won't like it !
Unless you're absolutely, positively sure that your mechanic will do the job absolutely, positively correctly.....don't do it at all. Live with the 'weep' instead. Done incorrectly there is a strong possibility of bearing problems down the road.
Years ago, in a prior life in the car repair world, I worked on a research project with an extended warranty company involving a couple hundred cars needing pinion bearing replacement and/or differential overhaul. I can't remember the *exact* statistics but the majority of them...like 70-75%, I seem to recall.... had pinion seal replacements within the last 12,000 miles. Further investigation revealed that quite a few cases involved the job being assigned to technicians who were not qualified....they really didn't understand the process or grasp that precision is required. But, even well experienced technicians didn't always 'get it right' despite their best efforts.
I'm NOT trying to cast aspersions or disparage auto repair technicians, mind you. Just speak with your mechanic, as diplomatically as possible, in an effort to gauge his experience and confidence level.
I suspect Bob (Motorcarman), who as decades of experience, will agree that an incorrectly done pinion seal job can cause problems down the road and he's probably witnessed some fellow technicians bollix things up despite best efforts.
A gushy, dripping leak is one thing. A mere 'weep' is another. I'd do some risk-versus-benefit analysis, personally.
Just my two cents; sorry if I come off as being alarmist
Cheers
DD
Last edited by Doug; 04-08-2018 at 06:27 PM.
Reason: sp
Hello and Thankyou again for all your very helpful responses, I’m obviously a novice I’m afraid as yes it’s the pinion oil seal I need and not the parts for the output shaft.
Which other parts will need changing when the pinion oil seal is replaced? Is it parts 2 4 5 and 6 Don or others as well? I will have a word with the mechanic about how he feels about doing it as I know him quite well.
Again sorry for my ignorance previously as it’s definitely the pinion seal leaking.
Thankyou everyone
Last edited by Jagguyx300; 04-08-2018 at 02:05 PM.
The ONLY thing you should replace with the diff 'in-situ' is the seal. (not the crush sleeve or outer bearing) The shaft and nut should be marked as Don B stated.
I have replaced a dozen or so pinion bearing sets but that requires diff removal and disassembly. A 'high-pitched' whine from the diff indicates faulty pinion bearings.
A lower pitched growl is usually the stub axle or wheel hub bearings.
If all you have is a pinion leak, then just replace the seal.
Thankyou so much to everyone for their advice.
As for diff oil I know that Shell Spirax 90 was recommended but this has been discontinued, I phoned my local jaguar dealer and they said they can get the oil (or whatever there system recommends) but it costs £44 for 2 litres! What oil do you guys suggest? Am I right in thinking that it’s ok to use diff oil with limited slip additive in any diff regardless of whether it’s limited slip or not?
Many many thanks.
What oil do you guys suggest? Am I right in thinking that it’s ok to use diff oil with limited slip additive in any diff regardless of whether it’s limited slip or not?
The Lucas oils I mentioned earlier will all work well, and a local diff rebuilder told me that no LSD additive is required with Lucas gear oils. The viscosity of conventional 90W gear oil is typically 15 cSt at 100 degrees C, so any good gear oil with a similar or higher viscosity at 100C should be fine, 75W-90, 80W-90, 75W-140. Castrol, Mobil 1 and Valvoline are other popular brands available in many auto parts stores. Boutique brands like Redline Oil and Amsoil are quality products too, but not stocked in most local stores.
Thankyou everyone for your excellent advice and help, have ordered the seal and was going to use Castrol Axle Z Limited Slip 90 which meets the original jaguar spec, don’t know if anyone knows this oil but hopefully a good choice. Many thanks again for all your advice, I will pass some on to the guy doing my car.
After a couple of attempts at cleaning the differential breather on my 97 VP, I am still getting a slight weep from the driveshaft pinion seal. At the moment I am monitoring the leak and contemplating whether to go ahead an replace the seal, or wait and see how it does over time.
In anticipation of doing the job myself with the differential in the car, I have some questions about the job.
I suspect the only part I will need is the seal (CBC6923).
1, Is the general advice to use the genuine Jaguar part, or are the aftermarket parts just as worthy? (genuine=$88 - after market=$17 with SNG Barrett)
2, What is the size of the pinion locknut and would just a socket work or should I get a wrench as well?
3, I would have to support the car on jack stands with the jack supporting the subframe. Is this enough to properly secure the car while torqueing up the locknut?
4, Do I need to prevent the wheels from turning while torqueing up the locknut? If so, what is the best method?
5, There is heavy/hard build up of oil and dirt around the seal which I would like to clean up, are there any recommendations on how to remove it?
I suspect it's just a matter of when mine properly fails so preparing for the worst..
Thanks in advance.
If you just have a slight weep I would tend to agree with xalty that it would be better to just live with it and keep your diff fluid topped up. Getting the bearing preload correct again after removing the pinion nut can be tricky, and if you don't get it right, the incorrect preload can lead to bearing failure, which will require removing the diff for a rebuild. If you really want to go through with it, be absolutely certain to mark the pinion nut and pinion shaft with a center punch so you can return the nut to its exact position or just very slightly tighter than it is now. Don't use paint because it can too easily wipe off.
Thanks for the replies.
It makes sense to keep an eye on it for now anyway as it's not a big leak. I would be wary of getting it all back together correctly with the correct torque, maybe easier with a lift.
There are no noises or signs of other seals having problems, so I'll leave the worms in the can for now.
I might give it a clean anyway so I can keep better track of things.
Good to know it needs a 36mm deep socket, just in case.
04-07-2018, 03:22 PM
Advice on pinion seal and oil
