XJS ( X27 ) 1975 - 1996 3.6 4.0 5.3 6.0

Another Marelli Ignition Caused Engine Fire?

  #41  
Old 05-15-2018, 04:40 PM
JigJag's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,331
Received 580 Likes on 361 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by bladerunner919
Wow, if you can detect a pause in the pulses you have my respect. If the car is ilding at 1000rpm (and it's probably more like 1200 when cold) each bank of 6 is exhausting spent gas 50 times per second, so you're detecting a 1/50th of a second pause from a single missing cylinder!

Correct me if I'm wrong, but at idle ( 700 RPM here ) the engine is turning 11 RPSecond. And that results in 11 exhaust pulses per second. 5.5 per bank. At least this correlates to my experience.

One thousand one, one thousand two.
ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft.

Meh, close to that anyway.
 
  #42  
Old 05-15-2018, 06:03 PM
baxtor's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,880
Received 1,122 Likes on 730 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by JigJag
Correct me if I'm wrong, but at idle ( 700 RPM here ) the engine is turning 11 RPSecond. And that results in 11 exhaust pulses per second. 5.5 per bank. At least this correlates to my experience.

One thousand one, one thousand two.
ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft, ffft.

Meh, close to that anyway.
OK ill join in. 11 revs per second with one firing per 2 revs comes out at 5.5 firings per second ........PER CYLINDER = 66 firings per second or 33 per bank.
l quite likely missed something here.
 
  #43  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:07 PM
Fla Steve's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Deland Florida
Posts: 661
Received 108 Likes on 78 Posts
Default

Good info in this post. I started a thread yesterday...May buy an 89 XJS Convt V-12. It has no spark and I think/hope it's only the rotor. I will find out tomorrow. I plan to do the "Fix" by cutting off the nub on the shaft, but not until I get it running and/or get it towed to my house.
 
  #44  
Old 05-15-2018, 09:27 PM
baxtor's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,880
Received 1,122 Likes on 730 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Fla Steve
Good info in this post. I started a thread yesterday...May buy an 89 XJS Convt V-12. It has no spark and I think/hope it's only the rotor. I will find out tomorrow. I plan to do the "Fix" by cutting off the nub on the shaft, but not until I get it running and/or get it towed to my house.
Assuming it is Marelli ignition the presence of a spark can be checked before it gets to the rotor(ie. at the coil outputs) The distributor simply distributes the spark to the cylinders and has no bearing on whether or not the spark is being created.
 
The following users liked this post:
Fla Steve (05-17-2018)
  #45  
Old 05-15-2018, 11:01 PM
JigJag's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,331
Received 580 Likes on 361 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by baxtor
OK ill join in. 11 revs per second with one firing per 2 revs comes out at 5.5 firings per second ........PER CYLINDER = 66 firings per second or 33 per bank.
l quite likely missed something here.
Dang I swung and missed. Should’ve thought twice before I banged off a post. But I still think we’re off. Lowering the idle a skosh to simplify the math. Hmmmm...

600 RPM / 60 sec = 10 RPS
10 RPS / 4 cycles = 2.5 bangs per sec
2.5 * 12 cylinders = 30 bangs per second
30 / 2 banks =15 bangs per second per bank
 
  #46  
Old 05-15-2018, 11:56 PM
baxtor's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,880
Received 1,122 Likes on 730 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by JigJag
Dang I swung and missed. Should’ve thought twice before I banged off a post. But I still think we’re off. Lowering the idle a skosh to simplify the math. Hmmmm...

600 RPM / 60 sec = 10 RPS
10 RPS / 4 cycles = 2.5 bangs per sec
2.5 * 12 cylinders = 30 bangs per second
30 / 2 banks =15 bangs per second per bank
l reckon you swung and missed again JJ. 4 cycles is correct but we get 2 cycles to each rev so 10 revs gives us 5 bangs not 2.5
​​​
 
The following users liked this post:
JigJag (05-16-2018)
  #47  
Old 05-16-2018, 06:12 AM
JigJag's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,331
Received 580 Likes on 361 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by baxtor
l reckon you swung and missed again JJ. 4 cycles is correct but we get 2 cycles to each rev so 10 revs gives us 5 bangs not 2.5
​​​
Ahhh! Right you are. Thanks. Yay! My brain finally made it to the party!
 
  #48  
Old 05-16-2018, 07:17 AM
bladerunner919's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Berks, UK
Posts: 615
Likes: 0
Received 265 Likes on 197 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by baxtor
Assuming it is Marelli ignition the presence of a spark can be checked before it gets to the rotor(ie. at the coil outputs) The distributor simply distributes the spark to the cylinders and has no bearing on whether or not the spark is being created.

I thought the problem is that the spark runs to ground through the inside the distributor, rather than whether it is generated in the first place?
 
  #49  
Old 05-16-2018, 07:37 AM
Daim's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Bremen, Germany
Posts: 5,907
Received 2,180 Likes on 1,583 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by bladerunner919
I thought the problem is that the spark runs to ground through the inside the distributor, rather than whether it is generated in the first place?
There are a couple of issues...

1. Grounding inside the dizzy
2. Failure of one of the two coils
3. Failure of one of the two ballasts

Anything in pairs on the engine onnthe ignition side, can fail ...
 
  #50  
Old 05-16-2018, 07:54 AM
baxtor's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,880
Received 1,122 Likes on 730 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by bladerunner919
I thought the problem is that the spark runs to ground through the inside the distributor, rather than whether it is generated in the first place?
That's correct. I was just pointing out that you can check for spark without a rotor or the entire distributor on a Marelli car. I understood the car had no spark but l may have misunderstood the post.
 

Last edited by baxtor; 05-16-2018 at 07:57 AM.
  #51  
Old 05-17-2018, 09:46 PM
Fla Steve's Avatar
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Deland Florida
Posts: 661
Received 108 Likes on 78 Posts
Default Ignition Failure Warning System

What you guys are talking about with having some sort of warning system is discussed in the "XJS_BOOK" listed in the "How To" quick links in this XJS Forum on page 166. It's a bit complicated but a "smart guy" could start making these and we'd all buy it. I strongly suggest you all take a look at this great wealth of information on our complicated V-12s. I plan to do the rotor fix by cutting off the distributor nub...as discussed with the link showing how to...as also mentioned earlier in this thread.
 
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
orangeblossom
XJS ( X27 )
33
09-27-2015 06:13 PM
bocagq45
XJS ( X27 )
10
02-22-2014 04:54 PM
XJsc-guy
PRIVATE For Sale / Trade or Buy Classifieds
0
09-29-2013 09:20 AM
tdickins
XJS ( X27 )
6
02-22-2013 06:43 PM
Flint Ironstag
XJS ( X27 )
9
12-12-2011 05:26 PM

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: Another Marelli Ignition Caused Engine Fire?



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:00 PM.