More alternator issues and Quest?
 

My meter is reading 11 volts after start up. Then after 1 or 2 miles of driving I get a loud clicking or clanking noise and the meter jumps up to 14. Then everything is usually ok, around 13 or 14 for rest of drive.

What do you guys think, just replace/rebuild the alternator? I've never had a car that made this kind of sound from the alternator. It can be heard above the Radio. Anyone know the cause?

Thanks...Jimmy

Even tho it is a rebuilt one, could be the bearings, or something else inside, sometimes a bad one makes it thru the rebuild process. I have one I put on a while back, and same thing on start up, 13V and when I rev up the engine/motor it jumps to 14V, I need to check mine, another thing is the connections are lose, or it could be the wrong amperage. But the loud clicking does not sound right. Hopefully one of the more experienced members will hop on and give their input

I don't think it's rebuilt, it looks original. I just don't know what on an alternator can make a sound like that. The noise only happens one time and from then on it works fine.

Stab in the dark, and its very late here.

The nut on the front is not tight, so the fan and pulley are slipping around.

The rubber dampened V pulley of the crankshaft has delaminated, and rattling around, and eventually it finds its "spot" and shuts up. This is the rear most V, and only drives the alternator.

Inside that front crank pulley is a tapered cone, they break, and 2 Woodruff keys, they shear, and they will/can make a terrible noise, but its generally a deep "thonk" type noise.

Told ya its late. I will dream about it and see what gives in the morning.

Four thoughts.


1. I think Grant is on to a definite possible.


2. Remove the drive belt. Fire it up. Same noise? If so, not the alternator.


3. Now still with the belt off and the engine not running. Turn the alternator by hand.
Anything short of a free smooth spin denotes internal mechanical issues.


4. But, not always!! Way back, circa 1968, wifey decided she wanted to drive. Try as hard as shew could, the four on the floor Corvair Monza was beyond her. We went shopping and found a really nice 65 Monza on the used lot of the local GM dealer.
But, as it developed, odd things kept popping up. The drive train and ancillaries were far more experienced than the rest of the car!!! The alternator just quit. I removed it and because of innate curiousity, took it apart. Wear everywhere. Way beyond anything I'd ever seen. Swapped for a rebuild. That part OK. but many more issues followed !!


Carl

Thanks....guys I will check the pulley. What bothers me is that it only does it once and then the alternator starts working fine. It is definitely the alternator, and only the pulley or something associated with the pulley could make that loud a sound.

I'll keep looking...Jimmy

As it was late when Grant posted, I noticed your car is a 6.0L

This car will have a ribbed belt for the Alternator and Jaguar did away with the cone and dual woodruff keys on the damper and went to a Chevy style push on.

With the car cold loosen the alternator belt enough to slip it off then spin the alternator pulley by hand to see if there is any binding or sideways movement.

I read in Kirby that the tension from the ribbed belt can cause the damper to break up? Do you know if the push on style was used as soon as the ribbed pulley or could it have come slightly later (after problems arose)

Thanks...Jim

I did a little further research and found that the ribbed pulley can break loose from the damper. Not uncommon evidently!

According to Kirby it usually will cause a squeal, that sounds like a loose belt. I don't see how this could make the "mechanical" noise that I am hearing. I will start by marking the pulleys and then see if they have slipped after a drive.

The alternator would be easier and cheaper...Oh Well!

Cheers...Jimmy

Jaguar went to the ribbed belt with the change to 110amp alternator, my 89 has the ribbed belt.

My car has 260000km on it and the damper pulley has never been off and if it were loose the timing would be all over the place with the Marelli ignition. All 5.3L engines had the cone setup for the damper. The snout was changed on the 6.0L and is larger in diameter for the slip on damper.

Over tightening of the belt is probably the largest cause of the pulley breaking away, ribbed belts have less stretch than V belts.


Before you replace anything remove the belt from the alternator and spin the alternator pulley by hand to see if there is any binding, if the belt has been over tightened then this could damage the alternator bearings.

[QUOTE=Grant Francis;1634669]Stab in the dark, and its very late here.


Inside that front crank pulley is a tapered cone, they break, and 2 Woodruff keys, they shear, and they will/can make a terrible noise, but its generally a deep "thonk" type noise.


The 6.0 liter did not use a tapered cone. It used a straight walled ( for want of a better term) bushing. If you are R and R the pulley, you will find the stock bolt is too short. I bought a longer one at the hardware store and used it to push the pulley down enough to use the stock bolt.

Actually the 94 has a 120 Bosch alternator and the tapered cone was no longer used. Also the timing was no longer effected by a loose pulley.

I just took a drive after marking the pulleys with some white paint. The paint is no longer aligned, therefore the pulley is slipping on the damper. So now I have a big repair ahead of me, and have to figure out where to get a good pulley/damper.

Thanks...Jimmy

You're right I just went and looked at my 6.0L damper (sitting on my bench) the timing ring is fixed to the inner part of the damper so it can not move.

It will be the out part of the damper that is loose, the rubber has broken. If I were you I would try and find someone who rebuilds dampers and have yours rebuilt.

I found 3 places that rebuild dampers so far.

damperdoctor
damperdudez
HDamper

Anyone have experience with these?

...Jimmy

I've heard good things about Damperdoctor; never used them.

I've used Dale Manufacturing several times with excellent results.


new home page H.B.


Don't be put-off by the unglamorous web page.


Cheers
DD

Doug....you've used Dale several times? Is that on different cars or have you had issues on same car?

I have to admit that with all the years I have been working on cars, I have never had to replace one. Not looking forward to it. I would love to hear if you have any "tips / tricks".

Thanks...Jimmy

Different cars, one being my X300/XJR



[/quote]


If you can't break the damper bolt free by hand you can use the torque of the starter motor to do so. More on that later

Cheers
DD

The front damper bolt isn't actuall tight. BUT the damper itself is tightly pressed on. You'll want a puller tool. The AJV8 crank pulley removal tool just fits... Only just :D I used that.

After removing the alternator belt, the alternator crank pulley can be wiggled by hand. So it is definitely bad and will be sent off for rebuild.

Anyone have suggestions for safely cleaning/degreasing an alternator?

Thanks...Jimmy

Alts are pretty robust, I use Kerosene watered down and with a drop or 2 of liquid soap.

The thing that kills alternators is oil buildup not allowing it keep cool.

Yeah...mine is pretty greasey. I wonder if regular degreaser would work, as long as it doesn't leave a residue and I get it dry?
...Jimmy

I've just taken my (formerly) working alternator apart. It is coated in "gunk" so that'll be cleaned up whilst I'm replacing parts inside it (bearings, regulator, brushes etc.).

As it sits on the front of the engine and afaik all parts are water proof (must be or else it would short out all the time), I've been recommended to put it into a mix of engine cleaner and water. Although diesel is supposed to do the job as well... Oil removes oil... Unlogical but working fact.

Doug...I assume you mean to use extension wedged against ground and bump the starter?
...Jimmy

Yes. Just make sure to figure out which way the engine rotates, of course ....and disable the fuel injection or ignition so you don't inadvertently start the engine :)

Might not be needed, but then again it might.

On my AJ16 engine I certainly needed to do so. I simply couldn't break it free, even with pipe extensions for leverage and my 230 pound heft (not to mention my rippling, grapefruit-sized biceps!).

The bolt is torqued to something outrageous. I can't remember the exact spec, but something like 250 ft/lbs? On reinstallation I just had to take I guess that I was tightening it enough as the spec was far higher than any of my torque wrenches would go.

Cheers
DD

I'm not sure if the balancer bolt on an AJ6 would be so tight

Cheers
DD

Thanks Doug...My manual calls for around 140 FT/Lbs. Going out this morning to give it shot. Should turn in clockwise direction, can tell by looking at fan. Hopefully won't need it.
...Jimmy

You can lock the engine rather easy... All you want is to remove the lower plate between engine and tranny and wedge something up there, long enough to stop the engine turning and off. And whilst you have the harmonic balancer off, replace the front oil seal... Not kidding. You'll kick yourself if you didn't do that at the same time!

I might suggest a healthy impact air or electric, if there is room???

Got the bolt off by wedging a box end wrench and bumping the starter. Now to figure out how to torque it back when reinstalling. Probably will remove the flywheel cover and brace somehow as suggested earlier.

While the pulley/damper is being rebuilt I'll have time to start recovering the seats. The fun just never stops.

Cheers...Jimmy