Hi,

Car is stock. And wonderful and by no means has bad steering feel. I just want to see if there is a way to improve it. Shocks are original and ride seems fine (active). 53k miles.
Electric rack of course....

Thoughts go to things like bushings, alignment specs if even possible, etc. I like heavy steering and maxium feel. I consider stock A-/B+. I'd like to get it to A/A-.

TIA


jb

 

I'm by no means an expert or that knowledgeable in this area but definitely interested in learning more and hope I can contribute.

1) Poly bushing - haven't done this but from what I have read it will tighten things up in terms of response but I remember reading comments about it being too harsh. But a "harsh ride" is a relative and subjective.
2) Larger wheels/lower profile tires - this should help with response as well but I think if you get aftermarket rims, they will most likely be lighter than the stock rims and that will lighten up the steering..counter to your preference to a heavy steering feel.
3) Lowering spring - I have a set of H&R and this does help with steering because of the lower body roll around corners. I do ground out over some speed bumps but it's not often if I take my time and take it from an angle. I think VAP's springs are about have the drop of the H&R and still look great. Going with lowering spring does feel slightly off when in regular mode but when in dynamic mode it feels much more responsive and calibrated.
4) Brake rotors - I went with a lighter set of rotors to reduce the unsprung weight and it lightened up the front end steering as well. Again, this is counter to what you're looking for but just throwing it out there as a factor.
5) KW Coilovers - Haven't done this but was considering it as well. From other people's comments and reviews that I've read, it's too harsh for street driving and really ideal for track use. Again, all relative and subjective.
6) Wheel spacers - I had a set of 15mm on the stock wheels and hard to say how much of a difference it had (got it done at the same time as the lowering springs but before getting a new set of wheels/tires) but I think that would be a factor in steering and feel.
7) Get a V8 with more weight upfront

 

No1 is better tyres, pirelli tyres suck....

 

Note to team,

first thanks.


Wheels are 20" carbon forged OEM blade.
Tire in front is 265/35/20 Conti DWS06plus....it is really good.

I am being persnickety....have had a 996 before and a WRX STI VA on Ohlins...those had hydraulic steering and really customized toe in/camber.....I am sort of wondering if I am missing the latter.....better tuned in toe in/camber.....

Should have put that in there, sorry. Car has active suspension (electronic dampers, OEM Bilstein B4 is what I think they are, Jaguar optimized/tuned of course)

 

A new set of MP4S will make an amazing difference. I just replaced a worn set of MPSS tires and the steering immediately became way more lively and precise.

 

Have you altered the steering feel in the Dynamic settings (I assume the 2016's have this)? You are correct. It's never going to feel like a 911 or any car with hydraulic or manual steering. You will be better off using what options are available in the dynamic tuning options and then just enjoying the car.

 

Thanks. Yes. Oddly, it almost feels sharper in standard mode....maybe not sharper but "feel" might actually be better. Hard to explain this.

But, short version is yes, the car has the full customization option set/screen and I've played around with it.

On the street, based on data, not sure if any suspension mods actually increase peformance much given how well the car does things stock. The "feel" is my goal....I am sort of leaning toward bushings and soft points to replace...are there any along things? I don't want to spend a fortune is part of the equation too.....and I like a stiff car btw, so a little NVH will be ok with me.

 

The F-Type chassis is already very stiff compared to most cars. Your value of going with bushings will not yield as big of a gain with the designed-in chassis stiffness. That being said, Powerflex has some bushings for the car:

https://www.powerflexusa.com/shop/ca...type-2013-1473

FWIW, when I'm comparing stiffness, I'm comparing to my race with a full cage, my 4C with the carbon fiber chassis and other race cars I've been in (like Radicals).

 

Thanks!

 

I was thinking something similar - when I have my car lowered, having the camber set somewhere around -2 to -2.5 degrees, and toe at 0 or slightly in. Not sure if that will give you more 'feel' vs 'response' from the front end, but worth a try. Physical things like bushings are usually the route to get more feedback through the actual steering wheel. Used to have an FR-S (distant cousin to WRX), those Subarus have strut front suspension so they really beg for negative camber at the front as the front geometry cambers out under load. I need to do a bit more research on here with folks that have messed with custom alignments. And don't forget tire pressures, that can make a noticeable difference too

 

The OEM forged wheels are nearly as heavy as normal alloys I think. Something to do with JLR wheels being built to withstand UK road conditions. Changing to lightweight forged 21s made an absolute world of difference to my RWD in handling and improved the feel translating through the steering (though I always felt the feel was fine). That said, I can imagine that you wouldnt want to spend big bucks changing wheels just on an off chance.

 

Thanks.

Good point and yes...I'd really love lighter wheels but had to make a strategic decision based on my observation and actually communicaiton attempts with the vendor many here had used...they did not return calls to me for 3 days....and deliveries were quoted in months.....so if I damaged a wheel the car could be "down" for months unless I kept a spare set of wheels around. The LR wheels an be had quickly...perhaps 24h. Given the roads around here (not just the UK)...no brainer to go with LR wheels. They have to pass the same Land Rover standards of a 45mph curb strike without damage (suspension too). Since I am not racing, I went forged...they are 10-15% lighter than the stock 20" wheels that are cast...call it 28 lbs not 21...but also not 32 or 34...just making those numbers up before anyone gets upset and posts a correction ..... There is a huge peace of mind aspect to this choice that I must admit is nice. On a group drive I saw a Ferrari damage a wheel and that person was not happy...and I hit the same spot and nothing happened. To me, that is a huge deal.

What I want is more of the buzz, the feel...and I think bushing may be the way forward and tire pressure for sure as noted above ...alignment too. Frankly, I wonder if the gurus at VAP can tune the electronic steering? (Stewart???)

First world problem. The car is amazing as is....I am trying to make it equal to the finest aspect of a 911....that is saying something in and of itself that it is close enough to try....if the 911 is a 10, the jag is 8.8 or 9....it is great...I just am one of those types who tinkers to improve things. And steering feel is something you can have at legal speeds all the time...so to me worth the trouble.


All, thanks. Just wanted to get into the suspension aspect of things as to me it is more important than the power side of things....my take on things ....as I only drive it on the street.

 

Did a few things last night and today and am now feeling a lot better.

1. Realized the the 911 in all its guises gets praised upon praised...it is almost illegal to say anything bad about it. Bore scoring. Coolant hose issues.....bad interior quality....blasphemy and troll target material for you....anyway, that is how I see it.
2. So I went and test drove a used 911 from 2018 that is way too expensive.
Here is what I learned:
Seats are worse. (their sport seat)
Radio is worse. (sound quality). I like the interface a lot. But I added carplay to my F-type and it is all I use so it levels the playing field nicely.
Door and build quality feels tinny.
Rattles a lot. My F-type has no rattles. Whatever you want to say about UK cars, the build quality is there (panel fitment not so much...).
But to the point of this thread, the steering was not better. This test car happened to have the same model tire as I do...recently updated/fixed. So I had to try it out....and voila, not better than my V6 from my perspective.
In dynamic mode, the steering of the F-type is equal to this 2016 c4 with the same rubber and supposedly both with factory suspension settings on the softest and hardest settings available..I tend to like stiffer suspension settings).
I was sort of shocked. If you get past the bluff and marketing and such, the F type is better than we may all think and the Porsche is "mortal"....it and the F are superb.
3. I was underwhelmed by the looks and the feel...the new 911's have gotten very big and it did not feel that much lighter...it is ligher but I bet not by a whole lot..


Anyway, I think my thread here was more about me imagining the 911 to be a lot better than it really is...and the dual wishbone of the F-type really is amazing.

All of this was on the street. I don't do or need track capacity. I need driving on mountain road and canyon carving...and for that this car is amazing.

I did not get into the brakes. I am not a huge fan of the factory F-type pads and have new pads ready to install and new rotors...am just waiting for these things to wear out...and they wear too well darnit.


Have a good day.

jb

 

Oh my goodness…you have unmasked the king of sports cars….the constant remarks about the 911 being superior in EVERY way to every other sports car (particularly the F-Type) is not only exhausting, but, as you point out, false. Yes, the handling of the 911 is excellent, but in so many other ways it falls short. But to say so is considered heresy, isn’t it? Well done.
Now if we could somehow get auto journalists to loosen their German-car sycophancy and inject more objectivity into their analyses….

 

The 911 is certainly not superior in terms of looks - I think it's a hideous design. Who wants to drive a jelly mould?

 

Can't understand your review, maybe you just had a defected car. 911's steering feel and the way car enter and exit corners is something else, even the 2018 base model.

 

Agree, but my V6S coupe on 20" forged JLR wheels with 265/305 conti dws6plus tires is somethign else too.....i

The F type is equal to the 911 on the street. Street. Street.

And it looks a lot nicer. 911's are nice looking too, but not nearly as nice looking as the Jaguar. The jaguar is art. It is orders of magnitude nicer looking. To my eye. And I love 911's. All of them for the most part...even the 996 gen 1.

My opinion only, but that is how I feel - 2018 P car was big feeling -- this will blow your mind but it felt "bigger" than the F and the F to me feels too big sometimes.

Anyway, for the real world, I think the steering in my F is equal to that in that 911..... Magazine and Youtubers often get paid to say things.....or risk loosing advertising deals if they say things....or access to test cars....so I take all reviews with a grain of salt.


The 911 was not defective. I was a pca solo driver a long time ago.

 

Fair, i don't know specifically your car. Owned some F-types and some Porsche. In my opinion, F-type doesn't even come close if we are talking on handling, steering and/or seat feeling.

But good news, if your car already corners like a 991(?), no need improvements, thread closed

 

Agree. Thread closed.

 

The electric power steering is not the most satisfying but other than the two different settings available in the configurable dynamics, I don't know of anything that will help it. I think it's too light and doesn't have much "on-center" feel, but I've gotten used to it and don't think about it much anymore.

I'm still on stock wheels, but only because I have yet to find an aftermarket one that really grabs me. I'll probably end up with something I like but don't love but am in no hurry.