Jaguar x type 2003 2.5 awd will not crank or engage starter
 

Removed the starter relay and jumped the leads; the starter cranks fine and strong
tested the battery; full 12.5 v
tested the load on battery (using the a/c fan and door open (interior lights., etc..) holds charge fine
Turn ignition to position II; everything normal except the console light flashes rapidly
Turn to start position ....nothing; no buzz; no click; no chatter or solenoid
Mine is 2003 vintage and does not have fuse F34....I did check every fuse and all are confirmed good
With ignition in II position; rapid flashing of console light for about 60 seconds; then one flash followed by two flashes (code 12)...repeats for a minute or two then goes out.
I have tried "resetting the alarm" by locking manually and then opening with remote.,
I have read all of the OBD codes and nothing spectacular (P0171;0174;03
01;1313;1316;0102;0112;0122;0222;0420;0430;1108;; None of the codes should stop it from cranking

To supplement the above post: I have also :
pressed the fuel pump reset switch in the passenger side panel
Turned the ignition to position III (start) with the radio on; the radio goes out and comes back on after the switch is returned to position II
The engine is not seized since the starter cranks by jumping the starter relay
I also tried having the ignition in position II while jumping the starter relay.....it cranks fine but will not ignite (start).

That's the PATS light, it must mean you have a security issue preventing the car from starting. Do you have any codes listed in the Drivers Door Module?

You have me on that one....how would I check the "drivers door modules? By the way, thank you for your response

So here is my analysis. 1. You have 2 keys and switched normal used set and spare is not "paired" to the car for some reason. 2. You inadvertently erased the "pairing" and you now need to pair (read here = program) the key to car (& if you have 2 keys, both must be present when pairing). Having a key fob not paired to your car, gives exactly the symptoms you have described by activating the fob immobilizer.

Pairing fob =https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://m.youtube.com/watch%3Fv%3DyJgp7bOGgns&ved=0ahUKEwj6ptTYuuHTAhVO-GMKHQ0XBfYQo7QBCBwwAA&usg=AFQjCNHjs9p1K1Wvl23dSy0c 2wMFCqRLkA&sig2=f4gO0Edxif3pFCJ3pX8pLw

Btw, a "search; of forums gives this (exact symptoms you describe) =

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...t-death-63928/

With the addition, he had valet key, lol

Also, manually locking and unlocking the driver door, will sometimes "fix" the security lock out. If the console light rapidly flashes, it's an indication of security system lock out mode.

I think you have a well thought out analysis but unfortunately, I only have ONE key. So inadvertently switching the keys was not p0robable; Erasing the pairing is possible and I have considered that. Not sure how it may have happened but at the end of the day, I do not think that is the problem. I did purchase a new key but it still needs to be cut and programmed (as on right now, it is still just a blank key).. I live in the rural areas so I am about sixty mile from Dallas (the nearest Jag dealer) so that is the absolute last resort since the car will need to be hauled on a flatbed (awd).
The other problem is that I just don't have a lot of faith in Mechanics whom I have never met and that is what I would be doing if I take it to a Dealership (last resort).
I tried to list everything that I have tried in the original post but I did miss listing some tests...sorry. I spoke to a Locksmith and he said that it is probably not the transponder chip in the key since the key has no visible physical damage (not impossible but improbable)....I want to exhaust all other tests first before I give up.
A Previous post (reply) suggests that there may be a Drivers Door Module Problem. I am not sure what that means or how t test for it but it does seem like something which needs the be eliminated.
I really appreciate your response and will strongly consider it.
Thank you so much.
Ron

Thank you Dell for your second response. It was that exact same post, which you kindly sent the link; that prompted me to do the manual lock/unlock test....(as listed in my original post) but it did not produce the desired result.

I am still trying to analyze the problem with my Jag. Based on some of the very appreciated suggestions from members, above; I think I will try:
a. remove the door panel on the drivers side door and visually check/lubricate all of the latching mechanism, etc..
Take the original key to Jaguar Dealership and have them duplicate a key/transponder.
Go through the manual lock/unlock cycle again.

Any Suggestions?
Thank you

Just to make sure you understand the "fob" thing. The lower half is doors, etc. The top half is the immobilizer part. One person I read up on, taped the top half of his fob under the dashboard to "trick" the car into thinking the correct fob (an ebay purchase of a dismantled car, with new cut key to work the ignition switch) was there. Never told the new purchaser of the car what they had done. Pretty sketchy.

Thank you Dell:
That is funny (and devious) about the transponder but I have heard of it being done (they even did the same thing on "Wheeler Dealers"). Love that show. Anyhow, I did go through the manual lock/unlock test once again with no luck...I decided against removing the door panels at this time and settled for a good dose of WD 40 on all the mechanisms since; the door ajar light goes out on the dash, when closed. I will do the long "round trip" to Jaguar tomorrow and post the results. I am optimistic but not convinced that it will solve the problem.....worth a trip at this time since I need two keys anyhow.
Thanks again
Ron

One last check to do, is turn key to position 2, watch dash lights as they sequence through their check. If the CEL (check engine light, the little amber motor icon) extinguishes, that is an indicator that indeed the immobilizer is activated.

That was an interesting check. I did not even get the "CEL" icon in the first place. The CEL did not come on at all, thus it was not there to go out. Several other lights did and cycled out. The only ones remaining were: seat belt, oil pressure and alternator (all as would be expected). Of course, it could be something as simple as a light bulb because the OBD testing works fine and are listed in the original post.
Thanks
Ron

When this happened was it just out of the blue and before then it was running just fine? Or were there any kind of warning signs or other issues with the car before this? Did you recently do any work on the car? Any other details you could think of that might play a hand into this?

You mentioned the P0171 and P0174 codes came up. Those indicate a vacuum leak, but that wouldn't prevent the car from starting.

Thank you for your interest Alphadude: It just happened kinda out of the blue. Returned from a trip of around 150 miles; the car was unloaded and then it just would not start again....go figure.

If you lock the car with the fob will the security light just blink slowly and steadily? Then when you unlock the car and get in and turn the key, is that when the light starts blinking as you describe?

I just found this document about the PATS system, but it is for the S-Type. I am guessing the codes would be the same, but can't verify that. On page 4 it explains what the blinking light code number is and then further down in the document it explains what it means and what to do about it. Hope this might help you as it does sound like a security issue.

They are enough the same. I have code 12 as common to both and the same as code B2103, meaning a bad code was received when reading a key. I think that means the key's bad or the device for reading it is.

Usually you'd try your other key as it is vital to have at least TWO - as the techs point out often...

Just wonder what could cause a programmed key to go bad unless it was somehow damaged. Very odd.

A programmed key can go bad if it is subjected to a magnetic field.
The one thing that has not been mentioned is a hard reset. Disconnect the battery and joint the two leads together for a couple of minutes, then reconnect and it resets all modules.
Also the Transmission range sensor (Inhibitor switch) could be at fault. Check fuse 92 (10amp) comes live at position 2.
You could also try moving the gear between P and N while turning to position 3.

Roger

Found another possible solution =

should be able to close up the car and use the key in the door cylinder to lock and arm the security system, then unlock and disarm the security system also with the key. At that point, the car should start.
One other thing to try, is to lower the driver window, close up all else, then lock and arm the system with the key. Then pull up on the drive lock button and open the door. That should trip the security system with a 15 second escalating warning sound. Within that 15 seconds, jump in the car and turn the ignition on and off three times and on the fourth time turn all the way to start. That should also reset the security system and allow starting.

Using the key to arm and disarm the security does not mean the car will start. The security system is separate from the PATS system. It is the chip in the key that unlocks the ECM etc to enable start but I am not certain that even if the PATS is not working correctly the car will not turn over. Some posts have quoted that they have a code 12 but the car will not start but turns over.

Roger

Not sure why Alfadude, possibly something with the chip inside the key, or something may have caused interference with the security between the key and the vehicle? I know when programming keys on the newer vehicles, if anything goes wrong during program process it wipes software from the keyless vehicle modules, then you have to replace the module and keys. With your vehicle, you shouldn't have that problem. Make sure the remote is working, and try cycling the key in the barrel in the drivers door.

Thank you, Gentlemen, one and all for your help and responses:
As and update to what I have done today and tried: I drove to the Jaguar Dealership (about a 50 mile trip each way) only to have them tell me that they do not cut and program keys, they do not have the equipment…the next Jaguar Dealer is and additional 30 miles or so. Consequently, no new keys today.
I tried the window open etc., reset of the security system (four times) suggested by Dell Gailey; unfortunately, no positive results.
I tried the “hard reset” procedure suggested by Rchiv; unfortunately, no positive results. (I also tried the shifting between P and N), unfortunately, no positive results.
Alphadude queried why a transponder in a key would go bad…I also have the same question but, I have read several posts where someone tried a spare key and all was well…..so, I guess they can go bad.
Alphadude sent me the link to the PATS system for an S type (mine is an X type) but unfortunately I could not make enough sense out of the detailed document but, most importantly, it did not include a “code 12” which is the failure code which I have.
I did go back and retrace my steps with fuses and the starter relay, I tested the circuits with my tester and they all showed well….I even bought a new relay and tested that (relays are cheap and I don’t mind having a spare) but unfortunately, no positive results.
I simply cannot believe how hard so many of you have worked to help me solve this problem and I am forever grateful…..thank you Gentlemen…..I will persevere and eventually get there from here.

More programming info (not applicable to your circumstances, but....)

Upper portion of Key Fob Programming of transponder to the cars ignition to be able to start the car. Must have the two original keys. If one is missing will have to reprogram all keys using Dealer WDS/SDD software.

• Insert the first valid key and turn to the run position (position II, not position III run engine) for a maximum of five seconds, then turn to off and remove the key.

• Within ten seconds of removing the first key, insert the second valid key and turn to the run position for a maximum of five seconds, then turn to off and remove the key.

• To program the third (additional/unrecognized) key, insert the new key and turn to the run position within twenty seconds of removing the second key, allow the in car PATS RED LED to prove out for three seconds to confirm storage of the additional key, the red security light will then go out, then turn the key to off and remove the key.

• This method can be used to store up to a maximum 8 ignition keys.

Thank you Dell:
Actually, I think this is exactly applicable to my car, not necessarily my problem, unless my one and only key has lost its program. I need to take the key to a locksmith and have him scan the key; see if it reads a code. If not, then we know the problem is with the key. If it does read a code, I am still not out of the woods. I will do that in the next day or so.

When you took the vehicle to the dealer, did you ask them to scan for codes? The security and PATS are run through different modules. Security is done through GEM ( General Electronic Module ) and the PATS is through the Instrument Pack itself. Once you've checked the keys, report back and let us know what you find from locksmith.

Firstly; whatever happens, I will definitely report the final results, in detail.
As you will remember, I arrived at the Dealer only to find that they did not have the equipment or the skills to do keys.
Another Dealer is another trip.

Same problem here, my X-Type from 2003 does the same thing, no crank, error code 12, I have two keys, tried both no results. I'm curious if you fixed yours.

On my 2002 it would not engage or crank.
Usually on a 2002 or 2003 I think it would need a new starter anyway,
so I wasted no time checking, just got a new starter and everything
worked fine after that. Replaced it with a new Bosh.

On mine it charged OK, and battery checked fine.

Walter

Ed:
No, I have not fixed mine yet. Error code 12 means "No data received from lock barrel pick up".
It appears that you an I have the exact same problem. I would love to stay in touch an share solutions.
I plan on taking mine the to Jaguar Dealership in Plano, TX., but I have to put it on a flat bed to do that; so, I will do that when I find time....it is not my daily driver so no big rush.

New Mexico:
My starter checks out fine...I checked it by jumping the start relay and it cranks fine...won't start but cranks fine.

I assume the error "No data received from lock barrel pick up" could also indicate a wiring fault between the inductive pickup on the ignition barrel and the GEM ?


Paul.

file:///C:/Users/Ron/Desktop/Code%2012%20pdf.pdf

So I found one other possibility for not starting beyond the transponder not working. As you insert and remove the ignition key, there is a "shutter" that should open/close with key insertion/removal. If it does not close completely, it can mess with the transponder not recognizing the key.

Here is the info I found from a UK company that repairs Jag keys/fobs =

look carefully at the ignition barrel. There should be a small shutter which closes when you remove the key from the ignition. The car's security module uses this to recognise when a key is inserted or removed from the ignition. If this doesn't completely close, you will not be able to reprogram/use remotes to the car. In this instance, a small spray of maintenance or lubricating spray such as WD40 or silicone spray, followed by inserting and removing the key a few times should solve the problem. Sometimes it's worth giving it a spray, inserting and removing the key a few times, then leaving it to penetrate for a couple of hours. DO NOT use oil in the ignition, as this leaves a residue which will cause dust and dirt to stick inside the ignition.

Wow Dell:
You just don't give up...you have my admiration for that. Unfortunately, I already tried the lubricating spray (WD40) on the ignition switch and it had no effect. Since you have suggested it (based on research), I am going to try it again....I will report back on here.
Thank you Dell

If you sent the message about key problems, I would suggest electronic
spray into the key hole rather then wd-40.

Walter

Thank you Walter, I will try that.
Ron

Problem solved
 

I promised that if and when I solved the problem with the "error 12", I would post it here.
I finally had no choice but to give up on the problem since only a limited number of Jaguar Dealers even have the right computers to diagnose the problem
It turned out that the "instrument cluster" had failed (a common failing to this particular car and model). I purchased a new cluster, had Jaguar install it and voila, problem solved.
Ron