Compared to the way they used to be built, rather than against the competitive set.

 

Guys - just a quick reminder to all

I've noticed a few heated exchanges and people that may be taking things the wrong way! Please remember that as a forum the written word is our way of communicating, sometimes things can get taken the wrong way, then of course there's the international differences in language / humour etc etc.
Please, please bear this in mind and re read your post before submitting. We all have our opinions and feel free to voice them, but remember, this is and has always been a friendly forum and we like to keep it that way

 

Just another three h'appence worth (=2 cents)

This week I read that there are 28,000 XFs running around in the UK. I see them every day all over the place. I have not yet seen one on a recovery trailer, or with hood up at roadside. Surely all these owners can't be wrong ?

I do accept that there will be imperfections on new products; that is why the warranty is there. And it is also very annoying when one has just whacked out £30,000 or more on a car. Maybe the man who buys secondhand is more relaxed as he is not expecting perfection ! My own Jaguar XJ6 (X350) has so far had to have some rather expensive paintwork, but nothing mechanical. Its 7 years old and on 34k now.

 

Lovin the XF myself and think they're beautifuly crafted. To date I can't recall seeing one broke down / on a trailer / being towed etc!

As for warranty? I have an A6 bought from new. Absolutely love the car, but the warranty has paid out many many times in the last 3 and a half years with more than a few visits to the garage!
I know some owners who've had NO issues at all....just your luck unfortunately

Sorry to hijack the thread

 

On that basis, as I've never seen a dead person, nobody has ever died.

 

Yes, Jaguar are now building cars of better quality than Mercedes and BMW which wouldn't be saying much except their quality is also approaching that of Lexus (Toyota). So, incredibly well built is no exaggeration. The Mini is also very well built. British labour is a skilled as any at building cars and now management and labour are no longer so much at each other's throats the benefits in quality are coming into the market. Historically, Britain was always known for its high quality manufacture and modern Britain is now producing some very high quality stuff these days, including Jaguars.

 

Lol. I've never seen a murder. Homicide rates are boloney. I've also never seen a unicorn or a UFO but they do exist, right?

 

Let's agree to disagree on this one.

 

J.D. Power might disagree with this statement. And as to revisionist views of history about Britain's ability to build great cars I give you two words "Red Robbo". If you don't know who he was Google him. This is the man who almost destroyed the British car industry. And since this was pre J.D. Power we will never know how truly bad those cars were. But having British Leyland as a client and seeing the product on the line, I can assure you it was not a pretty picture.

 

everyone at somepoint will have a problem yet there car. doesn't matter about make. that just life.

 

The numbers for Jaguar are good. They are better built than BMW or Mercedes. That's a fact.

 

Care to share these numbers? The ones I've seen - not so good.

 

J D Power puts Jaguar ahead of BMW and essentially tied with Mercedes Benz. However, the XF is better built than any previous Jaguar while most Mercedes and BMW products continue to be no better than average. Jaguar's dealer satisfaction is also higher.

Where Mercedes does well is in their ridiculously expensive models. Their cheaper lines can be awful.

http://www.jdpower.com/autos

http://www.thestar.com/article/605250

 

Those scores for IQS and reliability look significantly poorer than BMW or Mercedes, so I don't get the "better" part of your argument.

 

Jagular - did you even look at the studies you posted? To summarize JD Power's 2010 findings:

• Initial quality - Mercedes (among the best), BMW (average), Jag (below avg.)
• Dependability - they all ranked "average" but Merc was 9th, BMW 18th & Jag 24th

Nothing there points to "exceptional" or "better." The Star article you posted refers to last year's dependability survey. BTW, the XF won't show up in the JD Power study until 2012. FWIW, Consumer Reports scores the XF below average for reliability - http://www.autoblog.com/photos/consu...eport/#2398303

Again, we can just agree to disagree on your claims and continue to enjoy our respective cars.

 

Guess I am just lucky then, so far. I didn't see figures showing BMW's to be better than Jaguars.

Each comparable BMW model is more expensive than the equivalent Jaguar also.

 

And followed the link to JD Power you would see the data in black and white comparing IQS and reliability for BMW Jaguar and Mercedes and it clearly shows the other two marques are superior. You can be in denial and try changing the argument about how much cheaper the Jaguar is - maybe there's a connection there - or just accept the fact that the data's there and move on.

 

"Predicted" reliability and actual reliability may be different. Consumer Reports talks about predicted reliability.

I have also seen the types of "reliability" issues that have been reported on the Jaguar bulletin boards and many of them result from owner ignorance as to what is actually a fault. For example: people refer to the glovebox "swipe" switch as a defect. Some dealers and salespeople still call it a swipe switch. If you swipe it, it will not operate for pretty obvious reasons. It is a "touch" switch. Same for the "defective" interior light touch switch which merely operates normally if you put your hand up to adjust the rear view mirror and hold your hand so as to touch the light.

I have talked to the service people at my dealership and they confirm that the XF is very reliable and needs very little servicing. You can believe as you wish. The numbers show that the Jaguar and the BMW are both at worst "average". Mercedes is only better in the body and interior category, whatever that means.

 

The simple fact is that JD. Power numbers show a picture which is different from the way you originally claimed. Either back up your claim with hard numbers or keep quiet until you can actually prove something rather than using hearsay and obfuscation.

 

Remember that your initial claim was that Jaguar's are "exceptionally well built" and that it is a "fact" that they are built better than Merc and BMW. Average does not equal exceptionally well. For more detailed rankings, see http://www.autoblog.com/photos/2010-...study/#2811040. Again, Jag was 24th, behind the two benchmarks you chose.

You can, and obviously will, believe as you wish. Happy motoring!