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Bruce, I have nothing to add as I am not NEARLY as awesome as you are!!! Great cars, advanced track experience, and a well written fellow. I had a buddy down here who became addicted to the track life, he bought a Boxster, then had it stripped and modified. After a while ripped the engine out and put in a 911 engine. Of course had to upgrade to a nice pull behind track trailer that could fit the car, tools, and a track gator. Then a better dually truck to pull all that gear. Was a real obsession and on financial steroids compared to other car hobbies.
The only negative I can find is that you live in a winter wonderland and not in the amazing place called Florida, but I know what will happen, you will probably tell me how you have a great place down here like most other Canadians. Great people, always welcome here.
Good advice and at this point I can't really think of a good reason to. It's among the last of the breed with a V10 NA engine and a manual tranny. Resale values keep inching up and have been selling above the original MSRP for 3 or 4 years now. If I was going to sell it would have been when I was buying the 911 to save our 13% sales tax on its value. But instead I installed a 2 post lift to accommodate the new arrival!
I see you have a AM Rapide and Vantage. Beautiful vehicles that seem a notch above Jaguar. I was on vacation in Naples Florida in 2010 at a Jaguar/Aston/Porsche dealership comparing the XXR with the Vantage. Back and forth, each with a slight perceived advantage here and there, with no obvious winner, although I drove neither. I came home and chose the Jag vert mostly because of my fond memories and attachment to my XKE vert, but otherwise might have bought the Vantage. A friend recently bought a used Rapide. He loves it. Have you had good experiences with yours? I ask because some report spotty reliability with some AM vehicles which would put off buying. I wasn't a fan of my Jaguar dealer service department which influenced my decision to sell before the warranty expired.
Originally Posted by tampamark
Bruce, I have nothing to add as I am not NEARLY as awesome as you are!!! Great cars, advanced track experience, and a well written fellow. I had a buddy down here who became addicted to the track life, he bought a Boxster, then had it stripped and modified. After a while ripped the engine out and put in a 911 engine. Of course had to upgrade to a nice pull behind track trailer that could fit the car, tools, and a track gator. Then a better dually truck to pull all that gear. Was a real obsession and on financial steroids compared to other car hobbies.
The only negative I can find is that you live in a winter wonderland and not in the amazing place called Florida, but I know what will happen, you will probably tell me how you have a great place down here like most other Canadians. Great people, always welcome here.
Haha...no vacation property ANYWHERE! It's actually kind of nice to store the sports car(s) for winter, shift the passion to something else for a while (I hear that happens with some people!), and then when spring comes around you fire it up and take that long awaited first drive and you get to fall in love with it all over again! Like your seriously rabid track friend, tracking can be an all-engrossing passion, and it's not such a bad thing to take a break from it for a few months. I was determined not to get sucked down that rabbit hole and track cars with nothing more than a tire pressure gauge, torque wrench for wheel lugs and a helmet. We're located in a bit of a mecca for race tracks with one of the best 45 minutes away, and several other top tracks within 6 or 7 hours which is nothing. California is another mecca for track rats. The Viper Owners Association chose Florida for our 4-day bi-annual National Viper Event in Miami starting April 27th and tracking at Homestead International is on the agenda. I'm not sure if we'll make it due to health safety concerns but Homestead would be the 13th track I've driven...yikes, 13 sounds scary, maybe I should stay home!
Enjoy your beautiful Tampa weather...I envy you for about half the year
I've had an incredibly happy two years with the 2010 XKR. It was everything I hoped it would be, and much more. I felt the same way driving it top down on a balmy summer evening at 58 as I did in the XKE at 20 with the top down. Both were remarkably smooth handling for their respective performance, comfortable, stunning to look at...and one of them was dead reliable!
My most memorable times in the XKR were driving to distant race tracks where I'd be gone for a couple or three days, sometimes with my wife. To be able to pack up everything you need for that and fit it with ease into a car that you could then blast around the track, dicing it up competently with some pretty fast hardware, is truly impressive. And it's so comfortable when you just want to cruise in a mellow mood, or rip through some twisties in spirited fashion. I've just loved everything about it.
I bought it 2 years old as a Jaguar Canada car that had been used just one summer, and in the dealers showroom for another. It had about 15,000 kms and it now has about 28,500 km, so that's 13.5k of use, or about 8000 miles. I planned to sell it before the warranty expired March 2015, but I found its replacement now, and had a good opportunity to sell the XKR with relatively little loss. I paid $84,500 and netted $74,580 as a trade-in, factoring in the savings on sales tax on the new car purchase by trading it in. That's $10k on a two year old high-end car...amazing. Dealer retail asking price here is around $75,000 as well, and I might have been able to get $70-72k in the spring, so I was ahead trading it in.
What I was looking for in the next car was even higher performance, and a more engaging and visceral driving experience. Something that was over-the-top thrilling, even when just cruising. And something with over-the-top performance at the track, and a high ability that would really challenge me as a driver to extract that performance. I've found that with the new 2014 SRT Viper TA. Mine will be black instead of the orange pictured below.
It looks large because of being quite low, but is actually shorter than a 911. It's light weight at 33xx pounds, and has 640 hp and 600 lbft torque from its 8.4 L V10 through a 6 speed manual gear box. The TA stands for Track Attack, and it's currently the most track capable Viper. It also holds the production car track lap record at Laguna Seca where many high performance sports cars have been tested over the years. So it's a fast and impressive handling car by the looks of things. But beyond that, it's a very engaging car to drive, and there will never be a dull moment behind it's wheel. We also have a pristine Toyota Supra Twin turbo with removable targa roof for fun in the sun driving, and its roof was off most of last summer.
It's been a real pleasure meeting so many other genuine Jaguar enthusiasts on this forum. I have to give the forum moderators here recognition for doing such a great job at encouraging and maintaining such a pleasant experience for all. This forum is a class act all around, just like the Marque itself! I wouldn't hesitate for a moment to buy another modern Jaguar in the future, and expect to drop by every now and then to say hello!
Happy Holidays!
Bruce
to tell you the Truth,The Viper have ALWAYS been my dream car over the Jaguar and you couldn't have picked a better upgrade and I do believe I will go that same route.The only cars better than a Jaguar in this order is the Viper,then ALL Mclarens.I would say Aston Martin too but I consider Aston Martin as Jaguars equal
Last edited by Barry Leftwich; Dec 19, 2020 at 04:25 AM.
I thought it was high time to check in with my old XK friends and I hope all your automotive adventures have been going well!
The love affair with the Viper TA continues, and long after I had expected I'd want to sell it (before the 4 year factory warranty expired).. I ended up extending that warranty out to 7 years, which ends in the spring, and once again I can't bring myself to part with it, now with almost 70,000 kms (~43,000 miles). I still miss the XKR with its classic and impossibly good looks and glorious grand touring nature. I ended up satisfying that longing by ordering a 2019 Porsche Turbo S....classic styling, gobs of power and remarkably handy rear seats again, and in the exact same color as my XKR! It even sits within that brand similarly to how the XKR used to in Jaguar's. Hmm, it would seem I can't seem to get over the XKR either! Unfortunately neither are convertibles like the XKR, and I still miss that, but that was the compromise I made for my tracking passion. I wish Jaguar still had an XK touring offering, perhaps unlikely ever at this point. Look after and save your XK's guys, they will become collectibles..
When I bought the XKR as a corporate car with some miles already on it I had it out on the fastest circuit race track in North America within 24 hours. With the Viper I had exactly one week to put on 800 break-in miles before putting it on the same track. With the 911 Turbo I had just over a week to rack up 1800 miles before a track day at Le Circuit Mont Tremblant in Quebec so we did the grand touring thing from Ontario to Bar Harbor, Maine with our holiday gear and a helmet. We finished racking up those miles just in time to do the track day in Quebec on our way home! Timing is everything And I love to fully explore and appreciate a fine sports cars performance safely and legally on a race track. I'm sure some of you have been able to explore the performance of your beauties through some twisties as well.
Now you're probably wondering how the 911 Turbo S with 580 hp and 7 speed DCT transmission stacks up against the track record setting Viper TA with 640 hp and 6 speed manual. Pretty well as it turns out. Cars keep getting quicker, the DCT trannies are brilliant, and a number of newer offerings have beaten the TA's lap times at Laguna Seca, including the Turbo S by a hair on regular Pirelli P-Zero tires. I swapped on a set of Michelin Sport Cup 2 tires as used on the 911 GT3 and RS more track focused cars and it became a real track animal. About a second a lap quicker on a 1:32 lap, which is huge, and an incredible 15 mph higher top speed on the straightaway. That mirrors Randy Pobst's experience with both cars on track, and is just stupid fast for a grand tourer with a back seat, never-mind only 6 cylinders! ..
So that's what I've been doing since my last update in 2018, but what about you guys? How have your XK ownership experiences been going, and what new sports car adventures are you on?
And how's the Pantera and Corvette C7 been treating you guys?
That black viper is Gorgeous BEAUTY OMG!!!!!!!!😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😍😍
I picked up my new black ’14 TA on April 23rd, having watched the Reliable Transport pull up, unload, and the Viper tech PDI it. I ordered it through Islington Chrysler, and Kris Rams made the transaction very easy over the phone, including pricing my XKR trade fairly. I hadn’t seen a Gen V when I ordered it, but the help received on the forums and media reviews were very effective at telling me everything I needed to know.
The 500 mile break-in was finished quickly, as was the paint protection film and 6 point harness install, in preparation for this week's track day at Mosport (renamed Canadian Tire Motorsports Park). SRT will be running the #91 and 93 here in July in the Tudor Race Series. My very early impressions are based on having had other high performance sports cars, but never having even sat in a Viper, and the only previous experience having been chasing them around road courses for years! I’ll start with the positives…
The car is stunning visually, fit and finish inside and out looks very good, and the paint is spectacular. Everything about the car is purposeful, and if you appreciate a “form follows function” design then this is it. It has a simplicity that is refreshing, with little in the way of embellishment for its own sake. You get the sense that nothing is on the car that wasn’t needed to provide an engaging driving experience and world-class performance on the road and road course. The interior and controls is a model of simplicity, and the comprehensive U-connect infotainment system is a welcome nod to modern technology, as is the mandated and flexible Electronic Stability Control and Traction Control system. If you turn off the ESC then there’s no nannies between the driver and the car, well except for ABS.
Simple and refined interior is all business. 6 point harness added.
The ballistic nylon seats in the TA are very comfortable, providing the good lower back support I require. I’m 5’10, 215 lbs, and have ample headroom even with a helmet on. These manual TA seats do lower more than the power seats in other models I understand, and if you’re much taller it would be smart to sit in one to confirm. The headliner forms a low windshield header that some comment on, but it’s just a non-issue for me, and not something I even notice after just 7 days. Pedals seem nicely positioned, and my fairly narrow driving shoes are perfect for this fairly tight area.
Performance is visceral, violent, scalpel sharp, immediate, intense…and addictive. Those are the qualities I was looking for, along with classic and timeless styling and exclusivity. Lots of great cars that offer other mixes of qualities, but not a single other car that offered this complete mix. They aren’t exactly popular goals either as exclusivity and performance generally cost beyond the financial reach of most. Just don’t be too surprised if all your car buds aren’t racing out to buy one! No excuses required.
Hood vents
Rear spoiler
I dropped by the track a couple of days ago and an aero dynamist I know looked over the car with great interest. He explained that the design of the 6 vent hood would be very effective at reducing drag and lift by allowing more engine compartment airflow to be released over the hood rather that under the car, and that the lowered middle section of the rear aero spoiler was designed to create air vortices rather than turbulence behind the car, and in doing so reduce drag while optimizing down-force. And I thought it was lower so you could see out the back!
Brake duct inlet in place of rear quarter window
The car is just a blast to drive, and it was an easy switch from the long and low Supra TT and XKR. The attention it draws is unreal, and you do have to watch that others around you don’t get distracted and cause an accident. Rear quarter vision is non-existent, but the back-up camera is excellent for showing what is directly behind you. I park in such a way that I can drive forward wherever possible. Ride quality is surprising good, and I was prepared for it to be much less compliant. It’s quite similar to the hi-po/luxury XKR grand tourer on 20” wheels we traded.
Dual side exhaust
Now for the negatives…I’m going to have to get back to you on that one since after just 7 days I haven’t discovered any yet, with the possible exception of the exhaust if I find it gets annoying on a longer trip. Otherwise I love that too, and have earplugs in the glove box just in case! If you were to do a spread sheet of all the features that various super cars have you would likely find several that the TA or other Vipers don’t have. Most buyers would trade the unique points of the Viper for heated and cooled seats, or E-diff, or AWD, or an auto/DCT, or CCB.s, or a vert, or the more modern creased-edge designs or whatever, and that’s all good. But I was happy to trade-in a car with some of those features for the simplicity and performance focus of the Viper…and couldn’t be happier.
Today I attended a 6th Gear Lapping day at Mosport. It was a rather cold, blustery and wet day, but one filled with great accomplishment. I started with some informal skid pad circles in an empty parking area, gently adding speed until tire grip was exceeded. The fronts gave good feedback well before they let go, and when they did a slight throttle lift shifted enough weight over them to regain grip, and resume the fixed radius circle. The rear remained glued unless enough power was suddenly added to provoke a shift from natural under-steer to throttle-on power over-steer.
Mosport paddock
Because it was my first time on the track since it was significantly changed last year, and my first track day in the TA, 6th Gear offered to send me out with a professional coach. I had him do the skid pad routine as well to familiarize himself with the car before I took it out on the track.
He helped guide me to the best wet line, and made some helpful suggestions regarding driving smoothness that seemed rather essential in today’s conditions. He’s instructed in a number of Viper’s in the past and said this was the first one he wasn’t scared to be in! Not sure if that was because the car felt better to him, but I’m going to go with the driver’s confidence-inspiring high level of skill being the reason! He didn’t have any students for the morning so ended up being out with me for about two hours. A fellow was also there with his ACR-X but it was too wet to drive, and he came out with me for maybe 25 minutes after lunch during the only brief time it stopped raining. We also spent a long while talking Viper’s and the differences on the Gen V.
Taking the "Wet Line" where more grip can be found
The car handled like a champ. I got it a bit loose twice, once going into T5a with a slightly abrupt downshift, and once going into T8 with a bit too much trail-braking. Rear just stepped out a little and was easy to gather up. I had the full ESC on of course, and I never noticed it intervening, although I would think it had been. Nothing like the XKR where it would kill the throttle on corner exit if it had sensed any loss of grip what-so-ever. Rear grip under throttle was better than I had expected, but there was just a hint that I was accelerating at the tire’s limit, and the coach sensed it also. A slight bump in the back straight caused a bit of slip for an instant. I saw 181 kph during one glance, and that felt plenty fast in the rain through the slight kink of T7 and cresting the hill right before T8. Great gearing, and nice close ratios where you want them. My unusual heel and toe technique doesn’t work in this car, but a wider pair of driving shoes should fix that. The car is quite sensitive to slight steering and brake inputs, and I recall Randy Pobst commenting that you have to slow down your hands on the wheel a little. A couple of other drivers commented on how much spray the car kicked up with the wide tires. Those damn mmmassive tires...I just hate that, and the thunderous exhaust that shook the tower and drew universal praise Btw, I’ve been meaning to ask...is ringing in the ears normal?
Looking forward to peeling back the next layer of performance with a dry day there on May 14th, and feel lucky my first day was focused on being smooth on a slippery track!
My 7 day ownership focus was getting it ready for a successful day at the track, and it came together well. I have 5 more track days booked before the end of next month and will be sure to share hightlights of those.
to tell you the Truth,The Viper have ALWAYS been my dream car over the Jaguar and you couldn't have picked a better upgrade and I do believe I will go that same route.The only cars better than a Jaguar in this order is the Viper,then ALL Mclarens.I would say Aston Martin too but I consider Aston Martin as Jaguars equal
If you'd like to chat when considering a Viper purchase don't hesitate to contact me...always happy to share my experiences and passion!
Hi Bruce H - Long time no see! Of course it's been me who had been missing from this forum after selling my XKR. See you still driving your Viper. Sounds like you still have a blast and not even thinking of selling it. I'm somewhat different. When I start losing interest in cars I sell them. No exception, no favorites. Had some great cars, great memories. Sold all my racing cars years ago when I realized I was getting too old to properly keep up with fast moving things on the track. Oh, well, that's how it goes.
These days, I still have a couple of quick cars. I still have my 2015 C7 Vette, one of my all time favorites. Of course, I redid the suspension entirely, gave it extra cooling (GM should have done that) and put on the RE-71R tires (275 - 305) to make it a superbly handling car. Just local fun, no racetracks anymore. You might remember, for street driving I always preferred front engined cars while for track, mid engine was the preferred configuration. Of all my fast cars, including the two Lamborghinis, the Vette is probably the second fastest one for track driving. First, the undisputed champ was my twin turbo RX-7 with 500+ variable HP and only 2600 lbs. Fabulous street machine but also sold it.
A few months ago the boredom of Covid urged me to break out of the routine. What do I do to accomplish that? Of course, buy a car! So, I did return to Jaguar, getting the F-Type R. I consider it a significant improvement in handling and feeling to the XKR. Still, head to head, it could not touch my C7 on any tracks. If for no other reason is that the F-Type is 700 lbs heavier! Yes, but still fun, that V8 sounds like a very mean cat at wide open and still moves with the great leaps of the Big Cat while looking gorgeous. Thanks, Covid-19!
These days, the cars are largely sitting in my garage due to all the Covid restrictions. When I do get them out over my local winding roads, they put the smile back on my face and the sense, that: Life Is Good!
PS - would someone point me to the way to update my signature? I had spent a lot of time trying but just can't find the "edit page".
Hi Albert,
Where in California are you? Even with Covid, there are still plenty of car meets around Southern California. A friend and I take our matching Panteras every few Sundays through the Santa Monica Mountains out to the Malibu Country Mart parking lot on PCH, where hundreds of great cars gather each Sunday morning, so we combine a nice drive to and from the San Fernando Valley with an informal car show. Also every couple of months, an organization called Malibu Autobahn will stage a gathering early on Sunday morning followed by about a 90 minute drive through some great roads from Agoura almost to Oxnard and then back to Zuma Beach where there is a followup meet for a couple of hours. Typically, 300-400 cars attend, mostly but not limited to exotics. And then sometimes a group of us will go out through either the Santa Monica mountains and canyons or through Angeles Crest roads and enjoy ourselves without anyone else. Come join us sometime, we find a place to go most Sundays. PM me if you're interested. Mine on the left, my friend's on the right, and an F-type to the right of that.
Hi Albert, sounds like you're still enjoying the passion! I have a long history of considering selling cars that I seldom drive and don't really need. And when that happens it always turns out the same way...I drive it and fall in love with it all over again and realize I'm unlikely to get a bigger rush with another! I figure I'm set with the two I have now, and if I change anything it will be the AWD RAV-4 I mostly use in winter.
A track buddy brought a friend to Mosport with his F-Type SVR AWD I think it was. Not sure what exhaust was on it, sounded mean, but it definitely bordered on obnoxious! Glad to hear you're still enjoying the modded C7. During Covid I've been focused on renovations including putting finishing touches on my home theater, which I used to design and build along with custom lighting prior to retiring. Passion, turned business, turned passion.
To change your signature go to the forum home page, click on CP found on the left side of the header, then scroll down to Edit Signature. I updated mine a day or two ago,
Hey tberg, you make me want to move to California for those meets and drives. And then there's also all those great tracks out there!
Hi Bruce, it took several months longer than when I expected to get the Pantera back, however, it came back meaner and more beautiful (especially interior) than ever before. My favorite change which is also giving me the most headache right now is the fuel injection. Starting the Pantera was always a challenge when it was carbureted, but now a simple flip of the key, and it roars to life. (And when I say roar, I mean it's one of the loudest cars I have ever heard, and it still has mufflers). BUT, after the car gets warm or runs for a while, something in the Holley Fuel Injection ECU is shutting down fuel delivery and left me in some dangerous situations. After letting the car cool for 10-20 minutes, it will restart and drive. It's been back at the shop for the last month or so trying to figure out exactly what is happening and what needs fixing or replacing. And during that span we improved the cooling system again, changed the alternator, insulated the gas tank, etc. just to make sure that heat wasn't causing it. Hopefully, this coming week it will get figured out. Now with the much more powerful engine in it, I would still like to break my vow of never tracking it again, just to test its parameters in a controlled environment, and I will get it up to Buttonwillow sometime soon. Finally, while I'm missing my Pantera, my misery of not having it is assuaged by the return of my favorite car design of all time from restoration, a 1968 Pontiac GTO. It's just so beautiful that even though it handles like a Cadillac limousine, it's just so sexy. And it's been a popular car for movies and photo shoots as I'm continuously contacted about day rentals for those purposes. A friend of mine recently bought a Porsche Turbo, and I'm sure when that boost comes on, it must be just terrifyingly quick. Glad you're still enjoying your Viper. Im' no longer in touch with my previous business partner who had bought one before you, so I don't know if he still has or tracks it. If you're ever out in So Cal, give me a holler, and we'll take the "cat" out for a spin, you can keep it for a weekend.
Hi Albert, sounds like you're still enjoying the passion! I have a long history of considering selling cars that I seldom drive and don't really need. And when that happens it always turns out the same way...I drive it and fall in love with it all over again and realize I'm unlikely to get a bigger rush with another! I figure I'm set with the two I have now, and if I change anything it will be the AWD RAV-4 I mostly use in winter.
A track buddy brought a friend to Mosport with his F-Type SVR AWD I think it was. Not sure what exhaust was on it, sounded mean, but it definitely bordered on obnoxious! Glad to hear you're still enjoying the modded C7. During Covid I've been focused on renovations including putting finishing touches on my home theater, which I used to design and build along with custom lighting prior to retiring. Passion, turned business, turned passion.
To change your signature go to the forum home page, click on CP found on the left side of the header, then scroll down to Edit Signature. I updated mine a day or two ago,
Hey tberg, you make me want to move to California for those meets and drives. And then there's also all those great tracks out there!
Stay well guys!
Bruce
Good to hear back from you. Yes, I understand falling love with fine cars. Still doesn't stop me from selling them and regretting it at times... :-). Yes, the F-Type exhaust can be rather loud, particularly if you switch it to "loud mode". Some testers called the sound, "Hooligan". I won't argue that description. Interestingly I saw a 1/4 mile test, the F-Type R vs the SV model and the regular R won. Reason given was the extra weight on the SVR. Also an other guy dynoed the regular R to the same 570 HP as the SV should be. So, who knows what is going on between the two models. Doesn't matter to me, I don't treat is as a race car but, as a fun tourer.
Thanks for the suggestion for editing the signature. I'll check next and hopefully find it...
Originally Posted by tberg
Hi Bruce, it took several months longer than when I expected to get the Pantera back, however, it came back meaner and more beautiful (especially interior) than ever before. My favorite change which is also giving me the most headache right now is the fuel injection. Starting the Pantera was always a challenge when it was carbureted, but now a simple flip of the key, and it roars to life. (And when I say roar, I mean it's one of the loudest cars I have ever heard, and it still has mufflers). BUT, after the car gets warm or runs for a while, something in the Holley Fuel Injection ECU is shutting down fuel delivery and left me in some dangerous situations. After letting the car cool for 10-20 minutes, it will restart and drive. It's been back at the shop for the last month or so trying to figure out exactly what is happening and what needs fixing or replacing. And during that span we improved the cooling system again, changed the alternator, insulated the gas tank, etc. just to make sure that heat wasn't causing it. Hopefully, this coming week it will get figured out. Now with the much more powerful engine in it, I would still like to break my vow of never tracking it again, just to test its parameters in a controlled environment, and I will get it up to Buttonwillow sometime soon. Finally, while I'm missing my Pantera, my misery of not having it is assuaged by the return of my favorite car design of all time from restoration, a 1968 Pontiac GTO. It's just so beautiful that even though it handles like a Cadillac limousine, it's just so sexy. And it's been a popular car for movies and photo shoots as I'm continuously contacted about day rentals for those purposes. A friend of mine recently bought a Porsche Turbo, and I'm sure when that boost comes on, it must be just terrifyingly quick. Glad you're still enjoying your Viper. Im' no longer in touch with my previous business partner who had bought one before you, so I don't know if he still has or tracks it. If you're ever out in So Cal, give me a holler, and we'll take the "cat" out for a spin, you can keep it for a weekend.
Hope you get that gorgeous Pantera running reliably again! The GTO looks immaculate! I am up in the Sierra Foothills near Sacramento. It is a way from the LA area. I did get my F-type in LA from Rusnak Jaguar. I drove it back up to North under nearly impenetrable smoke just as the great fires were burning down to the edge of the pavement on both sides of the Highway 5. Was happy to realize that the freeway ride of the F-Type was far superior to that of my troublesome 2012 XJL and even better than the XKR or our XF. Feels like the suspension engineers finally woke up from their coma! Also, doing an average of 75-85 MPH, I got a ridiculously good 29 MPG :-). So, nice car altogether but, not for the track.
tberg, that's a stunning GTO for sure, and not in a color common for it I wouldn't think...which is good. I applaud your dedication to both cars as that's what it takes to persevere through daunting restoration challenges. I'm sure the Pantera will get sorted and it will all have been so worth it. I've only ever seen a Pantera once, and I remember its appearance, color, wheels, and the awe I felt probably 40 years or more years ago. Man did it make an impression. Yours looks spectacular! Thanks for the great offer. We had been planning a road trip in the Viper to visit friends and do a few track days in Utah, California, Arizona and Nevada back in 2017 but I developed a back issue that cancelled that. We'd like to fly out instead and rent a car just to tour as there's so much to see and do just in California alone. Thanks for the offer. Always worried about you guys out there with what seems like never-ending fires. We just can't imagine when we watch the news.
Albert, it looks like you changed your signature! I see you had a 1970 XJL-6 and that it was your worst car ever. I've said the same about my 1970 XKE which makes me think they might have rolled down the same line! Despite that I just loved the car, likely party because it was my first car. I can tell you that it wasn't long before I bought a second car that was totally reliable! Sold it 8 years later to a fellow in Vancouver who had the car picked up in Toronto and shipped to him for a complete restoration. Bought it with 39,xxx miles on it for $4,200 and sold it with 46,xxx miles for $6,000. It suffered from the typical rusted out box sections behind the seats which is where all the support is on the convertible. That kind of repair was well beyond my abilities to have done at the time. Years later I'd have kept it and had it done right. Regrets, I guess we all have a few. I was pleased when I discovered that my next Jag was much improved...the 40 year newer 2010 XKR vert Who says you can never go back!
I remember helping you talk yourself into upgrading your XK to what ended up being the same year of XKR. Was that a good car for you? I had been gone for a year or so when you sold it and got the C7. And I definitely remember your major dissatisfaction with the '12 XJL and puzzled when you purchased the '12 XF. I think I wondered if you had hit your head one too many times on track or something, lol. Glad to see you're back in a jaguar and loving it.
If you'd like to chat when considering a Viper purchase don't hesitate to contact me...always happy to share my experiences and passion!
If only i was making more money than that.I just make a little under $40k a year and I would save and buy 1 if bills won't taking a chunk out of most of it.But if I ever stumble across a jack pot from somewhere,A Viper will be the next car I buy and Idk where to find them so you'll be the 1st guy i ask to help me find 1.I like those new C8 corvettes too and they really made the corvette a jaw dropper around the same price range.I'll still go with the Viper since I always wanted 1
I see you have a AM Rapide and Vantage. Beautiful vehicles that seem a notch above Jaguar. I was on vacation in Naples Florida in 2010 at a Jaguar/Aston/Porsche dealership comparing the XXR with the Vantage. Back and forth, each with a slight perceived advantage here and there, with no obvious winner, although I drove neither. I came home and chose the Jag vert mostly because of my fond memories and attachment to my XKE vert, but otherwise might have bought the Vantage. A friend recently bought a used Rapide. He loves it. Have you had good experiences with yours? I ask because some report spotty reliability with some AM vehicles which would put off buying. I wasn't a fan of my Jaguar dealer service department which influenced my decision to sell before the warranty expired.
I traded my V8V in on the Rapide. I needed the back seat for our dog and my wife cannot drive a manual. Vantage is a full sports car where even the XKR is still a GT. It was too sporty the need I had for a car at that time. The Jag vs. Aston is pretty far apart IMO. The steering, turn in, sounds, and many other things are of different car than the Jag. Both the Jag and Aston feel like they are their respective brands when driving. I don't get the constant comp's between the two and then someone saying they went with a Jag because of (fill in the blank). Very few get in a Jag and think it reminds them of an Aston or vice versa after driving. Both the Vantage and Rapide have been on par with all the Jag's I have owned in maitanance. The service bill and parts costs are generally more, but that is expected based on all their MSRP's. I would venture to say the V8V is an easier DIY car than the XK. The V12's are pretty well packed under the hood. I love both marques, but they're just different. Like Lotus and McLaren are just two different experiences and mind sets, yet similar in other respects.
I would recommend a Rapide (or late model DB9) if you want a "do it all" kind of car. Only draw back is that it's the size of an S Class and that really becomes apparent when parking. If I had an opportunity, I'd probably trade it for a DB9 GT, Vanquish or DB11 just to save some space in the garage. Everything just works on the Rapide and goes without issue. I get some error codes here and there, but they either go away or don't come back after I reset them. Same thing on the Jag's. The local dealership has made owning the car easier. Although they do not have loaner cars, they know what they're doing and get repairs done in short order. They store my 2nd set of wheels and really "look after" the car looking out for the car and my best interest. The local bunch of AMOC members do some fun events and some cross with other British car clubs.
I read that not all Aston Martin dealerships offer the same level of service or ownership experience. If I lived in a different locale, I may have bought something else. Exotic car culture in MA is very mature, especially if you own a Ferrari. Very easy to own in my state. Aston the dealer just moved to a larger location that will increase the market awarness of both Aston and Lotus. I look forward to them having events the previous location could not accomodate.
Great to hear you've been impressed and are enjoying the Aston's, which is high praise as you also know your Jags! What's always drawn me to Jaguar XK models and the Aston Vantage, DB9 and Vanquish was the curvaceous exterior body silhouette and styling, and in that regard I can't think of two premium brands that are more similar, but with the Aston handily taking the win.
Originally Posted by mosesbotbol
I don't get the constant comp's between the two and then someone saying they went with a Jag because of (fill in the blank). Very few get in a Jag and think it reminds them of an Aston or vice versa after driving. .
Let me have a go at that. I suspect some others would narrowed their search to these two models for the reasons I noted above. In our case we already had a true sports car and sports GT, both with manuals. I considered the Vantage to be a GT that can either lean in to be a Luxury Sports GT with a manual or a Luxury GT like the XKR with an auto. Since we already had a Sports GT with a stick we considered both with autos for more relaxed touring goals that my wife would be more comfortable driving. The XKR's superior auto and V8 powerband gave it the clear edge and many of the fine and bespoke details that some might have considered of paramount importance became less so at that point for us. With extensive research I was able to confidently buy both the XKR and Viper TA for specific goals without ever driving either.
Here's just a couple of good XKR vs Vantage V8 reviews that cover common buyer considerations...and I think you might like the last one the best!
...Albert, it looks like you changed your signature! I see you had a 1970 XJL-6 and that it was your worst car ever. I've said the same about my 1970 XKE which makes me think they might have rolled down the same line! Despite that I just loved the car, likely party because it was my first car. I can tell you that it wasn't long before I bought a second car that was totally reliable! Sold it 8 years later to a fellow in Vancouver who had the car picked up in Toronto and shipped to him for a complete restoration. Bought it with 39,xxx miles on it for $4,200 and sold it with 46,xxx miles for $6,000. It suffered from the typical rusted out box sections behind the seats which is where all the support is on the convertible. That kind of repair was well beyond my abilities to have done at the time. Years later I'd have kept it and had it done right. Regrets, I guess we all have a few. I was pleased when I discovered that my next Jag was much improved...the 40 year newer 2010 XKR vert Who says you can never go back!
I remember helping you talk yourself into upgrading your XK to what ended up being the same year of XKR. Was that a good car for you? I had been gone for a year or so when you sold it and got the C7. And I definitely remember your major dissatisfaction with the '12 XJL and puzzled when you purchased the '12 XF. I think I wondered if you had hit your head one too many times on track or something, lol. Glad to see you're back in a jaguar and loving it.
Happy Motoring guys,
Cheers!
Gosh, what a nightmare that '70 XJL-6 was... kept me from even thinking Jaguar for over 20 years. The list of troubles were too long to list. One of my "favorite and funny " memories when I was driving over at night the pitch dark, winding roads of the CA coastal mountains when all my electrics simply went out. Happened frequently! Before I could have done anything about it, there was the Red Light of the CA Highway Patrol behind me. John Wayne staggered up to my window and announced: "Sir you are driving without your lights..." My frustrated response was, "No ****..." I told him to watch me fix it as I reached under the dash to shake the wire bundle. The patrolmen immediately went for his gun! I threw my hands up and explained to him what I was going to do. He watched with his hand on his still holstered gun. I reached down shook the wires and the lights came back immediately. The guy said in a stern voice: "Sir, you have to have that fixed". My still frustrated answer: "Fix WHAT...??? This is a Jaguar, this is NORMAL! It can not be fixed!"
Remember when I purchased the 2005 XK and drove it home; my wife walked around the car and said: WOW! IT is beautiful... what brand is it?" When I fessed up that it was a Jaguar she incredulously screamed at me: "Have you lost your mind...??? Don't you remember...???" I explained to her that Jaguar was under Ford then and the quality was greatly improved. :-).
Yeah, I kept buying Jaguar after that 2012 XJL fiasco, hoping that the suspension issue was isolated to that model only. Actually, I test drove the F-Type R as soon as it came out and noted that the highway ride of this high performance model was far superior to my luxury sedan! Still can not understand what the heck the Jaguar suspension people were thinking...?
Edit: To answer your question: Yes, the 2010 XKR was a great car with zero issues. Of course, I only had about 13K miles on it when I sold it to the local dealer who, after checking the car out, actually gave me a check for MORE than what we agreed over the phone.
Albert, I bet that officer has retold the story of pulling you over more than a few times! Someone should assemble a book of stories as told by their Jaguar owners. It would be filled with lots of pride and happy memories... and more than a few horror stories. Jaguar Owners, The Rarest Breed Of All.
Glad to hear the XKR was a great car. If I had a spare garage space I'd be tempted to find and buy a fine example, a convertible again because I really miss not having that base covered. They still turn my head every time I see one.
Here's just a couple of good XKR vs Vantage V8 reviews that cover common buyer considerations...and I think you might like the last one the best!
Handling and braking were low points on my XK, along with the leather quality and seat design. It is a more useful every day car, but the Vantage is a real sports car, XK is like a DB9.
DB9 vs XK/XKR is a better comparasion. Between the two of them, I would put handling and braking back to Aston. The extra 100K on the Aston is not for nothing. I would pick an XKR over an older DB9 for the same money, but going all in it has to be an Aston in any side-by-side.
One thing on the Aston it takes a lot of driving it to "get it". Some cars are dream right out the drive way, but Aston take more time to get to know.
^It's a shame you didn't own a newer XKR to compare with your Vantage as that would have made for a more fair performance comparison.
I couldn't find a a proper DB9 vs XKR review but I did find this, which is more relevant to my update. Autocar compares the '14 911 Turbo S with a '14 Vantage, and by one of my favorite and trusted reviewers...
Great people, always welcome here.
And I love to fully explore and appreciate a fine sports cars performance safely and legally on a race track. I'm sure some of you have been able to explore the performance of your beauties through some twisties as well.
Btw, I’ve been meaning to ask...is ringing in the ears normal?
