So I got my XKR out of the shop on Monday(fuel pump replacement), and Tuesday was nice in Seattle so I took down the top and drove the long way to my meeting after work. When I went to close the top I noticed it was moving real slow. I had to recycle the process to get it to completely close and roll up the back windows. Once my meeting was over I went to open the top again and it had a hard time releasing the front latch. It took about 3 tries of recycling close-open using the switch before it finally did open. After I pulled away, but before I left the parking lot I noticed a “Convertible Top Not Latched” error message on the dash, whaaaaaat? The top was open, why would I get this message? So I stopped and tried to recycle the close open process, which was worse. The top practically quit closing half way so I put it back to the open position. Then noticed the front latch had not receded, which it does when fully open, that must have been causing the error message. All of this I was doing with the switch never manually.

When I got home I tried again with the same issues partial closing never completing. I then gently pulled the top to the closed positing and cycled the switch a few time to try to get it to latch, after three tries, I thought it latched, but the rear windows wouldn’t roll up, and the “message light” was still present. I gave the top a little tug at the edges and cycled the switch again and it finally latched and the windows came up, whew!!!

I read the forums all night for all the previous symptoms of convertible top failures, with much fear and dread. Did I do too much by hand? I tried not to force anything. I never did see any “green” fluid as others have noted, but when the top was trying to latch it did appear to be miss-aligned. Since the car was recently in the shop, and battery disconnected, is there any “re-programming” required for the convertible top operations, like the windows? Others have mentioned the lack of hydraulic fluid and the petcock which I’ll check the next moment I have to check out more details. Maybe something got bumped with the fuel tank removal for the fuel pump replacement? I’ll try to follow up with more info If and when I find anything “unusual”, as if I would know.

 

Sure sounds like a low fluid situation to me.

 

The first thing that came to mind was low fluid. That's easy enough to check. I'm sure Gus will be checking in soon. He's the resident expert on the 'vert tops.

 

After a baterry disconnect, the windows need to be resynced. Lower both windows and hold the button until you hear a soft click, Raise both windows and hold the button until you hear a soft click. I usually do it twice for good measure. Also check your fluid level is between the two lines and double check your petcock.

If you still have problems, post back.

 

MJW,

Low fluid sure sounds right. There are two hash marks on the pump's fluid reservoir. You want a fluid level something close to the lower mark with the top up, the upper mark with the top down.

While you're in there, you'll see a a long skinny valve handle on the pump body. Turn that clockwise, if it wants to move (it shouldn't), until you hit a stop. No need to twist hard on this.

The other thing to look for in the neighborhood of the pump would be any sign of stray fluid. All should be dry.

Keep us posted ...

 

If you heard variable pitch whining noise from the back, then you are low on fluid. Cheapest and quickest way to get fluid is VW dealership, buy VolksWagen EOS convertible top fluid, it is $20/qt.

 

Ok so low fluid seems to be the consensus, which I’ll check first, what’s the product to use for fillup?

thanks for all the replys

 

I think what you want is Pentosin CHF 11s which is about $20/quart at stores like NAPA.

Doug

 

The fluid called for is Pentosin CHF 11S. I bought mine at NAPA...about $20

 

In my experience VW dealers are the only ones who keep it in stock, but then there is always friendly Jaguar dealer near you

 

Except Jaguar seems to think the exact same fluid in the exact same container is worth $70.

 

It sounds like you got a lot of help. Check the fluid then check the petcock closed on the pump. You may need to operate your top a few times to get it back in sync. After the incomplete open and close operations the system has a tendency to go out of sync. Do not panic!

 

I checked the fluid level in the pump and the petcock and all was fine. The fluid was between the indicators, but closer to the bottom while the top is up. and the petcock was at the stop, and I did not force it at all.

The first thing I did was make sure I had properly reset the window height, then I tried the lowering the top... and voilà it worked just fine, raised and lowered again, raised after returning home, no problems.... must have been gremlins before.

I'm happy now (for now) thanks everyone for your responses.

mjw

 

I had a simular problem after a line replacement. Air in the lines will cause slow/incomplete operation. The circuit self purges after a few operations.

 

MJW- I don't know how far and often you drive the car daily but be sure to drive in normal fashion for at least 50 miles after a battery disconnect so the car (transmission control module) can "relearn" its shifts, etc. I have read and experienced this several times - the transmission just seems to behave much better after the learning period.

 

I'm not saying this isn't so, but never have understood it. If there is air somewhere up near the latch for example, with this being a push-pull rather than a circulating system, I don't see how the air could ever work its way back to the pump and be expelled.

Can somebody explain this for me?

 

It does not have to, air bubbles get compressed to the fluid pressure and actuate along with the rest of the fluid just fine. This works, because pump keeps pumping, until electric switch tells it to stop, unlike your break pedal, that only has one foot pump to stop the car and if system is full of bubbles, pedal needs few pumps.

 

I'm fine with that.

But people have experienced the top acting up in one way or another, and then sort of curing itself over several cycles of operation, and this has been explained as the hydraulic lines purging themselves of air. Maybe the explanation is off the mark? If so, I don't know of another one, and so I'm still stuck as to how the cure comes about.

 

System will eventually purge itself of air bubbles, since fluid moves in and out and bubbles are agitated, so slowly some will come out through the oil tank.
After I replaced entire lines, top latch and the rest of the system started to work immediately, so I suppose it purges air quickly.

 

To be honest, I still don't see it. As you said above (and I agree) even if there were air in the lines, it should just compress and things should work. Maybe a bit slower, but they should work. That's not what people seem to observe (at first, until a few cycles).

On the other hand, if we think air in the lines could cause trouble, I'm having trouble with the idea of air bubbles migrating all the way down from places like the latch area back to the pump (they would have to move against gravity all the way down the door pillar).

How about this: maybe air in the pump itself ... some sort of cavitation in there? If so, it seems like from there air could find its way to the reservoir and out of the system without too much trouble. Plausible?