XK8 Conv wont start
 

I have a 2000 XK8 convertible that refuses to start. The car has been stood without starting for some time though it ran well before it was laid up.
When it was running the alarm system gradually died, at first it was intermittent when using the remote, sometimes it de-armed sometimes I had to unlock the door. And then finally I had to always use the door lock for arming/dis-arming and only had about 10 seconds to turn the ignition on before the alarm would sound.
Now it does not function at all, no chirps, no light next to gear shift. No response to trying to program the remote.
As said the engine will not start, turns over great but there is no fuel pressure in the rail. Also the roof will not operate, nor will the fuel flap or boot release. I have swapped all the relays around and checked all the fuses with no result. Door windows work OK but rear windows do not drop, Central locking also works but when unlocking the drivers door the mechanism operates 3 times.
I suspected the SLM, it had a unit (LJE2600BC)with a 2003 date code so must have been changed previously as the VCATS label in the boot says it should be LJE2600BB so I changed it for an LJE2600BB but again no result so my thoughts moved to the BPM which I removed today but no visible signs of water damage or component failure.
Does anyone have any suggestions? Should I get a diagnostic check? Should I get a replacement BPM?
Thanks
Tony

They don't like standing - usually the fuel pump dies. That would explain the lack of pressure. Change the fuel filter, too.

You seem familiar with Jag’s problems
 

Tony2JagsToo,

Hi, from your name you certainly seem seem familiar with Jag’s and seem to have dug into the problems already.

From my limited knowledge (sorry if I’m teaching you to suck eggs) have you checked
1. Battery charge ok
2. Battery cables ok esp +ve connection to HPP junction box and ground connection to body
3. Inertia kill switch ok
4. Can you hear fuel pump priming before key start as you say there’s no fuel pressure at the valve on the rail. Failed fuel pumps are common after long lay offs.
5. Was SLCM module programmed to the car (AFAIK these are not plug and play)
6. Are you getting a spark?

My advice is to concentrate on the no start before tacking the window issues.

Thanks for both speedy replies, not that familiar with Jags, more experience with Land Rover stuff which also suffer from wonderful electronic witchcraft, it sounds like I need to change the pump which was the first thing I attempted but gave up. I finally decided the only way I could get to the pump would be by cutting a large hole in the panel above the tank. Under the car I could barely see the pipes and trying to disconnect them was not possible. I could drop the axle assembly but having done that before I decided a 4 inch hole might be easier. The hole got shelved when I realised the roof and other things did not work.
I cant hear the pump run at all so it has to be suspect. Battery was charging OK and kill switch is OK. I haven't checked the battery and earth cables yet but will do. The engine tried to run when the rear was jacked up, a bit of fuel must have got through, somehow, but it was just for a couple of seconds so spark is okay.
I did not know the SLM had to be programmed to the car, I was told they are plug and play. My understanding is they are programmed on the assembly line to suit the options and market the car is sold in. So a unit from the same country should work I would have thought. Where would you get it programmed? Would I need to take the car?

Tony, there are some well documented pump replacement threads on this site. It's not as impossible as it looks, just the right tools and draining the tank make it a few hour job, the second time. LOL
Those connections over the rear end can be difficult to push on or pull off, but a hole for your left arm is there with a little effort. Gus has a great write up on all the disconnect items and Jon89 and I did this back in January with a little extra info on the tools to make it easy. JagRepair is Gus's site.

Thanks Wayne, I looked at a lot of info on removing the tank/pump before I went under the car, I also spent about 2 days on my bike trying to find a way of even touching the pipes. Maybe my arms don't bend in the right places. Anyway I decided a hole from above would be a lot easier, the panel is covered by trim so it wouldn't be seen later and wont cause any harm.
Tony

Bike should read back, though I wish I had been on my bike.
Tony

For all other than the no-start, the SLM is a common element to these issues, so perhaps it's not communicating properly with the car. Do the reversing lights & rear fogs work?
Fuses #1 (5A) and #10 (15A) in the trunk fusebox both supply power to the SLM.

According to Jaguar Heritage, the LJE2600BB is superseded by the LJE2600BC, so your replacement is valid. I imagine that it has been programmed if it has worked in the past. I'd put the original BC back in so you're not introducing any other variables.

Tony, give us a good write up on how you got it done.
By the way I was head toward the front of the car, legs out the back. OH, 79 at the time. We didn't even take the tyres off. It took longer to figure out tools to make it work than the job itself. Inside the trunk can put you in a cramped position, but I had Jon, he's 6'8" and just grabbed the tank and pulled it out. You got one of them? Big help.

Last night I started by checking the battery cables and earth connections, all bright and shiny. I tried starting the car and it tried to fire a few times until I ran the battery down. I took the battery of my E type and continued turning it over with the occasional splutter of life but eventually I gave up and put the batteries on charge.
Today with a fully charged battery you would swear it was going to run but hasn't. I have left the LJE2600BB in place. So now I remembered to check fuses 1 and 10 as Michaelh suggested, lo and behold, there wasn't a fuse 10 in place, how? I haven't removed it and I'm the only one with a key. Anyway I put a fresh fuse in place and changed number 1 fuse just in case. tried to start the engine again, still no luck just the occasional splutter of life. Nearly forgot, when I put the No. 10 fuse in the door locks operated. So I then check the roof and the rear windows drop and lift which tells me thats OK, then the filler flap and that worked, so I checked the reverse and fog lights, they work OK. Next step, can I programme the remote? Yes, remote locks and unlocks the doors. So now I seem to have everything working except the fuel pump. Got other work to do today so will keep thinking about cutting the hole, I got a 5 inch hole saw from Toolstation. I don't want to be on my back under the car again, I get dizzy when I get back up and its horrible, also my ticker doesn't like pumping blood to a raised arm for any length of time. (heart failure) Thats what smoking does for you!
I also need to keep a look out for the fuse thief, must check the cctv recorder. I know for sure it wasn't me, I spent 2 days trying to find my box of blade fuses for another job, wish I had thought about the Jag having them. Well, work is calling, hopefully soon Jezabelle (fast cat) might be running.
Tony

After all this cranking I wonder if you have bore wash.

Great progress and thanks for the feedback.
It's worth changing the fuel filter as intended in the meantime:- you just might get lucky. :)

Perhaps you have a team of mice running a clandestine autoparts store in your garage?

Thanks Michaelh but the car is outside, both double garages are occupied. Strange things happen in the night around here though.
Is there a separate fuel filter other than the one on the pump?
Today I decided the bore wash may be an issue as RJ237 suggested, I checked the fuel rail again and fuel came out, though not under any great pressure.
Anyway took all the plugs out, all bone dry and squirted oil into the cylinders. Same result, no start so the pump has to be the culprit.
Haven't heard any noises from the pump.
Another minor niggle, although everything seems to be working now except the pump, The roof opens and closes as it should alarm functions though there are no chirps but the niggle is, when keeping the dis-arm button pressed it used to drop all the windows and the arm button would close them if continually pressed but now nothing happens so I'm guessing thats a programmable option of the SLM and this replacement has not had the function programmed in it.
Might just cut the hole tomorrow.
Tony

Yes:- there's an inline underneath by the LHS rear wheel (remove this to give you more workspace). It's a tad awkward to get to as there's a heat shield in the way. I found it helped to unclip the fuel line forward as it gave a bit more juggle room to undo the pipe unions, and also removed the clamp with the filter. See this thread of Johnken's on its R&R:
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...5/#post1041709

It should run for approx. 2 seconds when you turn the ignition to build up pressure and then stop until the motor is running.

It could be that the active security sounder behind the RHS headlamp has finally expired. See this thread of DevonDavid's for where to find it, together with his surgical dissection:
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...1/#post1307558


Mmm. mine does this (global closing/opening) only with the key, but it's an earlier MY. Could have sworn it did from the remote, but I've just checked and it doesn't. I'm possibly thinking of herself's X5 or just losing the plot generally. It doesn't appear to be a programmable option on our X100s? See this post by u102768:
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...e2/#post417783

You know I might just be mixed up with the Range Rover (too many cars) that thing opens all windows and sunroof with the remote which is great in this weather.
Just tried with the key and the door windows drop but the quarter windows only drop about half an inch, I thought they should drop fully but no problem, main thing is to get the engine running.
Tony

These components, SCLM, BPM etc have to be taught to talk with one another, if I'm not mistaken. One of the things (and I'm at a stall for working in a 2003xkr) that has helped me in the past has been a super hard reset. Like disconnect the battery, clamp the neg and pos cables together for several hours (a day or more even) and try again. Never connect and disconnect ANY module (and it's easy to do) with the battery connected. Once the CAN systems in these cars has a "seizure" they do have to recover.

I got lucky and found a locking module that matches the old and it worked, but I have heard that that is not guaranteed. All of the symptoms you mention are SCLM connected ---boot, fuel door, hood (top)... You should have seen how happy I was the day I was able to drop the top, set the alarm etc by using the key in the door. Finicky finicky beasts these are.

My experience was with a 2003, may be different, but if the key, talking to the key module, talking to the major instrument cluster, talking to the, SCLM, talking to the BPM talking to the ECU do not all go well - having LOTS to do with the SCLM,,, you will get the symptoms you have. Including FP not being triggered... "Ok to fuel"...

In the ED, you'll find something that looks kinda like this. This is for the 2003,,, but there are similarities. Also, the SCLM is not on this diagram BUT you can see at how many different points along the path to start up the SCLM is involved in. If you look at the the ED for you model year, find the pages that describe the systems for the symptoms you're having I would bet many if not all in one way or another are connected to the SCLMs function(ing) in the system...

And as I always say,,, I could be wrong. I'm still learning here myself.

ps... Hey DAVE... Going to be revisiting the 2003 Swimming XKR tomorrow. First time in months. Got any words of encouragement, lol??? Omgoodness,,,

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.jag...c9d59434f1.png

Probably relevant to all Jag owners... keep at it. Keep a sense of humour and enjoy the ride ... even when the car is stationary, or up on jack stands.

If the car car was running, probably best not to disturb the delicate computer modules and check all the other things first. Otherwise you introduce new variables to an already complex problem.

Finally got the new pump today, had to make a couple of modifications as it had a different wiring connector and the top section (plastic) was a slightly larger diameter than the original. A few minutes trimming the rubber ring and a trip to a friends company to crimp new spade terminals on the wires had it ready to install. I had removed the pump via the inside of the car, not by crawling underneath as I could not find a way of disconnecting the fuel pipes. My unorthodox method turned out to be quite easy, I cut a 4 inch diameter hole in the panel above the tank from inside the car. This was directly above the circular access panel. with the panel removed from the tank and being knelt where the back seat lives it was possible to look inside the tank to locate the single screw holding the pump in place. With the screw removed out came the pump and the fuel level sender. My sender is not located on the rear face of the tank, it appears that 2000-2002 models had the sender next to the pump inside the tank. The only issue being I could not see where it had been located or how. It is totally different to the senders that can be removed from the rear tank face. Anyway with the new pump located and the screw back in place, little tip - I tied a length of dental floss around the screw just in case I dropped it into the bottom of the tank. It wasn't possible to see the screw whilst trying to locate it because my hand and arm filled the holes. Next job was locating the level sender, this was achieved by guesswork and feel, it is just a piece of square moulded plastic with the rheostat on one face and somehow it attaches to another piece of square plastic inside the tank, not sure how it is fixed but after maybe 3 attempts it seemed to be located correctly. Next connect the wiring and replace the access panel. I then decided to check functionality, put the key in the ignition, could not hear the pump run with ignition on but carried on and the engine fired up instantly. Had a little dance and poured a pint of Guinness in celebration. The engine runs as sweet as ever.
I will try to take some photos before everything is finally closed up and add them here. So if your nimble and not very tall, it is possible to change the pump without removing the tank or crawling under the car.

Cheers !
 

It's always nice to see a happy ending ! (or hear one)

Yippee! It’s alive!
 

Great news that you got it running. You’re not the first to have a fuel pump issue after a lay off, and you won’t be the last.

As it is an old JG, you need to get onto your rear quarter window problem. LOL!