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it has been suggested to me that I should only use gas with no ethanol. I would like to hear opinions about this and the octane level of gas for use at high altitude, 8000', both summer and winter
The ethanol in gasoline is fine for your daily driver where you're moving lots of fuel thru the system on a daily basis. In a fun car that sits, ethanol causes all kinds of problems because it absorbs moisture from the air. The water not only rusts the tank and fuel system but also combines with the ethanol to form an orange gel that will clog the system - carbs in particular. The ethanol will also attack the rubber components.
This video shows how quickly the ethanol absorbs water from the air. Of course, you may not have enough humidity at your altitude to be a significant problem.
Real gas is a lot more expensive than the regularly available diluted pump gas and isn't available in all areas. This site maintains a list of stations that sell real gas.
You can also use additives to combat the ethanol problems including products from Starbrite, BG, Stabil, etc. I have to use it in my lawn mower fuel because even though Austin is semi-desert the carb gets clogged with the orange gel. So I switched from a 14 gallon tank to a 5 gallon to keep the fuel supply fresher and I use the Starbrite additives.
Hope some of that helps. I don't know anything about jetting for high altitude.
Here we go again with the 'Satan Ethanol' stories. There's many of us here and on any old car enthusiast site that have been using E10 for many decades and have experienced NO difficulties whatsoever on '70s and earlier vintage cars that sit six months of the year.
Unless there's something unique to E-types, I can think of no reason why your experience would be any different.
My Jags all survive on ethanol fuel. My wife drove her 73 GT6 for 200K without the valve recede problem everybody warned about. My 58 was rebuilt in the 70's and I did not change to hardened seats, still no problem. If you race the E, use the track fuel as it has a lead additive and is 100 Octane. The big problem is winter storage or long term storage. Make sure to add a fuel stabilizer for storage and re-add if stored longer than directions per product. Use good fuel, if knocking (pinging) or having run on increase octane of fuel. You can retard timing, but you take the fun out of the drive. P.S. I use 93 Premium and fuel conditioner/stabilizer at all times. (will turn plugs a reddish color).
The ethanol in gasoline is fine for your daily driver where you're moving lots of fuel thru the system on a daily basis. In a fun car that sits, ethanol causes all kinds of problems
IMHO, I'd rephrase that to say "....might cause all kinds of problems...or might not"
because it absorbs moisture from the air. The water not only rusts the tank and fuel system but also combines with the ethanol to form an orange gel that will clog the system - carbs in particular.
The moisture aspect of the ethanol debate is certainly critical. I work with in-storage cars all day long and have no problems with E10 fuel....but they're stored in a dry environment
The ethanol will also attack the rubber components.
I'm not so sure.
Personally I think people are seeing problems with 10-20-30-40 year old hoses, gaskets, etc and are reflexively blaming the problem on E10 with no more thought on the matter than a hog would give in deciding if today was Sunday or Monday . Before all the flap about E10 we assumed that dried out/degraded/rotted rubber parts in a fuel system were just something you deal with on older cars and/or car that are in storage for long periods. I remember my first carb overhaul in 1974...to replace a dried out accelerator pump! "Auto Shop 101" my first year in high school! (That was after successfully replacing ignition points, of course! Remember those?)
This video shows how quickly the ethanol absorbs water from the air. Of course, you may not have enough humidity at your altitude to be a significant problem.
Right. this is why Ethanol is a bigger problem for boat owners than car owners!
You can also use additives to combat the ethanol problems including products from Starbrite, BG, Stabil, etc. I have to use it in my lawn mower fuel because even though Austin is semi-desert the carb gets clogged with the orange gel. So I switched from a 14 gallon tank to a 5 gallon to keep the fuel supply fresher and I use the Starbrite additives.
I've always found it fascinating that experiences apparently vary so much. Up here in western Washington it is very wet and E10 gas has been standard issue for like 20+ years....and I've never seen gelled fuel. And my yard equipment is merely keep under a lean-to type of shelter, not in a closed garage!
A year ago a fellow write that the E10 fuel he buys goes stale in 30 days. He was quite adamant! 30 days!
On the other extreme, last year I unearthed two 2003 Corvettes than hadn't been run in 5 years and they started and ran with the E10 fuel that was sitting in the tanks. A little smelly, though! Of course I replaced it with fresh fuel but those car are now being driven with no problems.
Well Bill, as you can see you might have asked about something non-controversial like abortion, big govt, taxes, the nanny state. But no you had to go for an issue driven by religious belief and emotional passions!
Corn (the source of US ethanol) is the largest crop in Minnesota. Here is an article by the MN State Govt describing the side effects of ethanol in fuel. They describe how the ethanol absorbs water, how it saturates and then precipitates out into the gel. They are trying to reassure fuel buyers but as I originally noted if you're moving a lot of fuel thru the system it generally isnt a problem. Even then they require gas stations to install sensors to monitor the water the fuel.
Pfffft. I can show you articles that warn about far worse things caused by E10- warts, male pattern balding, halitosis, impotence, loss of memory on and on.
No wait, that's old age.
What was the question?
Seriously- all of those horrid things have been predicted far and wide. As Doug and I and thousands of other have found- it doesn't mirror decades of real-life experience. Here's the inside of a gas tank on one of my older cars which has an open fuel system as referred to in your link. It's had nothing but E10 since 1996ish. The fuel in the pic is two years old. See any corrosion? See any water or phase separation?
Well Bill, as you can see you might have asked about something non-controversial like abortion, big govt, taxes, the nanny state. But no you had to go for an issue driven by religious belief and emotional passions!
Heh heh!
It's funny that you should use political examples. The E10 issue is clouded by politics. When the political opinionators ( "Journalists". Sorry. cough cough! ) on our favorite political radio/tv talk shows ballyhoo about it, you can bet your bottom dollar that the issue will be distorted!
When an advisory article from a vendor is so overtly used to promote products that the vendor is selling it always taints the veracity of the advisory a bit, IMHO.
I give them full credit for using words like "might" and "could" rather than "will", however, when referring to the possible side effects of E10.
Corn (the source of US ethanol) is the largest crop in Minnesota. Here is an article by the MN State Govt describing the side effects of ethanol in fuel. They describe how the ethanol absorbs water, how it saturates and then precipitates out into the gel. They are trying to reassure fuel buyers but as I originally noted if you're moving a lot of fuel thru the system it generally isnt a problem. Even then they require gas stations to install sensors to monitor the water the fuel.
Yeah, it sorta reads like an assurance to consumers that, since E10 absorbs water, gas station owners won't be intentionally watering down fuel. It doesn't seem like a condemnation of E10.
The water sensors sound great because "watered down fuel" from gas stations, intentional or accidental, is nothing new at all. It was a problem long before E10 was common and getting water-contaminated fuel was never a pleasure cruise even in the good old days, believe me! The phase separation adds a new twist to an old problem, though, I reckon.
gee god billybob!! had no idea pressed the hot button. but seriously, I really appreciate the input from everyone. because of the altitude and cold, often snow covered roads, up here in the colo winter prettygirl won't get out much between nov and march. the san luis valley is an agricultural area so non-ethanol fuel is available at stations with customers who run farm equipment. seems like a half tank of non-ethanol or adding a stabilizing additive to regular late in the season and firing up once a week in the garage would be a reasonable solution then running regular fuel during the driving season when I plan on putting 1500-2500 light years on the rocket.
I quite enjoyed the banter on the issue. you guys are an intelligent well spoken bunch and I am new to all this having only done maintenance on my triumphs and morgans in the 60's and 70's and building an Harley chopper in the 90's. now I am entering new territory taking on an E at 68 but, hey, I had to fulfill the dream.
if any of you ever want some really open roads this is the place. if I see more than 5 cars on my 50 mi trip to Alamosa co, home of the nearest supermarket, I think traffic jam. also, consider the Early Iron classic car festival/car show there in sept. Home
and firing up once a week in the garage would be a reasonable solution
Bill-
Use whatever fuel makes you happiest (the car couldn't care less), but please please do NOT start the engine unless you're going to take the car out and drive it for a good 20 minutes or more.
No engine needs to be started now and then to keep it in good running order.
I've been storing toys for 40+ years. Never once have I started them in the off season. Never once have I used pure gas or a stabilizing additive. Never once have I had a problem.
Almost all of the anecdotal stories heard about engines misbehaving are garden tools or boats that became clogged up, and not cars.
This off season clogging is nothing new- the almighty Seafoam that some swear by was invented in the '30s to deal with it. This is a good 40 years before Stan Ethanol became the source of all evil of course.
fuel for 69 s11
. Before all the flap about E10 we assumed that dried out/degraded/rotted rubber parts in a fuel system were just something you deal with on older cars and/or car that are in storage for long periods. I remember my first carb overhaul in 1974...to replace a dried out accelerator pump! "Auto Shop 101" my first year in high school! (That was after successfully replacing ignition points, of course! Remember those?)
