Hi guys,

Last weekend we have spent a day on the track and the newly fitted brake pads require replacement.
I'm afraid I will also have change the discs as they make a horrible noise when driving/bracking (like metal on metal).

I'm looking around to upgrade the system but can't find much, does anyone have experience with fitting better material?

Thanks,
Christophe

 

I had that noise happen after a track day in the XKR but it settled after a few days. It sounded as though I had a pebble between the caliper and the rotor

 

This is not normal, my pads and disks are still OK after about 30 hours of track time spread over last few years. OEM setup is really robust.

Question 1: Why do you think they require replacement? Is there vibration through the steering wheel? Did you check pad thickness? Is there scorching on disks?

Question 2: Do you by any chance do 2-foot driving (1 foot on brakes, 1 foot on accelerator)?

Question 3: Do you take cooldown laps?

Question 4: When you enter pits, do you leave car running and parking brake disengaged for couple minutes prior to shutting off?

 

My guess is the newly fitted pads were either a low quality pad from a local auto parts store or a street formulated pad like a porterfield R4-S that were used on a low speed track with no long straightaways that give a chance to cool the brakes. Agree with others above, OEM pads should not be one and done, something isn't right here.

Regardless, if you do need new pads and plan to track your car more often, look at some of the threads here regarding recommended pads for occasional, frequent, or continuous track use.

 

It’s always important to “bed in “ new pads....if not done they can easily overheat and can wear prematurely.
Most brake vendor sites include advice on how to bed in pads. Have a look.

 

Not only this above, but in my experience it doesn't hurt to RE-BED before an event... Learned that one on the Subaru STI and it saved me a couple seconds per lap

I did a two day non-stop weekend on the stock pads, probably about 100 1:15ish laps at the local track (very tight and turney) and I'm still using the stock pads. Something is not right!

 

Sounds like the pads overheated and got glazed. Breaking up that glaze using sand paper on a flat surface will restore useful life back into those pads. This is assuming, of course, that there is still adequate friction material left on the pads and you’re not rubbing on the backing plates.

 

Which model F type and size brakes do you have? (Adding the model and year to your signature often helps in answering questions).

 

Hi guys,

Thanks for the help.

I have a V6 base model 340hp from 2015. I checked some info about the brakes.
I think I have the standard brakes: Performance = 355 mm front and 326 mm rear. Is that correct?
Here are some pictures:


Back 1

Back 2

Front 1

Front 2


At a certain moment indeed the car showed that the breaks were overheated.

It was a small track but I always did few cool down laps.

I can see few cracks in the discs - is that normal?

I'll check pad thickness tomorrow but I'm afraid their gone as the sensor said to replace.

Would it be big difference to upgrade to the super performance brakes?
Or to have the following installed: https://www.autopartsonline.nl/p/remschijf-18008-s

 

If you have the standard brake kit, they may not hold up as well as the Performance Brake kit. There are some things you can do if you don't want to try and upgrade the brake system:

1. You'll need more track focused brake pads that can take higher heat
2. You can look at 2-piece rotors or cryo treated rotors. Just a note, piece are better but more expensive. Some people have said the cryo treated rotors don't last any longer than non-cryo rotors. I've had good luck with cryo treated rotors on my race car.

 

Yep, you definitely have the most basic and smallest F-Type brakes, 355 mm front and 326 mm rear.
If both the rotors and pads are OEM in good condition they should be good for at least a couple of track days so something was wrong with one or other.
Yes you can upgrade to the Super Performance brakes - 380 mm front and 376 mm rear - and they will perform better on track, but it will cost you a few thousand $ to do so. I have already linked you to my thread on changing the rear brakes from 325 mm to 376 mm and it's much the same for changing the front brakes from 355 mm to 380 mm but at least twice the cost.
Also you say the rear rotors are cracked and although that is possible I reckon it is doubtful.
The second pic could be showing cracks but it could just be dirt or brake dust.
The only way to tell is to remove the wheels and examine them properly.

Edit - you might consider just upgrading the front brakes to 380 mm, so you end up with the "High Performance" brake package.
A couple of people in the UK have done this on their XFs with zero problems and it's the exact same brakes on the F-Type, see here: https://www.jaguarforum.com/showthread.php?t=112063

 

Thi is 4 heavy track days on the 380mm front...

 

That was my thought as well. The marks near the hub were all I could discern from the pictures and that's not a likely place for cracks.

If you plan on more track time, this seems the best first step. Bigger front brakes, where most of the braking load is, would be advantageous. You mention a small track which might be heavy on braking with few sections to get some air over the brakes. Also, these cars are not exactly waif-like :/

 

If you track the car, bedding the pads properly, cleaning everything upon installation to avoid contamination and then using the brakes properly (hard and when needed) is key to ensuring the best performance and reliability. Every 5 track days a new set goes on.

 

Thanks guys - I'm just back from the garage. The discs and pads are gone.

We will fit EBC brake pads: https://www.ebcbrakeshop.co.uk/ebc-y..._p31343078.htm

Upgrading to a bigger size 380mm is too expensive, we will go for the sport discs: https://www.zimmermann-bremsentechni...nt-550336.html

Let's hope this brings an improvement.

 

The Zimmerman web site in US has a good article on bedding in brake pads...I’m guessing the one you show the rotors from does the same. It’s very important to bed them in.
my dealer seems to think when pads are replaced, the rotors need to be replaced as well. Many disagree with this analysis....

 

Perfectly sound analysis if you're footing the bill - more profit for the dealer!

 

Couldn't agree more. Realistically the rotors need changing when you get close to the minimum thickness and bedding serves multiple purposes aside from fully curing the resins in the pads, it also lays a layer of friction material on the rotor surface allowing for better braking performance.

 

Keep in mind that when changing brake pad manufacturers/compound, they may have difficulty removing the old transfer layer on used rotors. Not all compounds are made equal and some may not be abrasive enough to remove old transfer layer and apply it's own. While this won't brake braking terrible, the pads won't be able to perform as the manufacturer intends.

 

Just to add to Mahjik's point,
Swapping out pads to run a different compound can also lead to uneven pad transfer of said compound onto the rotor surface. The effect is varying degrees of friction level at different points in the rotation of the brake rotor causing a pulsation under braking that is usually misconstrued as "warped rotors".
It's important to start out with a fresh rotor surface when bedding brakes unless you are installing pads of the same compound.