Hello, I am planning on finally upgrading my 2016 5.0 awd R with the velocity AP tune kit. Before I do this I wanted to get my transmission fluid flushed and replaced.
I'm a big fan of red line oil products, but have not seen much information on their ATF.
They have four options I'm looking at.
Red line ATF D6 https://www.redlineoil.com/d6-atf
Red line ATF D4 https://www.redlineoil.com/d4-atf
Racing ATF (Type F) https://www.redlineoil.com/racing-atf-type-f
Lightweight Racing ATF https://www.redlineoil.com/lightweight-racing-atf

Can anybody explain the differences in layman's terms and why I should pick one over the others?
I don't plan on doing it myself, though I have read the DYI post on changing it.
The only information I've really been able to find was on an Acura forum where they were talking about different mixtures of the red line atf to achieve some kind of perfect mixture but that was way above my expertise.

Also has anybody purchased the ZF8 tuning package by Velocity AP? Because I was also considering doing that as well.

Thanks

 

Is there a reason why you would use one of these instead of the specified ZF Lifeguard 8?

 

Only because I've heard they make some of the best oils on the market, particularly for preventing damage or wear.
If I'm going to be adding a tune mod and pulley upgrade I want to make sure it has fluids that can handle the higher heat or stress that the oem fluids might not be rated to handle.
The car just broke 64k miles on it.

 

I didn't realize you could put your make and model in on their website, sorry.
They recommend D6

 

Just a note....It is not just about buying "GREAT" fluids any longer. The ZF transmission (and many other components) are built to certain specs that then require special fluids that have varying shearing qualities, specific gravity, viscosity, foaming behavior, flash point, friction modifiers etc.. Red Line may be totally fine in the ZF8HP70, but given the ZFs retail for ~$18,000...I stuck with the ZF Lifeguard 8(Which is special Shell synthetic fluid made for ZF - Shell L12108)…No reason to add any unknown variables to the mix IMO.

Good luck with your flush...

DC

 

And just to add, there are plenty of reports saying that the ZF 8HP70 should not be flushed and instead all you should do is "drain and refill".

 

I appreciate all the feedback.
Therock thank you for all your guides, I've browsed them quite a bit while lurking before making an account.

edit:
I found they have spec sheets for all their fluids. D6 Data sheet
And here is the spec sheet for ZF Lifeguard 8

I'm going to email redline if they have any experience with this transmission specifically
tried getting a hold of my dealer today but he hasn't gotten back to me yet

The density of both seems almost the same, though the flash point of the red line is a lot higher.

 

Yes I agree with your line of thinking! Great advise!

 

I have the VAP TCU tune as well. It makes shifts crisper, and at different intervals. Definitely livens it up a bit, and is noticeable...not earth shattering, but an improvement.

DC

 

Im not sure what happened but I edited my post last night and it looks like it disappeared. I posted the spreadsheets for both Lifeguard 8 and Red Line ATF D6.
And also got a response back from Red Line today
"Thank you for contacting Red Line Oil, the D6ATF is a suitable replacement for the original Lifeguard 8 fluid and compatible with the residual left during a change. It has been used extensively in these extremely popular ZF 8 speed transmissions with good results. " as per Dave Granquist

ZF Lifeguard 8 sheet
Red Line D6 ATF sheet
The weights or density were almost exactly the same, similar temps except Redline had a flashpoint of over 300' F and Lifeguard has ~200' F
I have a powertrain warranty so I'll talk to my jag dealer and see what he says, since they would know. They've told me a few other customers bring in their own red line.
I've used their engine oil so far with good results.

And I know there was mixed opinions from lurking for a while about when and how to do the ATF.

 

Certainly a preference on when (and I have provided the tech data sheet from ZF on what they recommend below), and there is good documentation on how...pretty precise process actually.

Thanks for posting the data sheets. That is great. One point of clarity/correction. The FLASHPOINT for Red Line appears to be >302 F but is >150 C. The ZF Fluid is listed as 206 C. Just FYI.

Good luck with your change...

DC

 

Ok i'll stick with the lifeguard then. Thanks for the correction on the flashpoints.

 

I started with a different question then think I answered it. They have a TCU tune now? Why did you go with it and what other observations do you have?

 

Yes...they do have a ZF8HP 70 Tune now (or maybe more aptly called a "shift strategy"). I honestly just tend to try everything I feel like the ZF is a very good/crisp AT, but wanted to see if this would get the shift strategy more closely aligned with revs and the tune. With my ECU/TCU/Cats Downpipes it also has a bump of 200RPMS on the top end, so it can hold a bit longer before dropping into the next gear.

As I mentioned, I would not call this earth shattering, but it does tighten up the shifting, and seems to shift at more appropriate times relative to the engine speed. VAP has some published material that it dropped some time in the test cars on some sprint runs. CHECK HERE And look at post #43 also about the RPMs

Hope that helps.
DC

 

Thanks

 

These transmission shift pretty dam quick to start with. Making them faster shifting just adds more heat and stress to the trans and cars which equals faster failures. My example is the Maserati Coupe. The CC auto shifts dam fast. I call it actually violent. They seem to last about 20 or 30K and need rebuilding. Why. The heat and stress from violent shifting. That trans is more of a manual that have been automated. I have a rare manual version of the car with 70K and never replaced a clutch or anything. Now I could speed shift my manual car and slam gears more like the auto but how long is it going to last. 20 or 30K? The heat has to go somewhere. Also the VAP Tunes I see running on these cars. Sure they put down some good power but where is all the extra heat and energy going? One place is the cats which I will guarantee are being cooked out fast as we speak. Be prepared to replace that exhaust about 20 or 30K down the line. Cats are not cheap if you have to pass smog or an exhaust for that matter.

 

I have new 200 Cell Cats and downpipes on mine. Curious how transmission shift speeds kill Cats? Also, how does changing gears faster add heat? Where does the heat come from, with the planetary gears and clutches changing faster not sure I see it? I also just changed the Fluids as a safety precaution.

Granted, any mods and for that matter, no mods and harder driving shorten the life of any car Just not seeing the HEAT issue with a different shift strategy? Also the Chrysler/Doge ZFs are made under a different licensing agreement for CMC to produce their own. And all ZF's have a flexible production/licensing agreement, such that every manufacturer can use varying Torque converters, stalls, and shift strategies...So again, not seeing where this would add heat to a failure point?

From what I understand...Maserati's are pretty much junk, and make even Jaguars a shining light with respect to reliability So not surprised they have a great failure rate.

As I mentioned...Any mods, or even driving harder will/can shorten the life. If I could not afford it, I would have left it all stock, and enjoyed my 100K Mile extended warranty. So I realize I am taking a risk...I just consider it somewhat calculated.

Thanks,
DC