Ok we're getting somewhere.

I've just got off the phone with a guy in California (confirmed by his phone number) who is involved with VMax behind the scenes.

It's a very tangled web this tuning business.

Deadline for this thread closing is extended 24hrs.

I'll update when I have something more concrete. Leave it with me.

 

I'll add that I believe I met "the Nerd" (AKA Matt) at the dyno while my tuning was being modified. Assuming that the other guy Bob was not the actual "Nerd", then Matt is likely him. He was the one coding on the laptop making fueling adjustments so that I could see what 12:1 AFR looked like across the board, etc. I was logging using my OBD tool, so I could see the changes in real time. Matt knew a lot about tuning other platforms and we talked for quite a bit about multiple issues. By the way, Bob is also a stand up guy.

Matt, if that is you, please verify who you are. If not, who are you?

His account of my dyno tuning session in the OC, assuming that he was the one there, is factually correct. The car was heat soaked for sure and was behaving badly as evidenced by the power curves. Also, I was running 91 octane gas on a hot day, so it was the worst case scenario.

 

Was it Matt or Bob?

 

Thanks for the info mate, pieces fit together now. You have met the guy I was talking with on the phone.

It seems they are in an equally awkward position as the members of this forum who got involved with VMax, perhaps even more precarious because of other "tuners" that they are involved with.

We are working on establishing mutual trust so that we can move forward here.

These guys are not to be named or identified on this forum any further than their first names. Thanks.

 

I'm very happy with my v max tune ---- the place Bill sent me to to have my f type r tuned was 23652 via fabricante , mission viejo ca. ---- can't remember the tuners name though -------like I said I'm happy with the tune and Bill called me the following day to see if I was happy and satisfied with the tune

 

Sorry, Cambo....this is just not going to go far to re-instill trust in either VMax or any of the tuners associated with him. The fact that these people cannot come out of the shadows to identify themselves, perhaps because they are moonlighting on the side and maybe even taking advantage of intellectual property developed by their regular employers, is also indicative of compromised integrity. This is no way to do business. I want to do business with people who are proud of what they have accomplished and willing to let their (full) name stand behind their service or product.

 

Well said.

" I want to do business with people who are proud of what they have accomplished and willing to let their (full) name stand behind their service or product."

 

+2

 

Putting myself in your shoes, I agree with you completely.

The issue here Lance is these guys are supplying tunes many different companies who are re-selling them & presenting them as "in-house" when it's actually not the case. (not just for Jaguars, but for many other makes as well).

So they are not going to "go public" because doing so could ruin their business, as well as the other companies who are re-selling their tunes.

It's quite a house of cards. I'm sure you've heard the tales of "all these tuners are re-selling the same tune they got from someone else" well yeah it's kind of like that.

Either I talk with them with assured confidentiality, or they walk away completely and everyone who got a tune from VMax is left with many unanswered questions.

Frankly there is no benefit for me personally to be any further involved here, it's purely in the interest of the members of this forum.

 

Why would these tuning companies need or want middlemen when they could just sell their tunes themselves?

 

I believe many of us are well aware of this and greatly appreciate your involvement. Thank you!

 

Googling the address, this appears to be an innocuous, independent automotive shop that goes by the name: American Tire and Brake.


Precisely!!!
Even in his assumed identity, "Bill" had made it clear at the very outset that his historical involvement was as a reseller to many "retail" tuning shops, and that one reason he didn't have a physical location or working website (aside from a P.O. Box) was because he didn't want the teams retail tuners to know he was bringing his platform for the F-Type directly to the consumer via this forum.

As tweaked as that explanation now seems, especially in light of everything that has happened, it sounds like the explanation was largely true in that Bill/Andy was protecting his association with Matt and/or Bob.

Moving forward, it would seem to this observer that the Nerd, or Nerds (presumably Matt and Bob), actually have the knowledge, experience, and intellectual property to perform a fabulous tune on these engines -- engines that, IMHO, Jaguar puts on the street with an incredibly conservative set of ECU parameters, leaving a tremendous amount of power on the table -- and the tune that the nerds can produce, given the time to make the tweaks that are required is unmatched by any other source to date... though that could change over time.

The problem here is that the man in front of the whole story, Andy, who by many accounts demonstrates a tremendous passion for his craft, also appears to get mired in his own success. When things start going well, it appears he is unable to handle the volume: the added business, the ramped up communications between the tuner, customer and dyno facility, the monetary transactions which involve both collecting from the customer and paying the nerd tuners, and Andy cracks under the stress of it all, spiraling out of control. It appears to be a pattern for Andy that has repeated itself several times.

The best of all worlds for the members of this forum interested in a top notch tune, would be for the nerds with the great IP to find/recommend a different front man for their service to this community. They can then return to the black hole they prefer to occupy. The challenge will be finding and recommending a sales team with the clout to pacify the damage done here, and the financial backing to make everyone here comfortable that there is a viable concern able to stand behind the service, and support any problems with that service should the need arise.


.

 

Several reasons and this happens with many more products and services than you may care to know... The most obvious answer is that by using scores of middlemen, they exponentially increase their sales force far beyond what they could achieve acting alone. Further, once that business model is well established, selling the same service directly to the consumer, in direct competition with your own sales team, would be the business equivalent of shooting your own nuts off.

Also, the nerds may very well be aware that they are exactly as they have portrayed themselves... computer nerds who do their best work in the dark, amped up on red bull, hacking the crap out of code. Many in business never learn their limitations, but these guys may know all to well that dealing direct with the consumer is not their forte.

 

^^^ This

And not everyone wants to be in the spotlight, look how it worked out for "Bill", it's no surprise to me at all that these guys enjoy their low profile, celebrity-status is not all its cracked up to be.

 

Cheese and rice... What's the name of the guy who cast my left-front wheel? I want a full refund from Jaguar until I have his first and last name, street address, DOB and one night with his wife.

 

This is exactly what I was thinking when I said in post #11 that the IP might be great, even if the other aspects of the business didn't inspire confidence.

 

What does his wife look like? I might join in.

 

If these guys were so smart and successful in the tuning business. How did they think that one tuning device bounced around to customers would work?

 

And it's a lot easier to disappear, stay quiet for a period of time, and start anew. I really am looking for long lasting relationship instead of "sorry I ruined your car, but I gotta go and try it on someone else's car", or "look at his car, I got lucky with that tune, but I'll try something else with yours"

I bought new power chips (2) for my Porsche 928 4S about 4 years ago, the guy keeps sending me new and improved chips for no extra cost every time he thinks he's made it better. I just have to send the old ones back in a SASE envelope. That my friends, spells service and integrity, and not fly-by-nite cloak and dagger, I'm too old for that crap.

Oh, and by the way, they were couple hundred bucks, just in case you were wondering.