I just bought a Golf R as my new daily, IMHO much nicer than the Ford RS inside, besides already available. Current tuning stage is 365bhp and will be 400bhp in September. The car out of the box does a 0-60 in 4.2 seconds, this already dropped to 3.8 with the current stage. The car is a friggin gokart ... 3,300lbs, AWD with that kind of power is just giggle and smiles all day ... will beat both my Jags on the 1/4 mile every single run but of course not beyond that ...

 

Not necessarily on sensibility. Depending on your grid, they are more polluting....


That aside, this is *sort* of getting closer to a conversation I wanted to have, without a divisive thread titled "Do R's look down on S or base 6?"

So... this article:
Jaguar F-Type V6 first drive - Business Insider

Apparently the car writer is reviled, but I was reading about the 4cyl and saw a commenter (and a few others) who angrily harangued that a F-Type is meant to be a supercar, and even the 6 has watered down the "brand". I have never, *ever* thought there was a rivalry between Rs and even the base 340hp (I like to think the manual is more respected than most)...

But I always wondered if the "R" would look down on the 6s, and if the "R" is a different breed of F-Type user, such that they may be offended and sell their once exclusive car once a bunch of 4cyl hit the streets and it is a more common car. (I also wonder how they will badge or button the 4cyl vs base 6cyl).

And now, as that article sort of lends itself... I sort of felt the R was just a draw dropping torque fueled head explosion, and never really aligned itself with the E-Type, nor really was appropriate as a successor.... where the 6cyl was truly in line with that masterful touring sports car....

So, instead of a bunch of invective, divisive conversations outside of this thread:


1) Do "R" owners look at the 6cyl as "lesser" (or more likely, we all love our damned cars and HOORAY FOR THESE CARS!!!)?

2) Do you feel the 6cyl is a more appropriate successor to the E-Type?

3) Do you think the 4cyl is an inappropriate addition to the lineup, ie if an R is maybe not appropriate heritage, would that make the 4 the other side of the same coin?

Just curious!!

 

Speaking only for myself here, certainly not all R owners.

Nope, especially not if they are a manual. I can respect (and maybe even agree with) someone thinking the V6 with a manual is a more pure driver's car.

I can't say that I care. All I know about the E-Type is really that it looks pretty and was supposedly a hell of a car. Beyond that... don't know and don't much care.

I do think a cheaper 4 cyl devalues the F-Type. A significant part of the appeal of the F-Type to me is that it is an uncommon car to see on the roads. Some of that is due to it being an impractical car for many people, but the rest is due having a relatively high price (even for the base). If I start a lot of F-Types around town I will absolutely switch cars. I want it to be a treat to see another one and I don't want my car to blend in.

 

I was joking that the 4's will be the Mustang driver of our group, spinning out while leaving cars and coffee. =)
Mustang Crashes Peeling Out Of Cars And Coffee For The Billionth Time

 

Some people just shouldn't be behind a wheel of car they can't handle. As long as everyone was ok that's all the matters and the guy filming sucks too... I bet that coffee and cars is now cancelled.

 

That's a New Jersey license plate in the photo. Is that really in Germany?

 

No that's not in Germany, and that's not the 4 cylinder tester, which was spotted in camo-wrap w/ a different exhaust. That's a V6S in the picture.

The reason for frequent press test drive photos and videos of JLR products w/ NJ plates is that is JLRNA's HQ, and those are manufacturer plates. They are on all the JLRNA demo vehicles.

 

1) Do "R" owners look at the 6cyl as "lesser" (or more likely, we all love our damned cars and HOORAY FOR THESE CARS!!!)?

2) Do you feel the 6cyl is a more appropriate successor to the E-Type?

3) Do you think the 4cyl is an inappropriate addition to the lineup, ie if an R is maybe not appropriate heritage, would that make the 4 the other side of the same coin?

Just curious!!

1) Not sure as I have a 6 MT, but I don't think so
2) The 6 cyl MT, yes (I'm a former Series 1 E-type owner, so qualified to answer!)
3) No, with a caveat: it depends on how it's done. For example, Porsche had a kick-*** 4 banger in the 944.

 

The E-Type had 6-12 naturally aspirated cylinders. Why wouldn't 4-8 blown cylinders for the F-Type be just as appropriate?

 

Ian says he is done being held hostage to the Etype, there will be no further associations.

Also the X152 has to play double duty as their Halo product that helps sell features downstream. That feature right now is the ingenium engine.

 

makes sense.

 

quoted for truth...telling it like it is!

 

It could be, but I think Uncle's original informal poll was asking about current offerings as available now.
The E-type was one of those cars that didn't necessarily improve with time. The early cars are now the most desirable because they are "pure." Now the later series 1 cars with better gearbox, deeper floors and improved seats are better drivers than the flat-floor, non-synchro gearbox cars, but they still had the 3 carbs, toggle switches, covered headlamps, and lower bumpers of the original design. In 1968, the "Naderization" of all cars forced changes on the E-type that, in my opinion, ruined it. The 2 + 2 cars, longer wheelbase and automatic gearboxes took it from a sports car to more of a GT car.
Now I realize that at the time, cars from the late '60's and into the '70's were going away from the cruder pure sports car to a more comfortable GT cruiser and that today we still prefer our creature comforts. I know I do! I have some raw sports cars: a Sunbeam Tiger and an Austin Healey, but I don't want to drive them everyday.
So, getting back to the original question: which F-type version available today feels most like a Series 1 E-type sports car? After driving all of them, it's the 6 speed manual S version.
Hey, I'm not knocking anyone's choice of an F-type. They are all cool as hell. They certainly fill Sir William's desire to provide a car to compete with more expensive marques offering great value for the money.

 

Since the 6-Cylinder has the same size block as the 8-Cylinder in order to keep overall production costs down, will the 4-cylinder also have the same size block? If not, so much for the commonality of parts savings. What would they do with all that extra space under the hood?


It wasn't a happy ending for GM and Chrysler bond holders who literally had their investments stolen from them by the Obama administration so that the unions could be bailed out. Both companies would be better off financially today had they been able to renegotiate their union contracts under bankruptcy protection. Despite claims to the contrary, they wouldn't have shut down any more factories. Below is a pretty good summary regarding what happened.
The Truth about the GM and Chrysler Bailouts | Cato @ Liberty

Don't post that kind of information. Those who are saving the planet might go in to a deep depression when they find out the truth.