I have an ’03 X-Type AWD with new M+S tires and, yet, it has a deadly scary fishtail when I drive on snow. I noticed it last year and didn’t drive it much and found out the rear camber way out of spec and it was just riding on the inside edges of the tires, which, understandably, would make it squirrely, but I had that fixed with new lower control arms. We just had our first snow and I nearly died! I keep searching for ideas of what could be wrong and all I see is a bunch of very unhelpful replies from people bragging about how great their X-Type is in the snow. I understand that’s how the car is supposed to be and that’s its reputation. That’s great for you, but not helpful for me. I have a model is a DSC button and a Sport mode button. I assume DSC on and Sport off is best for snow, but, again, I have found conflicting or unhelpful information regarding DSC. So, to be clear, tires are good, camber is good, but when I’m driving straight down the road, the rear end wants to fishtail on any little slick spot or slush. I never got over 40mph on a somewhat clear road with slush spots. Is it better for DSC to be on or off on slick roads? Would weight in the trunk help? I’ve read it’s not helpful for AWD cars. What tire pressure is recommended? I know that depends on my tires, but, in general, does going a little higher PSI help with snow traction? They are currently at the 31 PSI they were at when I got them put on. I’d greatly appreciate any advice (keeping in mind I have about…$0…to spend on it).

 

Gent, I think I can explain what is going on, but at the same time, I am making one big assumption that may or may not be true for your car. My assumption is that your car has an 05+ transfer case in it. Because of that, it may make the rear end a little tail happy. If you have the original transfer case, then you have a viscous coupling which should cause 1 front tire and 1 rear tire to spin together. Where the 05+ transfer case will allow 1 wheel to go free and the other wheels will not move (assuming DSC is OFF). The 05+ transfer case will apply power to all 4 wheels as long as they are all spinning at the same speed. Once a wheel is spinning faster than the others, it will take a majority of the power.

The check that I would like you to try is this: Get into a parking lot or other area with lots of free room. Get a person on each side of the car. You want them to watch the wheels. With the car warmed up, stomp on the gas to make the wheels loose traction. Did you get only 1 wheel to break loose, a front and rear wheel to break loose, both back wheels to break loose, or 3 (or 4) wheels to break loose? If you only have a single wheel breaking loose, then this tells me 2 things (if you have a 03 transfer case in your car, then the viscous coupling is shot and needs repaired along with the fact that your DSC system is not functioning (DSC should be limiting the speed of that one wheel by applying the brakes). If you have an 05+ transfer case, then, again, your DSC system is not functioning like it should be, but your transfer case may be just fine. If you have a front and rear wheel breaking loose, then your car is performing like it should and the DSC system is simply not applying enough force to stop the wheels. If you have both back wheels to break loose, then this is telling me that you have an issue with your transfer case if it is an 03 or if you have an 05+ transfer case, the DSC is not working to limit the wheel speed. If you have 3or 4 wheels spinning, hten the system is working like it should and you are simply pushing the car at the edge of what it can handle as the car is biased a little to the rear for power.

You would appear to have the right type of tire. The only thing that I could possibly question is how much tread you have left. If you are down to say 1/8", then yes, you may experience this. As for pressure, lower the pressure the better in snow as this will allow the tire to widen out and maintain maximum contact with the road.

As for DSC. For an 03 to have DSC, that would be a rarity as most early X-Types did not come with that feature. Not questioning you having it, but it doesn't seem to be acting right based on what you are saying. With that being said, if you start the car, it will default to DSC being on. So, if you are pushing a button to "light the light to have DSC on", you are actually turning it off. Kinda like, I would expect the motor to start limiting power when it senses slippage. You don't seem to mention that. As a general rule, having DSC on is the preferred thing unless the car is going to be driven such that slippage is needed (track racing, extreme recovery, etc). driving down the road, DSC should be on. As for sport mode, on or off, doesn't really make any difference. Sport mode is really a "feel good" button if you ask me. The only thing the button does is it raises the shift points of the transmission some based on how aggressively you are on the gas pedal. So, for an example, if you are depressing the gas pedal and you are letting the car shift at say 2500 RPM, With sport mode on, it will shift at 2500, with sport mode on, it may shift at 2600. Where, if you are getting on the gas hard and getting the car to shift at say 5000 RPM wiht sport mode off, the same driving will raise the shift point to say 5500 RPM. Just helps to get a little more out of the car under hard accelerations.

Driving in snow, you may find using the J-gate to be a bit helpful. I say this because if you shift the J-gate to 2, it will force the car to start in 2nd gear, vice 1st. This has the benefit of limiting the torque which will cause the tires to loose traction. You can then shift to 3, then 4 and finally to D. This helps you control the torque.

Hopefully this has given you some useful information. If you have more questions, let me know.

 

Thank you, Thermo. I do appreciate your thorough reply. I don't know when I'd be able to do that test to determine the transfer case type, but I'm unclear as to what I can do if it's one or the other. It seems to be, if my tires are good, which they are, that it would then just be how the car is, which isn't what I hear about the X-Type and isn't something I can live with. I can't imagine a car is made to be so squirrely even when everything is working as it should. It does have new M+S tires and, yet, it's practically undrivable on the slightest bit of snow slush. Also, yes, it is an '03 with DSC; it has the DSC button with a car silhouette with tread marks and it indicates on the dash that it turns DSC on and off.

 

Sorry, I can't figure out to edit my response or I would. I see, after another closer read through, that you were saying it could indicate DSC is NOT working properly. So, then with it not working, the car would be less the stick to the road "snow cat" it should be. Some people seem to say, "Eh, DSC on or off doesn't matter on snow." If it isn't working properly, could it not only not be helping, but actually making the stability worse?? Should I just drive with it off?

 

Gent, I would try driving with it on and off. See if there is a difference. If there isn't a difference, then that would kinda point to the DSC being at fault. With turning the DSC on and off, no light on the switch should indicate that the DSC is ON. If you push the button, an amber light should come on solidly. Another interesting tidbit about the system is that below 25 mph, the DSC system will engage the brakes and help limit wheel slip (ie, applies the brakes independent of the driver to the wheel that is spinning faster than the rest). Above 25 mph, the brakes are not applied and wheel slippage is minimized by reducing the motor's output. So, if you are going at 30ish mph, you should feel the car want to slow down if the back end is starting to fishtail as the rear wheels should be slipping and picking up speed. I don't see where you mention it feeling like the car is falling flat on its face. So. this may be something that you can do on your own is to simply find that parking lot, step on the gas and you should feel the car want to take off, then it will start flashing the DSC indicator on the instrument cluster as the car starts limiting the power output. No lights and/or no limiting of power, you may have blown the DSC fuse and the DSC system isn't working at all. Granted, this should be seen when attempting to turn the DSC off too as the amber light will not come on.

 

Just another opinion. The lower rear control arms were replaced...BUT if the rear upper are old, worn, shot especially the rubber bushings, you can get the "squirrelly" feeling. It exacerbates on slick roads with less traction. As Thermo's test for this in good dry weather of acceleration in a long entrance ramp stepping into the g force turn you get the rear end coming around on you feeling. IF they are shot, replace with the "Thermo" type fix.

 

Let me help you on this one. Its all about the tires, you need these tires Federal Himalaya WS2 .i live up a hill we just had a snow storm ,i jumped in my x-type cleared the snow of helped the neighbor he trid to get of the parking lot with his AWD Subaru WRX he got stuck pushed he back in his parking space , jumped in the jag took of with no problem in about a foot and a half of snow went around the block got up the hill ,2mins later the snow plow truck got stuck ,
I feel evry x-type should have these tires on in the winter ,your car turns into a tank ,there in the link below

https://www.townfairtire.com/brand/t...50r17t/87bj7a/











Best part you dont have to hit any buttons ,just jump in and go , purchased them on sale for $79 each i purchased 2 extra because they are so good then in the summer iget my free change over to summer tires

TANK TANK TANK

 

Adding to what Thermo wrote.
One way you can quickly tell if your DSC is working is if it is on and you start slipping on a corner where you are applying some gas, as the wheels start to slip, DSC will cut power to the throttle body to help slow you down at the same time it is applying the brake to the slipping wheel/s. I find DSC annoying al lower speeds in town, but love it at higher/freeway speeds. (I like to be able to pop out the rear end and drift through corners, in the snow without the throttle being cut back.)
As stated, tires are one of the most important factors in driving in the snow. If your tires are snow rated (Snow flakes shown on the tires and not all season,) and the back of the car still pops out on corners, then I second that the rear camber is off and you have an alignment problem of some sort.

My 3 X-types are all 05/06, so they dont have the viscious couplers. I have had no problems driving in snow/ice running my studded snow tires. One of them does not have DSC, and I really don't notice much difference driving in town without DSC.

 

its simple as changing to winter tires with a soft compound

 

The guaranteed cure is STUDDED TIRES.
It will make the road and tires feel like they are stuck together like Velcro, and you will be hard-pressed to make the car even begin to break traction - honest.
And better than the slip-free solid acceleration and cornering, your stopping distance will seem like it has been halved.

The guaranteed cure is STUDDED TIRES.

 

on my x-type my tires have the holes for stud but not needed especially when a snow plow couldnt get up my hill and i could, i cant get my car to fishtail its glued to the ground ,the soft compound is the trick

 

Sudded tires are overrated for most winter snow conditions, BUT occasionally are nice to have. I run studded snow tires in the winter on 2 of my X-types, and unstudded winter tires on the 3rd. Only time I notice that the studs help is on icy areas that form at intersections when they haven't put down mag chloride. My snow tires don't feel like they are stuck to the road with velcro, and it is very easy for me to break traction on corners by giving it a bit of gas. My stopping distances is perhaps 20% better with the studded tires, versus the non studded. .

The softer compound used in snow rated tires, is the biggest factor. When it is below freezing, the softer compound hardens proportionatly less and keeps the tread from becoming to hard, versus summer or all season tires operating in below freewing driving.

 

thiis is what we deel with each year in the east coast so tires are everything adding studs is a big plus ,but for my x-type its not needed just my regular winter tires work perfect