What is the purpose of this forum?
#21
07-21-2011, 03:57 PM
#22
07-21-2011, 06:42 PM
Dochands:
Some car owners are gearheads, and some car owners just drive'em til they drop, pay the price and get another car.
Most Jag forum members are using each other's knowledge and resources to keep rather temperamental Jaguar automobiles up and running without having to spend all of our children's inheritance.
We greatly enjoy turning a wrench, and are our happiest when we're covered in oil--and the problem is solved.
I'm just glad you have one of the later model, more reliable Jaguars. Remember that any time you go into any luxury car dealership to trade your car, they're just asking you to "bend over."
Some car owners are gearheads, and some car owners just drive'em til they drop, pay the price and get another car.
Most Jag forum members are using each other's knowledge and resources to keep rather temperamental Jaguar automobiles up and running without having to spend all of our children's inheritance.
We greatly enjoy turning a wrench, and are our happiest when we're covered in oil--and the problem is solved.
I'm just glad you have one of the later model, more reliable Jaguars. Remember that any time you go into any luxury car dealership to trade your car, they're just asking you to "bend over."
#24
07-23-2011, 11:09 PM
Veteran Member
I am a new owner and have a car with zero problems thus far. I joined this forum to share problems and concerns as well as info and updates regarding this vehicle. It is my first 4 door sedan which normally I would consider a rather staid vehicle.
I have noticed an awful lot of forum space wasted in comparisons with other staid vehicles such as Mercedes. This seems to me a non productive use of a forum entitled Jaguar XJ 2011.
Also there seems to be an inordinate amount of time wasted in whining debate about personal preferences on a range of subjects that are simply that - personal preference. Plus the constant and consistent whining about interior noise that a few suffer from and for which there is a TSB fix.
It's just a car. An item that is actually just as disposable tissue paper. It has no intrinsic value and little residual value over the course of a few short years. It is not a symbol of entitlement or prestige unless you make it so.
It is however a beautiful and fun toy. And toys are meant to be played with and enjoyed. So I would hope everyone can either move on to another more suitable product if that is their desire or enjoy the nice toy they currently own. But don't go to the Butter Forum and keep complaining about the Margarine.
I have noticed an awful lot of forum space wasted in comparisons with other staid vehicles such as Mercedes. This seems to me a non productive use of a forum entitled Jaguar XJ 2011.
Also there seems to be an inordinate amount of time wasted in whining debate about personal preferences on a range of subjects that are simply that - personal preference. Plus the constant and consistent whining about interior noise that a few suffer from and for which there is a TSB fix.
It's just a car. An item that is actually just as disposable tissue paper. It has no intrinsic value and little residual value over the course of a few short years. It is not a symbol of entitlement or prestige unless you make it so.
It is however a beautiful and fun toy. And toys are meant to be played with and enjoyed. So I would hope everyone can either move on to another more suitable product if that is their desire or enjoy the nice toy they currently own. But don't go to the Butter Forum and keep complaining about the Margarine.
I am not sure what it is that you are trying to say or do. It appears that you own a Jaguar 2011 XJL and to me the unknown is why you are here? You are certainly entitled to your opinion and we would not want to take that away from you. However, what we can do without is negativity. You sound like a well educated person and you know what and why you are doing what you are doing. If you do not agree with this forum and what it stands for then you sir are in the wrong place.
This forum is a tool designed to help and assist the person that wants to tinker, fix, modify and make better their Jaguars as they see fit. If this is not for you then I say again you are in the wrong place. We have a strong following of 8719 strong with over 286,000 posts that feel we are doing the right thing.
Stay if you wish but please keep your negative comments towards this forum and its members in check!
#25
07-24-2011, 10:26 AM
Since this post was thoroughly misunderstood and I have received nothing but negative comments feel free to delete this post.
I don't need or want exclamation points thrown at me. The point of the post was to ask why people who own such an amazing new auto are complaining about minor flaws and then wishing their cars away for a brand they could have bought in the first place. We all know there are active posters who have done this frequently. Unfortunately you have all chosen to attack me instead of listening to the post and responding appropriately.
My posts in general are helpful and always productive. This post was clearly misunderstood and a mistake if anyone truly bothered to read it.
I don't need or want exclamation points thrown at me. The point of the post was to ask why people who own such an amazing new auto are complaining about minor flaws and then wishing their cars away for a brand they could have bought in the first place. We all know there are active posters who have done this frequently. Unfortunately you have all chosen to attack me instead of listening to the post and responding appropriately.
My posts in general are helpful and always productive. This post was clearly misunderstood and a mistake if anyone truly bothered to read it.
#26
07-24-2011, 10:59 AM
#27
07-24-2011, 12:26 PM
Veteran Member
#29
07-24-2011, 05:30 PM
I concur--all you were trying to do (as I and others have also done) was discourage the numerous negative comments from those that dislike their new XJ so much that they are badmouthing it to the detriment of all others trying to enjoy this forum. I too do not understand the response from the moderators and others--they should have jumped in and supported what you said and come down on the ones you were talking about instead of jumping on you.
#30
07-24-2011, 07:03 PM
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Since this post was thoroughly misunderstood and I have received nothing but negative comments feel free to delete this post.
I don't need or want exclamation points thrown at me. The point of the post was to ask why people who own such an amazing new auto are complaining about minor flaws and then wishing their cars away for a brand they could have bought in the first place. We all know there are active posters who have done this frequently. Unfortunately you have all chosen to attack me instead of listening to the post and responding appropriately.
My posts in general are helpful and always productive. This post was clearly misunderstood and a mistake if anyone truly bothered to read it.
I don't need or want exclamation points thrown at me. The point of the post was to ask why people who own such an amazing new auto are complaining about minor flaws and then wishing their cars away for a brand they could have bought in the first place. We all know there are active posters who have done this frequently. Unfortunately you have all chosen to attack me instead of listening to the post and responding appropriately.
My posts in general are helpful and always productive. This post was clearly misunderstood and a mistake if anyone truly bothered to read it.
Absolutely no problems here and I hope you continue to post and enjoy the forum.
#31
07-24-2011, 07:08 PM
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#32
07-24-2011, 08:27 PM
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I'm with you, too, Dochands. By way of contrast, the forum for my last car (SC430) had all sorts of productive comments and tips (for example, software Easter Eggs that unlocked the nav system even when moving) as well as the usual littany of gripes and complaints. But the ratio of tips to gripes was a lot higher over there than over here. Maybe it's the car, maybe it's the members, who knows. But like you, I come here looking for ways to better enjoy my XJ and there's a lot of BS to sift through to find it.
#34
07-25-2011, 11:49 AM
Senior Member
The negative responses were not because people didn't understand you. They were because you started a post in which you told people that they should go elsewhere if they want to complain about their cars, or compare them to other cars that you feel are inappropriate comparisons. That doesn't rub well with most people, thus the responses.
This forum has a lot of negative because there's a lot of negative to go around. Most cars of this calibur have glitches, and I've been through it with BMW and Mercedes myself, but the issues, IMO are very different with the XJ. The problems I'm having are oversight-related type of issues. Every car has the fritzy TPMS, warning lights that won't go away, phone docking problems...that's par for the course with this much technology. The XJ, by contrast, has/had roof popping issues, a trunk that you have to drill holes in to install nets, the command interface is horrible, as is the Nav (pop up volume menus is prime example), the blue halo lights shine in my side mirrors at night so that it's distracting, the fully digital gauges with zero options or updates, even though it's just some programming logic to change it, etc.. That's my take anyway...we have a Beta version car, that was not properly vetted before coming to market, and consequently there are a host of issues presented on the forum. And all that despite the fact that I find it to be a spectacular car.
Frankly, I'm not interested in reading a post on why someone loves their paint color. The posts about problems are helpful in understand what to look for, or how to solve. There was a post that Gears did, for example, on how to reset the sunroof. Complaint about a problem, resolution to the problem, additional responses/suggestions for fixing the issue...great post, and I'm sure it was helpful (and painful) for those who read it and implemented the fixes. Additionally, it's important for the execs at Jaguar, who do read these forums BTW, to know what the sentiment is of their buyers and prospective buyers. The 2012 XJL will have the rear seating packing because buyers were upset with that omission, and they complained to Jaguar. Same with them offering black leather on the dash for 2012 because how the *&(K do you only offer brown leather with light seats? They heard the complaints and made a positive change.
So for me, I welcome the positive and negative, the comparisons to other cars, and I'll decide for myself what I choose to read and participate in. That's my 2 cents worth.
This forum has a lot of negative because there's a lot of negative to go around. Most cars of this calibur have glitches, and I've been through it with BMW and Mercedes myself, but the issues, IMO are very different with the XJ. The problems I'm having are oversight-related type of issues. Every car has the fritzy TPMS, warning lights that won't go away, phone docking problems...that's par for the course with this much technology. The XJ, by contrast, has/had roof popping issues, a trunk that you have to drill holes in to install nets, the command interface is horrible, as is the Nav (pop up volume menus is prime example), the blue halo lights shine in my side mirrors at night so that it's distracting, the fully digital gauges with zero options or updates, even though it's just some programming logic to change it, etc.. That's my take anyway...we have a Beta version car, that was not properly vetted before coming to market, and consequently there are a host of issues presented on the forum. And all that despite the fact that I find it to be a spectacular car.
Frankly, I'm not interested in reading a post on why someone loves their paint color. The posts about problems are helpful in understand what to look for, or how to solve. There was a post that Gears did, for example, on how to reset the sunroof. Complaint about a problem, resolution to the problem, additional responses/suggestions for fixing the issue...great post, and I'm sure it was helpful (and painful) for those who read it and implemented the fixes. Additionally, it's important for the execs at Jaguar, who do read these forums BTW, to know what the sentiment is of their buyers and prospective buyers. The 2012 XJL will have the rear seating packing because buyers were upset with that omission, and they complained to Jaguar. Same with them offering black leather on the dash for 2012 because how the *&(K do you only offer brown leather with light seats? They heard the complaints and made a positive change.
So for me, I welcome the positive and negative, the comparisons to other cars, and I'll decide for myself what I choose to read and participate in. That's my 2 cents worth.
#35
07-25-2011, 01:22 PM
The negative responses were not because people didn't understand you. They were because you started a post in which you told people that they should go elsewhere if they want to complain about their cars, or compare them to other cars that you feel are inappropriate comparisons. That doesn't rub well with most people, thus the responses.
This forum has a lot of negative because there's a lot of negative to go around. Most cars of this calibur have glitches, and I've been through it with BMW and Mercedes myself, but the issues, IMO are very different with the XJ. The problems I'm having are oversight-related type of issues. Every car has the fritzy TPMS, warning lights that won't go away, phone docking problems...that's par for the course with this much technology. The XJ, by contrast, has/had roof popping issues, a trunk that you have to drill holes in to install nets, the command interface is horrible, as is the Nav (pop up volume menus is prime example), the blue halo lights shine in my side mirrors at night so that it's distracting, the fully digital gauges with zero options or updates, even though it's just some programming logic to change it, etc.. That's my take anyway...we have a Beta version car, that was not properly vetted before coming to market, and consequently there are a host of issues presented on the forum. And all that despite the fact that I find it to be a spectacular car.
Frankly, I'm not interested in reading a post on why someone loves their paint color. The posts about problems are helpful in understand what to look for, or how to solve. There was a post that Gears did, for example, on how to reset the sunroof. Complaint about a problem, resolution to the problem, additional responses/suggestions for fixing the issue...great post, and I'm sure it was helpful (and painful) for those who read it and implemented the fixes. Additionally, it's important for the execs at Jaguar, who do read these forums BTW, to know what the sentiment is of their buyers and prospective buyers. The 2012 XJL will have the rear seating packing because buyers were upset with that omission, and they complained to Jaguar. Same with them offering black leather on the dash for 2012 because how the *&(K do you only offer brown leather with light seats? They heard the complaints and made a positive change.
So for me, I welcome the positive and negative, the comparisons to other cars, and I'll decide for myself what I choose to read and participate in. That's my 2 cents worth.
This forum has a lot of negative because there's a lot of negative to go around. Most cars of this calibur have glitches, and I've been through it with BMW and Mercedes myself, but the issues, IMO are very different with the XJ. The problems I'm having are oversight-related type of issues. Every car has the fritzy TPMS, warning lights that won't go away, phone docking problems...that's par for the course with this much technology. The XJ, by contrast, has/had roof popping issues, a trunk that you have to drill holes in to install nets, the command interface is horrible, as is the Nav (pop up volume menus is prime example), the blue halo lights shine in my side mirrors at night so that it's distracting, the fully digital gauges with zero options or updates, even though it's just some programming logic to change it, etc.. That's my take anyway...we have a Beta version car, that was not properly vetted before coming to market, and consequently there are a host of issues presented on the forum. And all that despite the fact that I find it to be a spectacular car.
Frankly, I'm not interested in reading a post on why someone loves their paint color. The posts about problems are helpful in understand what to look for, or how to solve. There was a post that Gears did, for example, on how to reset the sunroof. Complaint about a problem, resolution to the problem, additional responses/suggestions for fixing the issue...great post, and I'm sure it was helpful (and painful) for those who read it and implemented the fixes. Additionally, it's important for the execs at Jaguar, who do read these forums BTW, to know what the sentiment is of their buyers and prospective buyers. The 2012 XJL will have the rear seating packing because buyers were upset with that omission, and they complained to Jaguar. Same with them offering black leather on the dash for 2012 because how the *&(K do you only offer brown leather with light seats? They heard the complaints and made a positive change.
So for me, I welcome the positive and negative, the comparisons to other cars, and I'll decide for myself what I choose to read and participate in. That's my 2 cents worth.
I really did not interpret Doc Hands initial post in a negative way--I believe he was just trying to express this same sentiment. I am still extremely happy with my car and do not consider it a "Beta version" by any means--I guess I'm just not as picky as you are. I definitely do not agree that "there is a lot of negative to go around". All first year cars have little issues that get ironed out or modified in later versions--manufacturers aren't perfect and can't get it 100% right out of the box. This was an all new car--it's just the price you pay to have one first. If this is a concern, then wait a couple of years. I do agree that manufacturers read these forums and react to owner's issues, so the complaints are definitely worthwhile making.
As a side note, I just took a 350 mile road trip to Austin this weekend and was just blown away by the comfort and, suprisingly, the gas mileage. Got almost 24 MPG running 75-85 MPH and passing occasionally, so I wasn't babying it. Everywhere I stopped, from guys chatting me up at the gas pump or the hotel's valet, people wanted to know about this beautiful car.
#36
07-25-2011, 05:19 PM
Senior Member
#38
07-25-2011, 06:03 PM
Veteran member
ElJefe summed up the reason best,
We don't have the numbers, nor the variety of thread content that the other, more established-over-time-subforums do. New model appears, its the problem seekers that will always show up first, then the enthusiasts will balance it out eventually. I personally feel 180-degrees opposite of 'kid delicious', I'd rather read and participate in a non-problem/troubleshooting discussion. I interpret this forum (all jag areas) as a social and educational resource, not simply a technical fix-it documentary.
the ratio of tips to gripes was a lot higher
#39
07-26-2011, 04:04 PM
Everyone has opinions, but sometimes it's just the way opinions are presented. I sure don't have a problem with someone bringing a glitch to everyone's attention and expressing their dissatisfaction, but when they continuously rant and bash the subject of the forum it doesn't set well with me (and apparently others). One particular poster got extremely annoying in this manner and it was obvious that he was just hanging around to try and get everyone's goat--at that point I just ignored him in hopes that he would go away.
I really did not interpret Doc Hands initial post in a negative way--I believe he was just trying to express this same sentiment. I am still extremely happy with my car and do not consider it a "Beta version" by any means--I guess I'm just not as picky as you are. I definitely do not agree that "there is a lot of negative to go around". All first year cars have little issues that get ironed out or modified in later versions--manufacturers aren't perfect and can't get it 100% right out of the box. This was an all new car--it's just the price you pay to have one first. If this is a concern, then wait a couple of years. I do agree that manufacturers read these forums and react to owner's issues, so the complaints are definitely worthwhile making.
As a side note, I just took a 350 mile road trip to Austin this weekend and was just blown away by the comfort and, suprisingly, the gas mileage. Got almost 24 MPG running 75-85 MPH and passing occasionally, so I wasn't babying it. Everywhere I stopped, from guys chatting me up at the gas pump or the hotel's valet, people wanted to know about this beautiful car.
I really did not interpret Doc Hands initial post in a negative way--I believe he was just trying to express this same sentiment. I am still extremely happy with my car and do not consider it a "Beta version" by any means--I guess I'm just not as picky as you are. I definitely do not agree that "there is a lot of negative to go around". All first year cars have little issues that get ironed out or modified in later versions--manufacturers aren't perfect and can't get it 100% right out of the box. This was an all new car--it's just the price you pay to have one first. If this is a concern, then wait a couple of years. I do agree that manufacturers read these forums and react to owner's issues, so the complaints are definitely worthwhile making.
As a side note, I just took a 350 mile road trip to Austin this weekend and was just blown away by the comfort and, suprisingly, the gas mileage. Got almost 24 MPG running 75-85 MPH and passing occasionally, so I wasn't babying it. Everywhere I stopped, from guys chatting me up at the gas pump or the hotel's valet, people wanted to know about this beautiful car.
Last edited by ExpatJag; 07-26-2011 at 04:08 PM.
#40
07-27-2011, 12:57 PM
I currently took a road trip as well to Hamburg Germany where which is a 4 1/2 drive normally that only took me one fill up and a little less than 4 hours running an average speed of about 130mph. There were a couple of times due to certain people in BMW's and a Audi Q5 of all things that I had to push it to 160 mph just to let them know but I was pretty happy not only with the gas mileage but also the ride comfort. Unlike some posters I get very little road noise from my low profile 20's and even in sport mode the ride was very balanced. This is a wonderful car to take on long drives through Europe. Oh and I just had to quote on you HouTexJag because I dont about 75-85mph just going to work. It is so funny because the average posted speed limit over here is 120kph which is about 75mph and that seems so slow.
LOL. Unfortunately, I'm paranoid and having to really watch my speed due to some recent tickets even with a radar detector on board. I did manage to get it up to about 130 on a pass and it was soooooo smooth--love the surge and sound from the supercharger. I agree, no significant road noise from the tires. I am so jealous of your Autobahn experience--it is just plain stupid to have to putt along at 70MPH speed limits over here when the road and traffic conditions permit.