Hi Guys

My Esso Garage is no more and has now been re-branded which means that they no longer sell Esso Synergy Petrol OMG!

Since I started using this the difference was amazing and She has never run better in all the years that I have owned this Car and so the best that I could do before I took her for her MOT Test was to fill her up with some E5 whatever that is?

Since they seem to be changing the Formula for UK Petrol in general, does any one know if its safe or even advisable to run my Car on this?

(ptjs) Where are you! (Lol) as I need your expert advice and probably not just me!

 

OB,

What was the "E5" that you put in it? Which brand?

Basically, standard unleaded in the UK is now E10 (up to 10% ethanol) and 95 octane.
Many garages / brands offer an "E5" alternative. This petrol is:

- a higher octane rating, 97-99, depending on brand. Therefore, good for the car (imo). BP Ultimate is "minimum 97 RON". Esso Synergy Supreme, Tesco Momentum & Shell V-Power are 99 RON
- a max of 5% ethanol. However, Esso Synergy Supreme is zero ethanol (in most parts of the UK). The other brands such as Shell, BP, Tesco say that "it's up to 5%".

IMHO, you do not want to put any ethanol-modified petrol in your car, IF YOU DON'T HAVE TO. So, Esso Synergy Supreme is your best petrol for octane level and zero ethanol. If you can't get that, use the "E5 - up to 5% ethanol" super-unleaded variants from BP, Shell or Tesco.

Cheers

Paul

Of course, other petrols are available!

 

Hi Paul (ptjs)

The stuff I put in was E5 99 Octane so would I be correct in thinking 5% Ethanol ?

Synergy Supreme also apparently says E5 but does not contain any Ethanol although the nearest ESSO Garage is Miles away from me

 

OB,

All UK petrol pumps now have to be labelled either E5 or E10.

E5 means "up to a maximum of 5% ethanol content." You're right - Esso have stated that their E5 99 octane contains zero ethanol (except in a few remote parts of the UK due to refinery constraints). Tesco, Shell & BP state that it contains "up to 5%", so you have to assume that there is always some ethanol in it.

Why not find the excuse to go for a nice drive and lunch each time you need a fill-up and find an Esso garage?!

Paul

 

E5 and E10 in old Jags has been hashed over umpteen times in the last few years. Tons of archived discussion.

As mentioned, if you can conveniently avoid it, that's great. But, if not, there's not much reason to wring hands. I've been using E10 in my oldies Jags for over 20 years. The sky hasn't fallen

Cheers
DD

 

Most Jaguars wind up in America. We have been using E10 for 40 years without a problem. It’s actually better for your car than straight petrol.
The biggest problem with the V12 is the slow piston speed. Brief review. The longer the stroke the faster the piston speed. The 5.3 has a 2 &3/4 inch stroke do at red line (6500rpm) it is only moving at 2200 feet per minute and at slow cruise it may be in the 300 ft per minute range. Carbon builds up when petrol is not completely burned like in a slow cruise.
It will also be deposited on the back side of valves usually the intake valve. Causing valves to stick.
Alcohol dissolves carbon. ( slowly so don’t expect overnight change). But periodic high speed running with the tach at elevated RPM will help. ( drive it like you stole it) that engine is beautifully stout and will like it.

If you have stuck rings and or valves. Remove the spark plug and fill each cylinder with alcohol. Rubbing alcohol, medical grade alcohol is fine. Do not use wine, beer, or booze because those are mostly water. 100 proof drinking alcohol ( ethanol ) is 50% water it takes 200 proof alcohol to be pure alcohol.
I realize a shop wants to pull your engine and rebuild it. But that’s extremely expensive. Buying a gallon or so is likely a lot cheaper. But again be patient. It doesn’t happen over night.
Once things start to free up change the oil before driving it. And keep on changing the oil every 3 months. Very few owners get more than 3000 miles in 3 months in which case the acids have had enough time to do damage.
It seems expensive but it’s cheaper than rebuilding your engine periodically.

 

Hi Paul

That's not a bad idea! but everything was going so well until we had that recent Petrol Shortage and this particular Garage near me, ran right out of Petrol including Synergy Supreme 99 Octane Ethanol Free E5

Which was really popular with Classic Car Owners like me, even if it cost a little bit more

So I guess all we can hope for is that some other Petrol Company comes up with something similar to Synergy Supreme, otherwise it looks like I'll be using E5 99 containing 5% Ethanol

 

ethanol is good for jaguars. The more the better. Since most Jaguars come here to America and we have been using E10 for 40 + years we really know what we are talking about.
Look up the octane rating of ethanol (114 octane)
now if you think the ethanol of today is like the methanol that used to get mixed in with pool petrol then you need to research the difference between ethanol and methanol.

 

Hi Mguar

I think I'll let Paul (ptjs) answer that one, as his knowledge on this is far greater than mine, though as of now I'm still firmly planted in the 'No Ethanol' camp

 

Race cars love ethanol. Indy 500 is 100% ethanol. NASCAR IS 15% ethanol. In drag racing alcohol puts you in the faster classes. Sprint cars use alcohol. Land Speed record cars move up to faster classes with alcohol.
Alcohol equals more power, cooler running.

If you’ve ever taken a V12 apart you’ll notice the buildup of carbon on the back of the intake valve and behind the piston rings. Ethanol will slowly remove that.
I know the myth some people say about alcohol.
Part of it is correct. Back when England was still using pool petrol to raise the octane methanol was added. Methanol attacks rubber, aluminum and etc. it really does.
However they use ethanol now not methanol. It doesn’t attack anything.
Remember this.
Drink Ethanol and you get happy ( too much and you get drunk)
Drink methanol and you go blind ( too much and you die)
ethanol good
methanol bad
If you want I’ll explain the facts about water and alcohol

 

Remember that there are relatively few refineries, and what makes "Esso" fuel rather than Shell etc is the additives. The base fuel that comes out of a refinery goes to many different brands of station, but the additive package is added before delivery to the retail station.

You will get slightly lower fuel economy using a fuel that contains alcohol, as the energy content of the fuel is lower. However, in small amounts it won't harm the engine. It is hydroscopic and corrosive, so if you need to leave the car for extended periods ( like over the winter) keep the tank full to keep air out.

 

I’ve been using E85, 85 % ethanol 15% petrol for 5 years now. Here in America you can buy an option ( flex fuel) that measures the alcohol content and adjust timing and mixture according the actual alcohol content. From the factory it’s a $99 option. Or you can buy the sensor from Amazon for $38. Install it yourself.

Why? Well you are right you will use more alcohol than petrol. But here premium costs $3.85 a gallon. While E85 is $2.19 a gallon. So I save about $1.50 a gallon. That’s a $30 savings per tank.
Now calculate the 2 miles per gallon I lose and I’m still $20 per tank ahead !!

Plus power !!!!!! My butt dyno says it’s about 50 more horsepower. Yes when I’m smoking my tires showing off my mileage goes down even further. But normal driving it costs me 2 mpg. Yes without Adjusting your timing etc. your mileage will be worse. But that’s what Flex fuel does.

 

yes Ethanol is an alcohol. And yes you will lose about 20% mpg (that’s 20% of the 5 or 10% ethanol, Not 20% of the whole tank of petrol) if you fail to adjust your timing to take advantage of the properties of alcohol. Just like if you fail to adjust for premium fuel.
Not only will Ethanol not hurt your V12 engine, it will greatly help it. First it adds power. Complex subject. But short version. Alcohol has free oxygen that petrol does not. If you adjust the fuel air ratio to burn everything in the cylinder you will make more power. Indy 500 100% ethanol NASCAR 15% Ethanol etc.
Second if you’ve ever seen a V12 as it’s taken apart. There is always carbon deposits on the back side of the intake valve and behind the piston rings. Alcohol removes that. ( slowly, and not overnight)
Alcohol also cleans spark plugs and cleans your injectors.
Alcohol will cause your engine to run cooler. Pour a little rubbing alcohol on your hand. Feel that? That’s what your engine feels like with every power stroke.

As for corrosive. You have ethanol mixed up with methanol.
Methanol is corrosive.
Ethanol. Is not. Ethanol is in beer, wine,and cocktails. If it was corrosive you could not drink it.
If you drink Methanol first you go blind and then you die.
Any alcohol will absorb moisture. However your gas tank is open to atmosphere. It has to be or the tank would collapse as you suck fuel out. Therefore any moisture ( humidity ) in the air is going into your tank anyway. Besides all petrol has some water in it. Pre war cars often had a glass bulb to show how much water was in the petrol. Haven’t you noticed that if your car is running good it will run just that much sweeter on a rainy day ?(assuming ignition is in order).
Finally a minor correction. Refineries do produce for various brands but the additives are added at that brands tank at the refinery not in the delivery truck.

We heard the same thing for 20 years when they first introduced Ethanol here in America. Now to anyone who thinks about it they like it. Just remember, most Jaguars are sold here in America. So we’ve had 40 years to get rid of the myths.