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Would you stay away from a 1995 V12 XJS in very good condition and why?

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XJS ( X27 ) 1975 - 1996 3.6 4.0 5.3 6.0

Would you stay away from a 1995 V12 XJS in very good condition and why?

 
  #21  
Old 09-23-2015, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Terry007 View Post
Thank you for the replies.I don't work on my won cars and my mechanic just told me he would not want to work on the V12.
The car is very tempting...but the seller is an older gentleman not easy to communicate with.. He owed a garage told me things were taking care of and thats it... I think i just met Felix from the Odd Couple. It is a Northern CA car
I would suggest finding a different mechanic then. A car is a car is a car. He will work on a v8 I am assuming, which is twice as many cylinders as a inline 4 that he will also probably work on, whats the big deal about a 12?

That means your mechanic isn't sure of his abilities, which is scary since a piston is a piston, a ring is a ring, etc. All the parts are the same, the principles are the same, the repair and troubleshooting it all the same, there are just more of the same parts.

I've heard people say the same about the 4.0 Land rover engine, which is just a plain old pushrod v8. If "your" mechanic thinks there is something magical about european cars that makes it impossible to work on or understand, he also isn't competent enough to being working on your f150 or civic.

The right reply to any question should be "sure, no problem."
 
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  #22  
Old 09-23-2015, 10:49 AM
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As the owner of '95 VDP with the AJ16 engine, and the XJS with the V12, I'd like to comment on the claim that the former is *more* reliable than the latter.

It simply isn't true. Both engines are nearly bulletproof regarding the engines themselves (if properly maintained), what tends to be issues that would disable either are things like dead relays, or failed crank position sensors, a wiring fault, ECU fail, etc.

Over the many years with both, the AJ16 has actually suffered more won't start or poor running occurrences than the V12.

YMMV
 
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  #23  
Old 09-23-2015, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by sidescrollin View Post
To be fair, I don't think the 5.3 "is no rocket ship" its mostly the fault of the transmission. I know what you are saying though.[


It's not rocketship. You can blame the engine, the transmission, the final drive ratio, the weight....whatever. It all adds up to it not being a rocketship




Also, if you put the car into first instead of leaving it in drive, its remarkably faster. Sucks gas, but I don't think enough people drive their XJS like this.
Recently watched a video on Harry's garage channel driving an XJS and he shifts the 3-speed himself most of the time it seems.

Yeah, that can help, because the trans likes to come out of 1st gear too so and the kickdown is so designed that dropping back into first takes some effort. All easily changed


Cheers
DD
 
  #24  
Old 09-23-2015, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by sidescrollin View Post
I would suggest finding a different mechanic then. A car is a car is a car. He will work on a v8 I am assuming, which is twice as many cylinders as a inline 4 that he will also probably work on, whats the big deal about a 12?

That means your mechanic isn't sure of his abilities, which is scary since a piston is a piston, a ring is a ring, etc. All the parts are the same, the principles are the same, the repair and troubleshooting it all the same, there are just more of the same parts.

I've heard people say the same about the 4.0 Land rover engine, which is just a plain old pushrod v8. If "your" mechanic thinks there is something magical about european cars that makes it impossible to work on or understand, he also isn't competent enough to being working on your f150 or civic.

The right reply to any question should be "sure, no problem."


Right. If the mechanic says he does not want to work on a v12 then, yes, you'll have to find a different mechanic.

After 30 years in the auto repair and auto parts business I can think of several good reasons to avoid working on a Jag V12. NONE of them have anything to do with understanding the V12, or being unsure of my abilities, or not understanding the principles involved....or my level of competence.

I know some VERY competent mechanics who are careful in selecting what they will... and won't .....work on. Being skilled and competent does not *require* you to work on any or every type of automobile.

Auto repair as a business is much different than auto repair as a hobby.

Cheers
DD
 
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  #25  
Old 09-23-2015, 09:40 PM
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I could be wrong but people don't race their XJS ! At least I won't .. I own a BMW and that baby is fast...
But the Jaguar XJS is classy looking and I want to drive mine to Santa Barbara or San Diego with the top down of course.

....I always wanted one when I was a kid but my parents could not afford it.. Growing up in Europe we had an older rusty Peugeot ah ah !
 
  #26  
Old 09-23-2015, 09:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Terry007 View Post
I could be wrong but people don't race their XJS !

The vast majority are driven as though they were made out of glass. That's why so many of them don't run as well as they should. The owners don't know how they *should* run so if they fall below par from neglect, it goes unnoticed

Bit of a shame, IMHO.

Cheers
DD
 
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  #27  
Old 09-23-2015, 10:41 PM
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The main reason why a lot of ( shops ) mechanics do not want to work on the Jaguar V-12 is because it is simply a bad business decision. I have heard many a horror story of shops working on the V-12 in the XJS. They quote the owner a large amount to get started and then tie up their stalls trying to deal with all the heat damaged parts that they keep running into and then have to keep calling the owner with more bad news and more expense.

In my opinion if you are not a mechanic, have little or no interest in wrenching on your own car then the Jaguar V-12 XJS is one of the last cars you should be putting in your garage. We are after all talking about at least a 20 year old car so even if it has low miles one should either be ready to open their wallet or be able work on the car on their own to get everything up to snuff.

All 20 year old cars are going to have issues the question is how much are you willing to deal with? If your alternator or power steering hose for example fails on your old car the reality is what is it going to take to get at the part and replace it. The truth is many of these items are much more difficult to access on the XJS V-12 then on the inline 6.

All any perspective buyer needs to do is call a few British repair shops and ask them what they see working on the Jaguar V-12 and what are some of the costs associated with dealing with many of these V-12 known issues. I did before I purchased my first XJS and based on what I found out I decided the XJS V-12 was not for me.

For all on this forum who tell a perspective buyer that they should get a V-12 XJS or walk why don't you give them a honest break down of how much time and money you have into your XJS V-12 and then let them decide based on the facts?
 
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  #28  
Old 09-23-2015, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by LuvmyXJS' View Post
For all on this forum who tell a perspective buyer that they should get a V-12 XJS or walk why don't you give them a honest break down of how much time and money you have into your XJS V-12 and then let them decide based on the facts?


Sure.

When I bought my '88 XJS put $7000 or so into within the first few months, to make it how I wanted and repair various problems that existed or cropped up shortly after purchase---

New paint, wheels, tires. New front seat leather. Overhaul transmission, braking system, and differential. Repair climate control. Overhaul and upgrade suspension.

As for the *V12 engine itself* : new distributor cap, rotor, plugs, and plug wires. New fuel hoses. Made a new injection harness. Replaced various cooling and vacuum hoses. Sent injectors and radiator out for professional cleaning. New cam cover gaskets. Surely some other small things that slip my memory. After that it was clear sailing. I can't remember doing any other engine repairs right up to the time I sold the car a few years later.

Roughly I'd say that my work on the V12 engine was $800, and about 50-60 hours labor....which, although time consuming, was very satisfying. And, a great amount of that 50-60 hours was spent on optional cleaning, painting, and detailing the engine and engine bay.

The point, of course, is that the V12 engine represented a rather small portion of the time and money expenditure. Other parts of the car sucked up far more. Some have different experiences, some have similar to mine.

None of this is to say that V12 ownership isn't challenging. It is. And repairs can be labor intensive....although going in with the right attitude makes quite a difference. And, of course, the greater the challenge the greater the payback in terms of satisfaction. That sort of thing is important to some people. To others, not so much.

Cheers
DD
 
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  #29  
Old 09-23-2015, 11:44 PM
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Originally Posted by sidescrollin View Post
I would suggest finding a different mechanic then. A car is a car is a car. He will work on a v8 I am assuming, which is twice as many cylinders as a inline 4 that he will also probably work on, whats the big deal about a 12?

That means your mechanic isn't sure of his abilities, which is scary since a piston is a piston, a ring is a ring, etc. All the parts are the same, the principles are the same, the repair and troubleshooting it all the same, there are just more of the same parts.

I've heard people say the same about the 4.0 Land rover engine, which is just a plain old pushrod v8. If "your" mechanic thinks there is something magical about european cars that makes it impossible to work on or understand, he also isn't competent enough to being working on your f150 or civic.

The right reply to any question should be "sure, no problem."
A v12 only has 4 more cylinders, but this mechanic is referring to a Jaguar V12 and many mechnics choose to stay away from the Jag V12
7
 
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  #30  
Old 09-23-2015, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by LuvmyXJS' View Post
The main reason why a lot of ( shops ) mechanics do not want to work on the Jaguar V-12 is because it is simply a bad business decision.


That's right.

Working on something for fun and working on something professionally are two very different things. Darn few shops like getting bogged down with 'hobby cars' or 'project cars'. They are invariably the least profitable type of work....unless the shop ** and the clientele ** are specifically geared for that niche market.

It doesn't make the shop or mechanic incompetent.

Actually the same basic idea applies to almost any older car, even non-exotic ones. That's why many shops have a "We don't work on anything older than xxx-years...." policy.

Cheers
DD
 
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  #31  
Old 09-23-2015, 11:59 PM
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Originally Posted by orangeblossom View Post

During the Summer just Tripping around my Fuel Bill is a Minimum of £150 per week and I've even got through that much in just a couple of days!
Good Lord, are you serious? That is just about US$1,000.00 a month in gasoline...whew! You must be doing one heck of a lot of driving and putting beaucoup miles right along with it.

Cheers,
 
  #32  
Old 09-24-2015, 12:26 AM
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Originally Posted by 1 of 19 View Post
What he said. I think part of the reason these XJS's are on the market longer than one would expect (other than price) it's a polarizing body design. You either love it or hate it. .
That may have been the case when the car came out in 1975 and caught the public by surprise, especially as a replacement for the E Type. That, then, was "you either love it or hate it", but nowadays? NO, no way. I'm yet to hear anybody saying that they hate the car, that they hate the XJS. And even if there was somebody who hates the XJS, it would be ONE in 10,000 or 100,000 people, if that much.

However, I do once in a while, see an XJS in really neglected, shameful condition and yes, somebody may say they hate that car, worse yet when it happens to be a pre-facelift in a weird gray or gold color, but that is the exception and not the rule. Nobody hates a well taken care of XJS, nobody!

My opinion

Cheers,
 
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  #33  
Old 09-24-2015, 12:54 AM
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I have to say that my coupe has only ever got oohs and ahhs from admiring public. For a 26 year old vehicle that is a brown/grey colour (Dorchester Grey) she only ever gets admiration. These days the design is appreciated because it has aged so well, people see the leather and wood interior with bright shiny chrome and they love the low lean stance that the XJS has, put that with the mystique of that V12 badge, and people all comment about wonderful they look.And I have to say people love the way she starts, that wind up to ignition is just so exotic these days that people just smile whenever you turn the key and you get more than a few comments about how wonderful they sound.
 
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  #34  
Old 09-24-2015, 01:43 AM
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Originally Posted by Doug View Post
Right. If the mechanic says he does not want to work on a v12 then, yes, you'll have to find a different mechanic.

After 30 years in the auto repair and auto parts business I can think of several good reasons to avoid working on a Jag V12. NONE of them have anything to do with understanding the V12, or being unsure of my abilities, or not understanding the principles involved....or my level of competence.

I know some VERY competent mechanics who are careful in selecting what they will... and won't .....work on. Being skilled and competent does not *require* you to work on any or every type of automobile.

Auto repair as a business is much different than auto repair as a hobby.

Cheers
DD
Well said, Doug.

Cheers,
 
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  #35  
Old 09-24-2015, 02:13 AM
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Originally Posted by sidescrollin View Post
To be fair, I don't think the 5.3 "is no rocket ship" its mostly the fault of the transmission. I know what you are saying though.

Also, if you put the car into first instead of leaving it in drive, its remarkably faster. Sucks gas, but I don't think enough people drive their XJS like this.
Recently watched a video on Harry's garage channel driving an XJS and he shifts the 3-speed himself most of the time it seems.
Actually, the main reason for the 5.3L XJS to be slower than the 4.0L AJ6 & AJ16 cars (0 to 60) is not the tranny, but rather that horrible 2.88:1 final drive. The three speed automatic continued in the car through the 6.0L models, whereas the 4.0L cars' got the more practical/convenient four speed gear box.

Cheers,
 
  #36  
Old 09-24-2015, 02:16 AM
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92 to 96 are the most reliable years. a v12 requires a lost of maintenance. if you want less maintenance go with a L6 in the same year range.

people generally avoid jags because they are jags. you need to have the desire to work on your car to own one. a v12 lacking in maintenance will overheat and it will catch on fire.
 
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  #37  
Old 09-24-2015, 02:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Forcedair1 View Post
Actually, the main reason for the 5.3L XJS to be slower than the 4.0L AJ6 & AJ16 cars (0 to 60) is not the tranny, but rather that horrible 2.88:1 final drive. The three speed automatic continued in the car through the 6.0L models, whereas the 4.0L cars' got the more practical/convenient four speed gear box.

Cheers,
I for one do not believe that the 6 cylinder is faster than a 5.3 V12 in UK spec that is running properly. My 5.3 held in first on the stick will do 0 to 60 in well under 7 seconds all day long, and after that leave any 6 cylinder XJS for dead. I ran a 3.6 for a bit and have driven a 4 litre, not the AJ16; they were substantially less fast than my V12.


Greg
 

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  #38  
Old 09-24-2015, 02:56 AM
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Originally Posted by LuvmyXJS' View Post
The main reason why a lot of ( shops ) mechanics do not want to work on the Jaguar V-12 is because it is simply a bad business decision. I have heard many a horror story of shops working on the V-12 in the XJS. They quote the owner a large amount to get started and then tie up their stalls trying to deal with all the heat damaged parts that they keep running into and then have to keep calling the owner with more bad news and more expense.

In my opinion if you are not a mechanic, have little or no interest in wrenching on your own car then the Jaguar V-12 XJS is one of the last cars you should be putting in your garage. We are after all talking about at least a 20 year old car so even if it has low miles one should either be ready to open their wallet or be able work on the car on their own to get everything up to snuff.

All 20 year old cars are going to have issues the question is how much are you willing to deal with? If your alternator or power steering hose for example fails on your old car the reality is what is it going to take to get at the part and replace it. The truth is many of these items are much more difficult to access on the XJS V-12 then on the inline 6.

All any perspective buyer needs to do is call a few British repair shops and ask them what they see working on the Jaguar V-12 and what are some of the costs associated with dealing with many of these V-12 known issues. I did before I purchased my first XJS and based on what I found out I decided the XJS V-12 was not for me.

For all on this forum who tell a perspective buyer that they should get a V-12 XJS or walk why don't you give them a honest break down of how much time and money you have into your XJS V-12 and then let them decide based on the facts?
I was thinking about writing something in this regard, but you beat me to it and, really, I couldn't have written this any better; you've hit it right in the nail.

When the guy states “I don't work on my own cars”, and neither has he stated that he’s a wealthy individual (heck, maybe he is…), plus knowing the reality regarding the V12 cost and challenge of maintenance and repair, why is he still told to go-go-go and get the V12 "because it's the only XJS that counts"?

It's fine to love the V12 XJS, it is, but those who have "married" a V12 and live in a happily-ever-after harmony with it, keep forgetting what it took/takes to get there and instead, blindly just suggest that "a car is a car" or "find another mechanic" to a guy like Terry. What Terry really needs to learn from knowledgeable people is WHY are there mechanics who refuse to work on V12 Jaguars, guys whom I've personally met myself over the years.

No, Terry's not the person who should be advised to go and just buy a V12. That is just not right.

My two cents,
 
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Old 09-24-2015, 03:40 AM
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[QUOTE It's fine to love the V12 XJS, it is, but those who have "married" a V12 and live in a happily-ever-after harmony with it, keep forgetting what it took/takes to get there and instead, blindly just suggest that "a car is a car" or "find another mechanic" to a guy like Terry. What Terry really needs to learn from knowledgeable people is WHY are there mechanics who refuse to work on V12 Jaguars, guys whom I've personally met myself over the years. No, Terry's not the person who should be advised to go and just buy a V12. That is just not right. My two cents,[/QUOTE]


I don't even know where to start with this statement.. So I'll ignore it and give you my experience in keeping 10, 1996 6.0 liter V-12's on the road for the last 11+ years. Only one of these has been used as a daily driver but the rest still get driven to keep fresh. I am not nor have I ever been a mechanic. I have done all my own wrenching on these to date. 2 starters, 3 crank sensors, 1 thermostat, 1 water pump ... that's it. I would suggest the original poster take his advice from those who actually have owned the 6.0 liter and take with a grain of salt the advice from those who have justified not purchasing one from hear say. The rest of the car (rubber parts, relays) are the issue at 20 years not the V-12 engine.
 
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Old 09-24-2015, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Forcedair1 View Post
I was thinking about writing something in this regard, but you beat me to it and, really, I couldn't have written this any better; you've hit it right in the nail.

When the guy states “I don't work on my own cars”, and neither has he stated that he’s a wealthy individual (heck, maybe he is…), plus knowing the reality regarding the V12 cost and challenge of maintenance and repair, why is he still told to go-go-go and get the V12 "because it's the only XJS that counts"?

It's fine to love the V12 XJS, it is, but those who have "married" a V12 and live in a happily-ever-after harmony with it, keep forgetting what it took/takes to get there and instead, blindly just suggest that "a car is a car" or "find another mechanic" to a guy like Terry. What Terry really needs to learn from knowledgeable people is WHY are there mechanics who refuse to work on V12 Jaguars, guys whom I've personally met myself over the years.

No, Terry's not the person who should be advised to go and just buy a V12. That is just not right.

My two cents,
I agree 100%. A V12 is not a car for someone who both does not intend to, and is not interested in, working on their car. Even in the UK where distances are far smaller, excellent garages that know about and understand how to work on an XJS exist, but are few and far between.
I also think there is a confusion in this thread between 'reliability' and 'maintenance'. My car has been extremely reliable, but needs careful and regular maintenance, and detailed knowledge to do this maintenance, to a degree most modern cars do not.
Greg
 

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