15 XKR having random start issue
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Senior Member
Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 443
Likes: 295
From: San Diego
My no crank issue has been “worked around”. It only ever occurs if I turn on just the ignition in accessory mode, without starting the car. There is likely some timeframe where just pressing the start switch without then starting the motor that it won’t crank. But, I haven’t experimented with that. When it goes in the no crank mode, I have to do a hard rest by removing the ground cable and then positive cable from the battery and shorting thrm together for about 30 seconds. This hard rest always works… And it never goes into the no crank mode if I don’t let it remain in ignition on for an extended period.
Oh yeah, and I still have the permanent antennae fault, but it doesn’t see to be affecting anything. But then, I never listen to AM/FM.
Oh yeah, and I still have the permanent antennae fault, but it doesn’t see to be affecting anything. But then, I never listen to AM/FM.
Last edited by XKDreams; Mar 24, 2025 at 01:50 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 819
Likes: 433
From: Mechanicsville, Virginia, USA
My no crank issue has been “worked around”. It only ever occurs if I turn on just the ignition in accessory mode, without starting the car. There is likely some timeframe where just pressing the start switch without then starting the motor that it won’t crank. But, I haven’t experimented with that. When it goes in the no crank mode, I have to do a hard rest by removing the ground cable and then positive cable from the battery and shorting thrm together for about 30 seconds. This hard rest always works… And it never goes into the no crank mode if I don’t let it remain in ignition on for an extended period.
Oh yeah, and I still have the permanent antennae fault, but it doesn’t see to be affecting anything. But then, I never listen to AM/FM.
Oh yeah, and I still have the permanent antennae fault, but it doesn’t see to be affecting anything. But then, I never listen to AM/FM.
Next time that you feel like troubleshooting, instead of disconnecting the battery, try pulling select fuses one at a time. If you can isolate the module, you can try reprogramming or replacement.
Alternatively, you can try selectively reprogramming modules in hope of correcting a corrupt program.
One other thought: grounding/bonding. Our X150s are aluminum. An excellent conductor except when connections begin to oxidize. Power and data are typically grounded separately for that reason.
Identify suspect modules and clean signal grounds.
please keep us posted.
Last edited by Bill400; Mar 24, 2025 at 03:22 PM.
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX
My no crank issue has been “worked around”. It only ever occurs if I turn on just the ignition in accessory mode, without starting the car. There is likely some timeframe where just pressing the start switch without then starting the motor that it won’t crank. But, I haven’t experimented with that. When it goes in the no crank mode, I have to do a hard rest by removing the ground cable and then positive cable from the battery and shorting thrm together for about 30 seconds. This hard rest always works… And it never goes into the no crank mode if I don’t let it remain in ignition on for an extended period.
Oh yeah, and I still have the permanent antennae fault, but it doesn’t see to be affecting anything. But then, I never listen to AM/FM.
Oh yeah, and I still have the permanent antennae fault, but it doesn’t see to be affecting anything. But then, I never listen to AM/FM.
For all those reading and following this thread, i have identical issues to those described above, same antenna open circuit.same no crank situation. I have a new battery that lives on the approved battery tender.
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX
Logically (pun intended), the microntroller has wandered off and is awaiting an instruction that never comes. The pointer doesn't move until reset.
Next time that you feel like troubleshooting, instead of disconnecting the battery, try pulling select fuses one at a time. If you can isolate the module, you can try reprogramming or replacement.
Alternatively, you can try selectively reprogramming modules in hope of correcting a corrupt program.
One other thought: grounding/bonding. Our X150s are aluminum. An excellent conductor except when connections begin to oxidize. Power and data are typically grounded separately for that reason.
Identify suspect modules and clean signal grounds.
please keep us posted.
Next time that you feel like troubleshooting, instead of disconnecting the battery, try pulling select fuses one at a time. If you can isolate the module, you can try reprogramming or replacement.
Alternatively, you can try selectively reprogramming modules in hope of correcting a corrupt program.
One other thought: grounding/bonding. Our X150s are aluminum. An excellent conductor except when connections begin to oxidize. Power and data are typically grounded separately for that reason.
Identify suspect modules and clean signal grounds.
please keep us posted.
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX
For those following the thread, some voltage observation.
I have a new battery, and its kept on a CTEK MXS 5.0 when not being driven. I have the exact same issues as the starting post above, when it first failed i changed the battery and had the CTEK installed.
i currently have the "no crank" situation but have followed much of the advice above.
I have a green light on number 7 on the CTEK, voltage across the battery shows 13.1v
At the same time i have installed a low cost voltmeter in the cigarette lighter per advice above, it shows 12.8v
Now when i switch ignition on with key in the car, the touch screen,fans, etc all fire up, the voltage on the cheap voltmeter can drop as low as 12v and the battery 12.4v within a few seconds. There is also an extra draw when it tries to crank.
Within a few minutes of ignition off the voltages have returned to 13.1 at the battery and 12.8 at the cigarette lighter. This is due to the CTEK which i keep plugged in.
Any suggestions at this point, i know i can hard reset, wipe codes etc and it will run fine, i still need to understand XKDreams "work around" which at this stage i am looking forward to.
I have a new battery, and its kept on a CTEK MXS 5.0 when not being driven. I have the exact same issues as the starting post above, when it first failed i changed the battery and had the CTEK installed.
i currently have the "no crank" situation but have followed much of the advice above.
I have a green light on number 7 on the CTEK, voltage across the battery shows 13.1v
At the same time i have installed a low cost voltmeter in the cigarette lighter per advice above, it shows 12.8v
Now when i switch ignition on with key in the car, the touch screen,fans, etc all fire up, the voltage on the cheap voltmeter can drop as low as 12v and the battery 12.4v within a few seconds. There is also an extra draw when it tries to crank.
Within a few minutes of ignition off the voltages have returned to 13.1 at the battery and 12.8 at the cigarette lighter. This is due to the CTEK which i keep plugged in.
Any suggestions at this point, i know i can hard reset, wipe codes etc and it will run fine, i still need to understand XKDreams "work around" which at this stage i am looking forward to.
Senior Member
Joined: Jun 2013
Posts: 181
Likes: 40
From: Pittsburgh, USA
Good suggestion above to check ground wire connection. I would also check if your car is up to date on any outstanding TSB. I seem to remember that there was a TSB regarding BMS that required reprograming.
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 819
Likes: 433
From: Mechanicsville, Virginia, USA
Mark,
The security system is a logical starting point. Or point of non-starting.
If I remember correctly, the Instrument cluster, Engine control module and the central junction box are primary players for the security system start enable.
If you haven't already, download your wiring diagram from Gus Glickas' JagRepair.com.
Service manual too, while you are at it.
The diagram will show power and grounds to various modules.
Have you tried using SDD to diagnose the failure to start?
It is also possible to view various signals to verify operation using SDD.
3/26/25 PS: See Intermittent codes on Dream's post #1.
Most relate to security/start enable related modules.
The security system is a logical starting point. Or point of non-starting.
If I remember correctly, the Instrument cluster, Engine control module and the central junction box are primary players for the security system start enable.
If you haven't already, download your wiring diagram from Gus Glickas' JagRepair.com.
Service manual too, while you are at it.
The diagram will show power and grounds to various modules.
Have you tried using SDD to diagnose the failure to start?
It is also possible to view various signals to verify operation using SDD.
3/26/25 PS: See Intermittent codes on Dream's post #1.
Most relate to security/start enable related modules.
Last edited by Bill400; Mar 26, 2025 at 10:49 AM.
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX
Mark,
The security system is a logical starting point. Or point of non-starting.
If I remember correctly, the Instrument cluster, Engine control module and the central junction box are primary players for the security system start enable.
If you haven't already, download your wiring diagram from Gus Glickas' JagRepair.com.
Service manual too, while you are at it.
The diagram will show power and grounds to various modules.
Have you tried using SDD to diagnose the failure to start?
It is also possible to view various signals to verify operation using SDD.
The security system is a logical starting point. Or point of non-starting.
If I remember correctly, the Instrument cluster, Engine control module and the central junction box are primary players for the security system start enable.
If you haven't already, download your wiring diagram from Gus Glickas' JagRepair.com.
Service manual too, while you are at it.
The diagram will show power and grounds to various modules.
Have you tried using SDD to diagnose the failure to start?
It is also possible to view various signals to verify operation using SDD.
Last edited by Mark22Elliott; Mar 26, 2025 at 08:12 AM.
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 819
Likes: 433
From: Mechanicsville, Virginia, USA
Mark,
Symptom Driven Diagnostics.
SDD is the JLR dealer software, originally intended for installation on Panasonic CF-52 and CF-53 laptops.
In Europe, car manufacturers are required to make dealer level "tools" available to independent shops.
JLR made every version available on "diagnostics delivery".
"Authorized users" pay a subscription fee to activate the software.
The learning curve to use the software is a bit steep and an investment of time is required.
Learning while the pound/dollar clock was ticking could get quite expensive.
As time went on, there was sharing of passwords and a sharp Chinaman trading as "365" made a crack available for different versions.
The earliest versions of SDD (actually IDS - Integrated Diagnostics System) that I recall were in the one-teens and one-twenties.
Many of us started about V125.
The early versions of IDS/SDD were intended to be operated off-line, independently, since internet communications were generally considered slow and unreliable.
Therefore, all complete versions of SDD through and including V150 had VDF files. Vehicle Data Files are the actual control module program data for every vehicle manufactured by JLR through the date of that version publication.
Cost prohibitive 10-15 years ago, Panasonic laptops are dirt cheap on the used market. So, my preference is a laptop dedicated to SDD.
Computer savvy folks use various methods to run windows 7 and even XP under WIN 10 and 11.
In addition to the computer and software, you need a VCI - Vehicle Communications Interface. (That's a whole other discussion). Mongoose to me.
Finally, you need a battery maintainer (clean power supply) rated at 50 Amps of higher to allow any sort of "programming" or reading data back to the vehicle.
The versions of IDS/SDD do vary quite a bit over time. Which is "the best"? It depends on the vehicle and what you are trying to do.
Discussion of how-to-do this or that rarely mention version, which I regret, as it can make a difference.
My sense is that V138 is the most popular off-line version in common use. I would recommend that 2015 MY and earlier fans begin there.
I hope that all Jag fans who are interested will learn to use the software tools and pass it on to keep these classic cars well into the future.
Please keep us posted on your success.
Symptom Driven Diagnostics.
SDD is the JLR dealer software, originally intended for installation on Panasonic CF-52 and CF-53 laptops.
In Europe, car manufacturers are required to make dealer level "tools" available to independent shops.
JLR made every version available on "diagnostics delivery".
"Authorized users" pay a subscription fee to activate the software.
The learning curve to use the software is a bit steep and an investment of time is required.
Learning while the pound/dollar clock was ticking could get quite expensive.
As time went on, there was sharing of passwords and a sharp Chinaman trading as "365" made a crack available for different versions.
The earliest versions of SDD (actually IDS - Integrated Diagnostics System) that I recall were in the one-teens and one-twenties.
Many of us started about V125.
The early versions of IDS/SDD were intended to be operated off-line, independently, since internet communications were generally considered slow and unreliable.
Therefore, all complete versions of SDD through and including V150 had VDF files. Vehicle Data Files are the actual control module program data for every vehicle manufactured by JLR through the date of that version publication.
Cost prohibitive 10-15 years ago, Panasonic laptops are dirt cheap on the used market. So, my preference is a laptop dedicated to SDD.
Computer savvy folks use various methods to run windows 7 and even XP under WIN 10 and 11.
In addition to the computer and software, you need a VCI - Vehicle Communications Interface. (That's a whole other discussion). Mongoose to me.
Finally, you need a battery maintainer (clean power supply) rated at 50 Amps of higher to allow any sort of "programming" or reading data back to the vehicle.
The versions of IDS/SDD do vary quite a bit over time. Which is "the best"? It depends on the vehicle and what you are trying to do.
Discussion of how-to-do this or that rarely mention version, which I regret, as it can make a difference.
My sense is that V138 is the most popular off-line version in common use. I would recommend that 2015 MY and earlier fans begin there.
I hope that all Jag fans who are interested will learn to use the software tools and pass it on to keep these classic cars well into the future.
Please keep us posted on your success.
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX
Mark,
Symptom Driven Diagnostics.
SDD is the JLR dealer software, originally intended for installation on Panasonic CF-52 and CF-53 laptops.
In Europe, car manufacturers are required to make dealer level "tools" available to independent shops.
JLR made every version available on "diagnostics delivery".
"Authorized users" pay a subscription fee to activate the software.
The learning curve to use the software is a bit steep and an investment of time is required.
Learning while the pound/dollar clock was ticking could get quite expensive.
As time went on, there was sharing of passwords and a sharp Chinaman trading as "365" made a crack available for different versions.
The earliest versions of SDD (actually IDS - Integrated Diagnostics System) that I recall were in the one-teens and one-twenties.
Many of us started about V125.
The early versions of IDS/SDD were intended to be operated off-line, independently, since internet communications were generally considered slow and unreliable.
Therefore, all complete versions of SDD through and including V150 had VDF files. Vehicle Data Files are the actual control module program data for every vehicle manufactured by JLR through the date of that version publication.
Cost prohibitive 10-15 years ago, Panasonic laptops are dirt cheap on the used market. So, my preference is a laptop dedicated to SDD.
Computer savvy folks use various methods to run windows 7 and even XP under WIN 10 and 11.
In addition to the computer and software, you need a VCI - Vehicle Communications Interface. (That's a whole other discussion). Mongoose to me.
Finally, you need a battery maintainer (clean power supply) rated at 50 Amps of higher to allow any sort of "programming" or reading data back to the vehicle.
The versions of IDS/SDD do vary quite a bit over time. Which is "the best"? It depends on the vehicle and what you are trying to do.
Discussion of how-to-do this or that rarely mention version, which I regret, as it can make a difference.
My sense is that V138 is the most popular off-line version in common use. I would recommend that 2015 MY and earlier fans begin there.
I hope that all Jag fans who are interested will learn to use the software tools and pass it on to keep these classic cars well into the future.
Please keep us posted on your success.
Symptom Driven Diagnostics.
SDD is the JLR dealer software, originally intended for installation on Panasonic CF-52 and CF-53 laptops.
In Europe, car manufacturers are required to make dealer level "tools" available to independent shops.
JLR made every version available on "diagnostics delivery".
"Authorized users" pay a subscription fee to activate the software.
The learning curve to use the software is a bit steep and an investment of time is required.
Learning while the pound/dollar clock was ticking could get quite expensive.
As time went on, there was sharing of passwords and a sharp Chinaman trading as "365" made a crack available for different versions.
The earliest versions of SDD (actually IDS - Integrated Diagnostics System) that I recall were in the one-teens and one-twenties.
Many of us started about V125.
The early versions of IDS/SDD were intended to be operated off-line, independently, since internet communications were generally considered slow and unreliable.
Therefore, all complete versions of SDD through and including V150 had VDF files. Vehicle Data Files are the actual control module program data for every vehicle manufactured by JLR through the date of that version publication.
Cost prohibitive 10-15 years ago, Panasonic laptops are dirt cheap on the used market. So, my preference is a laptop dedicated to SDD.
Computer savvy folks use various methods to run windows 7 and even XP under WIN 10 and 11.
In addition to the computer and software, you need a VCI - Vehicle Communications Interface. (That's a whole other discussion). Mongoose to me.
Finally, you need a battery maintainer (clean power supply) rated at 50 Amps of higher to allow any sort of "programming" or reading data back to the vehicle.
The versions of IDS/SDD do vary quite a bit over time. Which is "the best"? It depends on the vehicle and what you are trying to do.
Discussion of how-to-do this or that rarely mention version, which I regret, as it can make a difference.
My sense is that V138 is the most popular off-line version in common use. I would recommend that 2015 MY and earlier fans begin there.
I hope that all Jag fans who are interested will learn to use the software tools and pass it on to keep these classic cars well into the future.
Please keep us posted on your success.
I'm not sure at this stage I'm prepared to invest that much time. Despite having a first degree in electronics and software I am a car enthusiast because I like driving. I don't imagine my day job spilling over into my hobby.
I'm pretty disappointed with the jag. When it runs its amazing. However this level of doubt as to what's actually wrong with it is next level. I am in daily dialogue with a Jaguar specialist who is amazing. His only advice is to hard start it and bring it over and wait for it to happen again... or i can tow it over whilst it's in no crank condition and let him plug his SDD in.
One last thought.. I have an Alfa Tune on the car. No other mods with pulleys etc. Any thoughts that this could be adversely affecting the car?
Veteran Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 12,087
Likes: 3,364
From: home
That tune is unknown on the forum so hard to say. I use and recommend VAP.
But yes when having problems it's smart to go back stock until you get it fixed. Not blaming the tune at all but you want to remove unknowns that might be adding to the problem.
.
.
.
But yes when having problems it's smart to go back stock until you get it fixed. Not blaming the tune at all but you want to remove unknowns that might be adding to the problem.
.
.
.
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 819
Likes: 433
From: Mechanicsville, Virginia, USA
Mark,
There is a reasonable probability that SDD will diagnose the intermittent problem that you are experiencing.
Reasonable because SDD my inadvertently kick-start module communications.
Pulling fuses to diagnose problems can do similar resets, so you have to think ahead.
I experienced a random intermittent failure that initially looked similar to low fuel/fuel pump failure but progressed to complete, although intermittent, electronics/communication failure.
(Thank you, AAA, for the 100-mile tow home.)
SDD correctly diagnosed the failure in the FSJB - Front Smart Junction Box, adjacent to the US driver left foot.
After replacing/reprogramming, not a moment of trouble.
Note that reprogramming the replacement part is required to match the VIN.
Hang in there. Once you resolve the problem, it will be the best car ever.
There is a reasonable probability that SDD will diagnose the intermittent problem that you are experiencing.
Reasonable because SDD my inadvertently kick-start module communications.
Pulling fuses to diagnose problems can do similar resets, so you have to think ahead.
I experienced a random intermittent failure that initially looked similar to low fuel/fuel pump failure but progressed to complete, although intermittent, electronics/communication failure.
(Thank you, AAA, for the 100-mile tow home.)
SDD correctly diagnosed the failure in the FSJB - Front Smart Junction Box, adjacent to the US driver left foot.
After replacing/reprogramming, not a moment of trouble.
Note that reprogramming the replacement part is required to match the VIN.
Hang in there. Once you resolve the problem, it will be the best car ever.
Last edited by Bill400; Mar 28, 2025 at 10:28 AM.
Ok, I am lost here…what is meant here by “accessory mode” and how do you run the XK in accessory mode? Do you mean turning the key to ACCESSORY but not running the engine? Wouldn’t that be “placing the car in accessory mode” or….? Just trying to figure the situation correctly,
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX
Fix? UPDATE: after re-reading this thread 2-3 times it appears that i also have been driving in "accessory mode" as XKDreams puts it. I was previously entering the vehicle, pushing start key, waiting for all systems to come alive then putting foot on brake and pushing starter again.....pretty consistently. I have owned other vehicles which operated this way, i believe that's why i was doing it. but cant honestly be sure why.
Bought vehicle November 2024: new to me 2013, XKR 25k miles, AlphaTune 550+?? HP.
January 2025: First time i had the no crank situation I put it down to old battery (8.5 years old, previous owner kept it on a CTEK 5.0) and i wasn't maintaining it on a CTEK 5.0 back then. I have corrected that now.I had the car towed to a Jaguar specialist in Houston, his SDD system immediately woke the car up and no faults were detected.
Mid-March 2025 Another 2 months of driving in accessory mode, short journeys, then one longer 100 mile trip, multiple engine warning lights and a repeat no crank situation.
March 27th After checking all voltages above, talking to my Jaguar specialist, re-reading XKDreams start procedure i did the hard reset on my XKR and have been starting it in the drivers manual approved way, enter vehicle, foot on brake, push start button. Note i have 2 x voltmeters in the car, one attached to the battery (long cables) and one in the cigarette lighter. I have 13.1v at the battery and 12.9 at the cigarette lighter. Note, simply unlocking and opening the door (mirrors, and all sorts of other systems start drawing power) can cause this to drop to 12.6....i wouldn't hang around at this point. Starting it returns the battery and cigarette lighter above 13v immediately.
Side note: there are a LOT of systems running inside the car, engine off, ignition off, doors closed but UNLOCKED. when you lock the car it gets a lot quieter, but not zero draw, for sure. I don't think these cars ever sleep until you disconnect the battery.
March 30th I have 3 days, 6 or 7 starts with no problems. I will record all voltage observations and return to this post regularly.
Bought vehicle November 2024: new to me 2013, XKR 25k miles, AlphaTune 550+?? HP.
January 2025: First time i had the no crank situation I put it down to old battery (8.5 years old, previous owner kept it on a CTEK 5.0) and i wasn't maintaining it on a CTEK 5.0 back then. I have corrected that now.I had the car towed to a Jaguar specialist in Houston, his SDD system immediately woke the car up and no faults were detected.
Mid-March 2025 Another 2 months of driving in accessory mode, short journeys, then one longer 100 mile trip, multiple engine warning lights and a repeat no crank situation.
March 27th After checking all voltages above, talking to my Jaguar specialist, re-reading XKDreams start procedure i did the hard reset on my XKR and have been starting it in the drivers manual approved way, enter vehicle, foot on brake, push start button. Note i have 2 x voltmeters in the car, one attached to the battery (long cables) and one in the cigarette lighter. I have 13.1v at the battery and 12.9 at the cigarette lighter. Note, simply unlocking and opening the door (mirrors, and all sorts of other systems start drawing power) can cause this to drop to 12.6....i wouldn't hang around at this point. Starting it returns the battery and cigarette lighter above 13v immediately.
Side note: there are a LOT of systems running inside the car, engine off, ignition off, doors closed but UNLOCKED. when you lock the car it gets a lot quieter, but not zero draw, for sure. I don't think these cars ever sleep until you disconnect the battery.
March 30th I have 3 days, 6 or 7 starts with no problems. I will record all voltage observations and return to this post regularly.
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX
Update since post above on March 30th i have started and driven the XKR every day. Starting sequence as per owner manual.car is plugged into CTEK 5.0 all the time. Starting voltage on cheap cigarette lighter is 12.5 to 12.7
April 14th its booked in for a service where i will ask for battery tests (even though its a new battery) and investigation into the phantom Antenna open circuit.
@XKDreams any issues with yours? i guess i'm 10 days and 20-30 starts with no problems.
April 14th its booked in for a service where i will ask for battery tests (even though its a new battery) and investigation into the phantom Antenna open circuit.
@XKDreams any issues with yours? i guess i'm 10 days and 20-30 starts with no problems.
Mine was intermittent. Some days just a click but everything else was fine, lights, steering column, brake lights etc and then other times would fire right up. Ended up switching out the starter motor under extended warranty been fine so far. Just one observation this began after I hit a giant pothole and replaced all four tires. Coincidence?
Veteran Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 1,761
Likes: 1,235
From: near Austin
Mine was intermittent. Some days just a click but everything else was fine, lights, steering column, brake lights etc and then other times would fire right up. Ended up switching out the starter motor under extended warranty been fine so far. Just one observation this began after I hit a giant pothole and replaced all four tires. Coincidence?
imo
wj
my thought exactly but motor seemed to cure it so far
Member
Joined: Dec 2024
Posts: 31
Likes: 5
From: Conroe, TX