Alignment Issues
#21
02-15-2009, 04:25 PM
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Hey Brute,
Time to send a P/O to the fabrication shop for some upper wishbones with adjustable rod ends in place of the inner bushings? Adjustable camber and caster at any ride height would help the "lowering springs" crowd too. They can't even get their camber close from the results I have read.
Time to send a P/O to the fabrication shop for some upper wishbones with adjustable rod ends in place of the inner bushings? Adjustable camber and caster at any ride height would help the "lowering springs" crowd too. They can't even get their camber close from the results I have read.
#22
02-15-2009, 06:05 PM
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#24
02-15-2009, 07:53 PM
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no I actually have a pair like that on my Frontier. He came up with those after another company made some (ones I have) but with greasable polyurethane bushings. After talking with him about alignments and lifts not being able to dial in any negative camber, greg built those with heims. Not only tuffer, but can really dial in caster and camber alot more the eccentric bolts in the lower control arms. Those are chromoly steel and I think the same could be done for Jags maybe even using the stock ball joint, Ide have to look, that design uses a uniball and are really tuff since theyre built for on and offroad use.
#26
02-16-2009, 08:32 AM
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FOR THE KONI CHALLENGE SERIES WE HAD TO BE STOCK(FOR THE MOST PART), SWAP TO MANUAL TRANS, EXHAUST, CAI, TUNES ETC, TO GET TO 400HP NORMALLY ASP. WERE APPROVED. BUT SUSPENSION TO REMAIN STK. wE ALSO CAN TAKE OFF AS MUCH WEIGHT AS POSSIBLE THROUGH CARBON FIBRE DOOR, BONNET AND BOOT. OR AT LEAST TO OFFSET ROLLCAGE AND OTHER ADDED SAFTY FEATURES
#27
02-16-2009, 02:26 PM
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Hey Brute,
I took a quick look at your buddy's website last night, and was looking for the magic words "for offroad use only". Maybe I missed it, but are those wishbones approved for road use, and how in the heck does one go about earning that approval?
Building the actual wishbones for an XK would be cake, the problem would be in matching the shear strength since I presume that they have to fit some crash standard parameters as well as they fit on the car. If a company like PRG has an established way of dealing with the liability issues, it's a no brainer to pay them for a production run. Any thoughts?
I took a quick look at your buddy's website last night, and was looking for the magic words "for offroad use only". Maybe I missed it, but are those wishbones approved for road use, and how in the heck does one go about earning that approval?
Building the actual wishbones for an XK would be cake, the problem would be in matching the shear strength since I presume that they have to fit some crash standard parameters as well as they fit on the car. If a company like PRG has an established way of dealing with the liability issues, it's a no brainer to pay them for a production run. Any thoughts?
#28
02-16-2009, 03:26 PM
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He has disclaimers on instructions, and i dont see it as an issue since chromoly steel would be stronger than oem. I think the bigger issue is how much noise and road roughness would be transmitted to the cabin. Ide think youde reallyhave to be a die hard enthusiast to be ok. Ive driven lots of stuff thats geared alittle more to race car ride and while i am accepting of the trade offs or compromises, others may not be or might think they are.
#29
02-16-2009, 03:30 PM
Veteran member
In case you missed the note...
Alright, rechecked the alignment at NTB, and they toed it in almost to the red. We'll see if that 'curbs' the inner feathering.
Thanks for the help guys, and if we get a wishbone like what you guys show that'll help adjust camber moreso, i'd be first in line to get a pair.
Brutal, I bought my car from your dealer. I bet my sales guy is still there, Richard I think his name was. Greatly appreciate the offer to take a look at it! I drive down to Conroe alot, but on business, so I would have to make some time to go into Houston to see ya. I'f I do, i'll drop by.
On a tangent, did you know a guy in the service department that bought my/our trade-in, it was a white chrysler minivan, about 2 years ago? If so, i found the spare remote! When I tried to call about 6 months ago to find him, they told me he had left.
On a tangent, did you know a guy in the service department that bought my/our trade-in, it was a white chrysler minivan, about 2 years ago? If so, i found the spare remote! When I tried to call about 6 months ago to find him, they told me he had left.
Thanks for the help guys, and if we get a wishbone like what you guys show that'll help adjust camber moreso, i'd be first in line to get a pair.
#30
02-16-2009, 05:01 PM
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Hey Brute,
You're quite right, I overlooked the non-compliant mounting aspect and it is a significant issue. The other factor about the strength is an important consideration too: if they are too strong, curbing a wheel real hard makes it that much more likely that the front crossmember will be tweaked. I suspect that happens fairly often on suspension collisions with these cars with the stock wishbones.
The open wheel car suspension arms are constructed with that consideration in mind. It's almost par for the course to tear a corner off the car, but the huge problem is when the bulkhead gets damaged or tweaks the monocoque. So there has to be some design criteria Jaguar uses to make sure the wishbone is stout enough for normal pothole driving, but also has a predetermined bend and shear strength to absorb the impact instead of transferring it all. That's where I have no clue on how to produce a component like this for more than just a one-off mod. Looks like I have a homework assignment.
You're quite right, I overlooked the non-compliant mounting aspect and it is a significant issue. The other factor about the strength is an important consideration too: if they are too strong, curbing a wheel real hard makes it that much more likely that the front crossmember will be tweaked. I suspect that happens fairly often on suspension collisions with these cars with the stock wishbones.
The open wheel car suspension arms are constructed with that consideration in mind. It's almost par for the course to tear a corner off the car, but the huge problem is when the bulkhead gets damaged or tweaks the monocoque. So there has to be some design criteria Jaguar uses to make sure the wishbone is stout enough for normal pothole driving, but also has a predetermined bend and shear strength to absorb the impact instead of transferring it all. That's where I have no clue on how to produce a component like this for more than just a one-off mod. Looks like I have a homework assignment.
#31
04-12-2018, 01:13 PM
Senior Member
yes we dealers have them and no the specs were only changed on the 03 and up Stypes. and should have been on the 04 and up Xj's. youre issue (if nothings bent, or wornout) is the alignment was set to the middle and if you dont allow for tollerances, play and wear when doing an alignment. youll end up with this. ask them to realign and push out on the inside of the front tires to take out movement, and watch were the toe reading go. this is what the road does to your suspension as you drive, it toes out the front tires. Many times I end up toeing the front tires in so much theyre in the red out of spec, but when you simulate what the road will do, they go right into the green and middle. And by seeing tire wear thats even for the life of the tire if nothing hit like a curb or bad pothole, it works perfectly. If theyde have done this to start with (why Mercedes wants alignments done with a pressor bar) theyde have found that your tires "toed out" into the red.....that why the insides are wearing. the machine is a tool, not the end all. as Ive said before, you have to "KNOW" what your doing with a tool, and when I align the same cars and see them again every 5k, I know what works with alignments and what doesnt...If more tech realised you drive a car on the road and not the alignment machine, theyde do a better alignment
does the spec update from Jaguar supersede the specs for the older XK8's in the updates that the shops get for their machines?
additionally would you recommend setting the toe close to the red, toed in while using a pressor bar?
everything else is spec and updated (mounts, springs, shocks and shock bushings and control arm where necessary). is there a point where it will be excessive?
is it possible to set rear toe?
#32
04-12-2018, 06:50 PM
Veteran Member
I actually just eyeballed my front toe to about 1/8" in, first with parallel strings, then after that by sighting down the tire to an equal point on the back tire's tread. That was over 10K miles ago on tires that had at lest 20K miles on them and no weird tire wear.
As long as there is a little toe in and ride height is good, I don't think tire wear we a big deal.
In back, rear toe is set with the Eccentric bolts which can also change the camber slightly, but mostly the toe.
As long as there is a little toe in and ride height is good, I don't think tire wear we a big deal.
In back, rear toe is set with the Eccentric bolts which can also change the camber slightly, but mostly the toe.
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#33
06-26-2018, 12:10 AM
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XK8 alignment
Hi Below is details from expert? Jagtec? from forum "ROADFLY"
I have replaced basically everything in my front suspension and it still read negative 2 degrees, any one with similar issues?
Re: XK8 Alignment specs
For U.S. vehicles
All measurements in degrees
per JTIS:
Front
Camber +0.3 -0.9 Balance 1.0
Caster +5.0 +8.0 " 1.2
Toe +0.2 +/- 0.2
Rear
Camber -0.1 -0.9
Toe +0.3 +/- 0.2
Balance is the maximum difference allowed between the measurements of the right and left sides of the vehicle. The balance measurement Must Not be exceeded.
per Global Vehicle Specs:
Front
Camber LH -1.18 -0.18 RH -1.30 -0.30 Balance -0.83 +0.57
Caster LH +5.87 +7.27 RH +6.64 +8.04 Balance +0.06 +1.46
Toe +0.08 +0.42
Rear
Camber LH -0.90 -0.10 RH -0.90 -0.10 Balance -1.00 +1.00
Toe LH +0.08 +0.25 RH +0.08 +0.25
Thrust Angle
-0.08 +0.08
All measurements in degrees
per JTIS:
Front
Camber +0.3 -0.9 Balance 1.0
Caster +5.0 +8.0 " 1.2
Toe +0.2 +/- 0.2
Rear
Camber -0.1 -0.9
Toe +0.3 +/- 0.2
Balance is the maximum difference allowed between the measurements of the right and left sides of the vehicle. The balance measurement Must Not be exceeded.
per Global Vehicle Specs:
Front
Camber LH -1.18 -0.18 RH -1.30 -0.30 Balance -0.83 +0.57
Caster LH +5.87 +7.27 RH +6.64 +8.04 Balance +0.06 +1.46
Toe +0.08 +0.42
Rear
Camber LH -0.90 -0.10 RH -0.90 -0.10 Balance -1.00 +1.00
Toe LH +0.08 +0.25 RH +0.08 +0.25
Thrust Angle
-0.08 +0.08
#36
07-14-2018, 10:28 PM
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Hi, I understand there are many discussions on the the subject, but lets start to brake down the issue. I believe Jaguar XK8 cars from VIN 031302 are fitted with eccentric bolts? allowing up to 0.5 degrees camber adjustment of the front camber? (Please note what the bolts are not market from the factory as the rear bolt which clearly indicate the position?). comments ?
Regards, Magnus
Regards, Magnus
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