The starter motor of my MK2 RHD is sometimes stuck and when I put a screwdriver underneath the gear of the flywheel I can get it unstuck again but I want to have it fixed.
Now before I take out the entire gearbox as a total newby I want to take out the starter motor firs and see if there is a problem with it.
I have read some other posts where people seem to have diffeculties taking it out but eventually they got the job done.

I already took out the metal plate above the gearbox on the interiour of the car because there would be a hole to locate 1 of the screws. No luck. There is nothing.

Now it seems that I have a metal cover locking the starter motor in place as seen in the image but I cannot see how to get to these screws.


I have looked underneath the car but there I cannot see anything.

Anybody know how I can get it out?

 

The Starter motor actually comes out quite easily from the bottom. Just a bit of a fiddle. You might wish to go for a smaller in dimensions high torque starter motor.

You are aided, if your car is fitted with one of these ex factory. A more elegant version was fitted to later cars.

BTW your starter motor might have a broken spring on the ring-gear engagement gear.

 

Yep been there and have a couple of T shirts to prove it.

The starter motor is a bitch to get to and is only held in with two (I think)1/2 nuts on the device that Glyn has shown above. This is a locking ring which stops the bolt head rotating so you only have to undo the nut. To get access you are best removing the bonnet. If you want remove the carbs but this will take longer than removing the starter.
This is the starter motor with the ring attached so the two nuts are on the gearbox side of the starter motor.



That said getting to the nuts is not easy and when you do get to them and manage to get an open ended spanner on one there are two problems. First you cannot see what you are doing because you are working down past the carbs and the hole you have your arms in is what you need to look down as well so no chance of seeing what you are doing. All feel. Once you have the spanner located on the nut I am afraid it is a 1/6th turn each time even with a small stubby spanner. I started with a longer spanner just to get a lever long enough to break the tension of the nut but then moved to a stubby spanner to rotate it as there is just no room to rotate a long spanner.

Once the nuts are off and the ring removed the starter comes out the bottom of the car but before removing it I would also remove the oil pressure sender from the top of the oil filter housing as this gets in the way sliding the starter out of its hole and even more so when you are trying to get it back in. If you try as some suggest taking it out of the top with the carbs in situ you will have to remove the distributor and the top hose of the radiator as it has to go right to the front before going up and out. Out the bottom is tight but that is the way I went. Caution though the starter is bloody heavy and the hole to take it out is very small and most of the time you can only get one hand on the starter. Do not lie directly under the hole when removing the starter because if you slip and drop it it will hurt.
If the problem is with the starter motor I would change it as I have with a high torque modern starter. They cost less than the original to buy and are possibly cheaper than to try and fix the original one. They are smaller lighter and so much easier to fit. When it comes to turning the engine over there is no comparison. The new one spins up the engine straight away every time. It is plug and play just make sure you get the correct one for your car as there is a big difference between the manual and Auto starter motors. If you are bothered about originality don't be. You cannot see the starter motor from above because of the carbs and I have kept the original one just in case I sell the car and the new owner wants to go back to the original but he would be foolish to do so.

Top is the original for an Auto box. Next is the new Auto box high torque and at the bottom a high torque for a manual gear box.




I bought mine from this company.
https://www.powerlite-units.com/starters/rac302.html
Good service and when I had a problem (they sent me a manual starter and mine is an Auto car first) they sent out the replacement by the next day and then I returned the wrong unit to them. So no waiting to return one before the other was sent out. The new starter is held in with two bolts that go in from the gear box side through the bell housing in to threaded holes in the starter motor housing so no need for the ring anymore.

Any questions please ask.

 

Thanks a lot for the advice, really appriciate it!

I managed to get the top nut of from the inside of the car since it was already stripped a lot. I just needed to remove one more layer of slimy stuff to reach a plate with a hole behing it, there I could reach the top nut straight away.


For the bottom nut, do I reach that one from the top of the car or can I reach it from underneath the engine?

It is a fully restored car and first I wanted to stay original but I definitely don't want to do this job again very soon so I might as well fit a good starter. When I get it out at least...

 

From memory I think I took the bottom bolt out from the bottom. Unlike your manual Car the Auto does not have the removable gear box tunnel lid so the only way to get to the bolts is from the engine bay.

 

If memory serves, I put the locking ring with the welded two bolts in from the back of the bell housing.
This allows the nuts to be done up from the front.

I used a long extension to do up the nut closest to the block _ it seems to me I had to to turn down the socket a bit to get it in there.

I didn't even thing of trying to do the nuts up on the back side _ I don't even think it was installed that way.
Mine is a standard BTW.
I did take the carbs off _ when I did them I made sure all 8 threads could be done up by hand when I rebuilt the carbs earlier.

EDIT:
So I just checked, the locking bolt ring is installed from the back so the nuts are screwed on from the front.
I did have the carbs off, it would impossible to do the job otherwise with the locking ring mounted in this fashion.

I'm pretty sure it was done this way when I got the car.

 

All my comments relate to a manual/OD transmission car. I have never worked on an Automatic without the removable cover. I would definitely go to a more compact high torque motor as I allude to above.

I was going for concours which was achieved. However my completely rebuilt original starter motor cranks things fine aided by a very easy to start engine with all electrics up to snuff. Starts on the first push of the button. AED and all correctly set up.

 

This is the answer to an Automatic car. Convert to manual transmission. Huge tunnel with small manual gearbox & plenty of space to work around it. Lets face it all the Auto boxes fitted at the time were pretty rotten. Especially the DG 250 & Model 8. The 35 is the best of the bunch but severely torque limited. I would not even put one behind a 3.8 for fear of it spitting its guts as they were well known to do.




Sorry this car was caught in a brush fire. One of my donors. Fortunately once my car was finished.

 

If I had to change mine, I'd definitely go for a lighter, smaller upgrade. However, the originals are incredibly tough and tolerate severe abuse. With the Moss box's stump pulling bottom gear, an original will start the car from rest on an uphill slope (with failed clutch hydraulics). It will also unlock a rusted up clutch: run the car on the starter, back wheels off the ground and stamp on the brakes. I don't know if the upgrades will survive that sort of treatment, but, at least, they are easier to lift and manoeuvre one handed.

 

And keep plenty of band aids on hand. I have never managed to change a jaguar starter motor without losing skin off my knuckles and arms (and lashing of blood)

 

I took a quick look under the car this morning and I found a way to get there with an extension.
it was too dangerous to start because the car was on a cheap screw jack (if I pronounse this right) which was a little wobbling.

From the top of the car might be possible as well but there are a lot of pipes and tubes in the way.

 

Yes ~ please work safely. As Bill says keep some plaster handy. I was putting my restoration back together so could do things logically & in the easiest fashion and I still scuffed my knuckles.

 

As Glyn knows I have the pleasure of a large hydraulic ramp which I can safely lift my car on. I would not go under a car to do any work without a minimum of a pair of axle stands securely situated under the front subframe. A pair of ramps that you can drive the front wheels on to are also good but a single screw jack and I wouldn't even stand at the side of the car let alone get under it. Some of these nuts and bolts take some force to shift and that force can often be lateral and any sideways movement can tip a car off even a good single point jack.
A pair of axles stands can be bought for as little as £11.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/404467592...Bk9SR7iQ2N7OYg
A pair of ramps for as little as £40
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/195296345...Condition=1000
And a really good hydraulics lift as I have for as little as £2000.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/353642330...Condition=1000

Stay safe and never take a short cut with safety.

 

I envy your "large hydraulic ramp". I'm seriously considering installing one on the LHS of my double garage. That's Jaguar space! Damn priorities.

 

As Cass said and more. For me, two axle stands and a jack is OK as a minimum for looking under a car if the other end/side is on its wheels. For me to work on it, using a hammer and exerting force, I really want some redundancy so I'm safe if two of the stands disappear. My car presently has eight axle stands plus several oak blocks underneath it.

​​​​​Over the years, I've seen and experienced enough minor accidents and near misses of big ones to have learnt the importance of not rushing and always taking precautions.

 

My car started as a shell on 4 axle stands plus one trolley jack. Once both axles were in it lived much of it's time on it's wheels on my restorer's 4 post hydraulic hoist until trim etc.





Before pipework clean up & many other things. e.g. locking tabs, split pins and a whole host of items. Zip tied fuel & brake pipes LOL ~ properly done above.

 

Thanks guys, safety first indeed.

I went with 2 axles and managed to get both nuts off. Someone faced the same issues because both nuts could be losened by hand.

Nice car Glyn, what a beauty!
I have never seen that kind of dashboard on an MK2, is that a specific model?

 

That finish of wood veneer was common on a lot of S Types. I have many pictures. The centre panel on all S Types is wood like the MkX, 420 & 420G.

 

Before final polish with AutoArmor long life polymer sealant which really finishes it. For rest see Signature link.

Warning: Obviously AutoArmor is applied as a liquid for that final deep lustre. It has to be mechanically applied and mechanically buffed off BEFORE IT IS ALLOWED TO DRY. So work in small sections or it is all hell to get off. Half a door capping at maximum in one application. We just made it in one application for this centre section by working briskly and the area is not that great due to all the cut outs. It does not behave like a normal buffing compound.

 

I put the locking bolt ring on the back on both of mine as well, I didn't need to grind down a socket I just used a standard socket with long extension bars.

I've had to take both of them off recently (the 3.8 one two weeks back because the main spring broke) and can confirm that the 2.4 with Solex carbs can just be removed from the top without taking the carbs or anything else off. The 3.8 with SU carbs needed the oil pressue sender and distributor removing and it was quite tight but it came out ok.

When putting it back I used a bar with a bend in the end to hold the locking bolt ring in place while I pushed the starter motor in.