Hello all. I have recently got hold of a complete PAS for the 3.8S type. The steering box is marked HALE S-1-218. It doesnt mention the word "Burman" but from what I have read on this forum that is not uncommon.
It is not seized. OK, so my question is how hard is it to just replace the seals in it? I have read the comments about the nightmare that is the ball bearings during a rebuild but can one simply replace the seals without dismantling the whole thing?
Thanks in advance for any advice.

 

That is a second type Burman box with the torsion bar quill valve.

They can be rebuilt. Had mine rebuilt by Summit Steerings in SA. I would hand it over to a pro that has experience with that box. It can be a real fiddle. They also recognise the wear parts that make them non viable to rebuild. In my case they built me one good box out of 2.

Be very careful with the input shaft seal. Frequently damaged on the splines & causes a slow fluid drip.

 

Thanks Glyn. So what seals can be replaced without dismantling the whole unit. Can the input seal be pretty easily replaced? I did see one post where the user suggested covering the splines with aluminium foil so the edges of the splines arent quite so sharp. Apart from the input shaft seal are there any others which are essy to get at? I am not in a position to get the thing rebuilt, it is simply not an option so next best is to do what can be done with whats available to me. Cheers

 

The seal at the end of the upper shaft pointed out in red should be replaced, it's a place of high pressure.
The oil is directed here with that external winding line your see, the high pressure oil holds the shaft in place.
On mine, the bushing and O-ring was very worn, allowing the high pressure oil to go where it wasn't supposed to.
It was getting so hot it was smoking.

There will be some big O-Rings in "blue" that seals the covers; "green" that seals around the studs.
There will be at least two O-rings in "purple" sealing the main drop shaft, if it leaks here, you can't replace these unless you dismantle the box.

The other problem with mine is the main cylinder that moved the recirculating ball spiral had a groove worn it, my machine shop made a custom sleeve to repair it.

It's actually not so bad to rebuild.
Yes, when it's taken apart, ball bearing will fall all over the place, they have to be put back in place alternately _ big and small.
You will need a pair of fairly accurate Vernier calipers to sort what the sizes are, they only about 2 thou difference between the sizes.

The ***** are held in place by grease while it's carefully screwed back in place on reassembly _ that's the tricky part.
The rest is pretty straight forward, but you will also need a good pair of snap ring pliers.

There is also a piston sealing ring on the main piston, much like in an engine, that will have to be compressed on reassembly.

 

Thanks Jeff. So apart from the ones in the purple area all other seals can be replaced without fully dismantling the box. Is that correct?
also which of the areas you mention by colour are the most likely to leak?
cheers, Tim

 

#33 on the upper shaft is the most critical and the bushing in cover 38 is what wears, it needs to be checked with a pair of calipers, mine was so worn, I could see that it was out of round with my naked eye.
Go through and study the diagram and look for the O-rings.

Be carful when replacing O-rings #4, the shims 12 are set to give the correct preload for bearing 8/9.

Do each cover one at a time, don't remove all the covers at once.

The problem here is that if one set of O-rings are worn, then they are all probably worn, they get hard and cracked after some 40 or 50 years.

Even if the lower O-rings #33 (purple arrow) are worn, the box will still work, but it will always drip oil out the bottom.

And to answer your question, all of the O-rings are likely to leak, they are all under pressure, the red arrow will be an internal leak, but causes the most problems.

 

excellent info Jeff. Thanks for sharing.
Cheers, tim

 

So what I am reading is that pretty much every o ring and seal can be got to without dismantling the box except for the 2 o rings (no 33) in the lower drop arm area.
OK, now all I have to do is source a seal and O ring kit.
Cheers

 

I have just rebuilt my Adwest Marles steering box which is the successor to the Type 2 Burman and I have to say a lot easier to work on as there are nylon rings instead instead of all the ball bearings.No damage or wear to the nylon rings but after fifty years all the seals were hard and leaking.
My only piece of advice as taught to me is when reassembling the main shaft 32 through the "O" rings 33 be careful the teeth on the splines do not cut the inside of the rubber seals. It might not show immediately as the rubber will be soft but once it goes through some heat cycles and gets hard this is where your persistent dripping leak will come from. To stop this from happening I was taught to wrap the splines in something like cling film covered in grease as you slide the rubber seals over them. Once the seals are in place the cling film is removed and the seals have not been damaged.

 

Finding an O-ring kit may be impossible, or if you did find one, some may not fit.
I just sourced mine locally taking the box with me.
I found most of mine at a local hydraulics rebuilding service centre, they did everything to industrial jacks to hydraulic presses.

 

Jeff has shown a Type 1 PS Box. (exploded view). Input seal can be easily replaced. Protect from spline damage.

This is a Type 2. Same as yours. HALE (BTW ~ Barratts have it wrong on their UK site as well ~ early & late muddled ~ but chassis numbers correct)

Early = First Type (carry over from Mk2 on very early S Types)
Late = Second Type with torsion bar operated quill valve (majority of S Types)
Varamatic = Varamatic (final S Type iteration ~ approx a year after fitted to 420)




Legend.

 

Actually SNG Barratt show quite a few of the seals as available and in stock. Others are not stocked but available "back order". What they don't say is how long the wait might be on BO items, but may tell you if you order them.

 

Barratts sells a one size fits all seal kit for the S Type Burman boxes. You might have some spares left.

 

Thanks to everyone for their advice and opinions so far. They are greatly appreciated. I have taken the unit to a local hydraulics bloke to be pressure tested. If there are any leaks I will do the seals. If not (as the PO believes) then I wont touch it. I will be using an Astra PS Pump mounted behind the passenger side headlight in the wheel well. (ie LH front headlight) It is a RH drive car. I am sure there would be multiple people who have used this method to put PAS into one of these vehicles. If so would any of you have photos of the routing of the hoses please. From one point of view this is a trivial issue but I would be interested to see how tidy others have been able to make the install.
Cheers, Tim

 

Whatever happens you might do yourself a favour to buy a seal kit while they are readily available & store in a cool dry location. Parts availability comes & goes. Can't help with Astra installation.

 

OK, the unit came back absolutely free of even the smallest leak. It was tested at 1000psi so I am confident in the test. I have now installed the pump in the LH wheel well basically where the vacuum reservoir was. The reservoir has been move nearer to the parking light. I have also installed the steering box and other suspension components.
So I am up to reconnecting the steering column. This is where I have bumped into my first issue .
Trying to put the lower steering column back onto the input shaft of the steering box. It gets to a certain point an will not move any farther. From what I can see there is a small piece of wire (maybe 0.5mm in diameter) hanging down from a piece of the shaft. This is coloured pink in the attached image and marked C.The input shaft has a separate piece about 2mm wide (A) then on top of that is another piece (B) roughly the same width but slightly smaller diameter. Wrapped around B and hanging down onto the splines is that tiny piece of wire (C).
Can I bend it up out of the way or cut it off? What is its purpose please?

 

There should not be anything there that I am aware of. I have just looked at the spare Burman box I have in the garage and there is nothing on top of that. There is no electrical connection between the two.
Can I suggest you contact the person who rebuilt the box for you as it might be something they used to protect the seal when forcing it over the splines and it can be removed. Other than that I don't know but may someone else can come up with a better idea.

 

Should be no bits of wire. Should look like this. Jaguar did have a habit of wiring tags onto things & this might be the remnants of one of those. There might be something there. Bend it out of the way. I don't remember any such thing on my car.

 

OK, thanks guys, much appreciated.
Cheers

 

I contacted ICS about rebuilding my p.a. steering box which is leaking too, and they do not work on Burmans anymore, only on Adwest boxes.