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Replaced rear tie rods

  #1  
Old 10-07-2018, 07:43 AM
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Default Replaced rear tie rods

So my new to me 03 w/52k miles is in excellent mechanical condition. However as I was inspecting the suspension before getting an alignment and new tires I noticed the rear tie rod knuckle (near the brake disk) were completely degraded and crumbling.
As a OEM design engineer I immediately saw the reason. Ford/Jag for some reason put them too close to the brakes. The large and sudden thermocycles of brake operation degrade non-metal parts quickly.
Having been a engineer working with Ford over the yrs I must say I'm very surprised at this situation.
In situations where we have big thermcycles and therfore a concern, we will simulate heat with CAD/CAE
, make physical parts and test.. Then evaluate if the parts will live up to maker mile / time standards. If ok we then write the SPEC for the material grade, get quotes, and then go from there..
In this case on the S-Type the only reason I can see they put the knuckle so close to the brake disk is because they wanted suspension geometry to be the primary concern. Not longevity. I am surprised at this because in my yrs of experience I've never seen a compromise like this for a production car.

Here is the part I bought: https://www.1aauto.com/products/i/1ASFK02056?trk_msg=153CDMFVDU6KD334ALPJMS9RVG&trk_ contact=K8J867OOHIU6P9BF8OH2O0561C&trk_module=tra& trk_sid=4FVS4FDODE409P4ENMECLL2J1G&utm_source=Tran sactional&utm_medium=Email&utm_term=https%3a%2f%2f www.1aauto.com%2fproducts%2fi%2f1ASFK02056&utm_cam paign=OrderConfirmation&utm_content=1A+Order+Confi rmation
Their quality seems to be 90% as good as the original part. The welds look sloppy but adequate. The strength seems to be on par. And the length of the threaded area is moved a little closer to the outer knuckle. Plenty of tool access during alignment so it's not a concern.

The car underneath is as clean as a whistle and all other bushings look excellent for an 03. But look at the condition of these rear (outer) tie rod joints!




 

Last edited by wydopnthrtl; 10-07-2018 at 08:25 AM.
  #2  
Old 10-07-2018, 09:30 AM
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Yep, everyone here will have to replace rear tie rods sooner or later. I replaced ours years ago and they are still holding up.

http://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/s-type-s-type-r-supercharged-v8-x200-15/2005-3-0-rear-tie-rod-sway-bar-links-replacement-w-pics-faq-55280/#post356251
 
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Old 10-07-2018, 11:30 AM
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I had to do mine at car about 11yrs old.

I figure that's good enough.
 
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Old 10-07-2018, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by joycesjag View Post
Yep, everyone here will have to replace rear tie rods sooner or later. I replaced ours years ago and they are still holding up.

http://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/s-...80/#post356251
Thanks for the link. Your end links looked degraded. At that time how many miles was on the car?

All other parts on mine still look very good. It'll be interesting to see how long they last.
 
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Old 10-07-2018, 03:02 PM
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Originally Posted by wydopnthrtl View Post
Your end links looked degraded. At that time how many miles was on the car?
I want to say about 50k, and a few years old. Jon89's previous S Type were replaced under warranty. His wasn't that old either before the boots started to crack.

 
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Old 10-07-2018, 03:56 PM
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Mine had done over 120K.
 
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Old 10-07-2018, 04:50 PM
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http://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/s-type-s-type-r-supercharged-v8-x200-15/warranty-almost-up-16412/
 
  #8  
Old 10-07-2018, 05:02 PM
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For reference if there are any early MY2000 X200s that need to have the rear toe links replaced, Jaguar issued a TSB to modify the cross member mounting point.
 
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Old 10-08-2018, 08:03 AM
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Links and I suspect the tie rod boots must have been made from materials that were either out of spec or not spec'ed properly.
 
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Old 10-08-2018, 11:35 AM
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As Rick (joycesjag) pointed out above, mine were initially replaced under warranty in April 2009 when the car had less than 25,000 miles on the odometer. It was a 2005 S-Type 3.0 built in May 2005. Rick clued me in to the issue as soon as he discovered how badly his wife's 2005 S-Type 3.0's boots had disintegrated. I immediately checked mine and found them to be cracked and flattened as well. I still had two months of the factory warranty remaining on the car at that time so I called my local dealership and made them pony up for new rear links on both sides of the car....
 
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Old 10-08-2018, 08:36 PM
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Can't seem to attach picture... I'll try later
 

Last edited by wydopnthrtl; 10-08-2018 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 10-09-2018, 09:32 PM
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Here is the new tie-rod as seen through the wheel. You can see how close it is to the brake disk.


 
  #13  
Old 10-11-2018, 07:58 AM
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Just curious, did you notice any handling issues while driving with the failed tie rod ends?

Mine don't look nearly as bad as yours, but I will plan to replace them very soon. No real handling issues with mine, but the suspension doesn't feel as precise as before. I've just chalked that up to cumulative wear with 300k miles.

​​​
 
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Old 10-11-2018, 09:41 AM
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Karl, when I replaced Joyce's Jags, the boots were cracked as seen in the links provided here but the actual "joints" were still tight. I guess if I would have researched replacement boot covers I could have gotten away alot cheaper.

The replacements are still in good shape, the boots have no checking or cracking. Back in the day, I used Motorcars Ltd. for my replacement parts, when they were a forum sponsor. Now I choose SNG Barratt as they have taken up the cause of forum sponsor.
 
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Old 10-11-2018, 03:52 PM
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hi
Ive found nowadays if you bu these off places like ebay or your local parts place
the quality is shocking, the rubber boots are so poor quality they perish within 12 months, then not long after the joint fails, due to water and dirt getting inside
if you buy genuine one there some times double or tripple the price but they last, 10 times as long
so I wont buy non genuines ones any more, genuine ones are better value long term
so if its a keeper, genuine ones
cheers
Joe
 
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Old 10-11-2018, 06:41 PM
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The originals were not noticeable when driving. But in your hand they had maybe 1mm of slop. The new ones are firm but movable by hand.
 

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  #17  
Old 10-12-2018, 10:52 AM
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The dust shield/backing plate on the smaller rotored cars is the heat/backing plate shield. On larger rotors like the r equiped models theres and metal heat shield that covers the joing and the bolt passes through it top and bottom. Either way theyre rubber boots and just like tires they degrade with time. I have also said that for money out of your wallet i replace when theres play not cracked boots. If you replace for cracked boots and no play youll be replacing
2 to 1
 
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Old 10-12-2018, 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Brutal View Post
... I have also said that for money out of your wallet i replace when theres play not cracked boots. If you replace for cracked boots and no play youll be replacing
2 to 1
Replacing right before new tires and getting a 4 wheel alignment... in my book is wise.
 
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Old 10-12-2018, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by wydopnthrtl View Post
replacing right before new tires and getting a 4 wheel alignment... In my book is wise.
just relating my opinion from working on them for 21 years with no miles to 300k miles. I have customers that have not even had boots for years and many miles that still dont have play in those rear tie rods. But if you have an ext warranty contract ill put them in all day. Or if it just bugs you and want to spend the money
 
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Old 10-12-2018, 09:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Brutal View Post
just relating my opinion from working on them for 21 years with no miles to 300k miles. I have customers that have not even had boots for years and many miles that still dont have play in those rear tie rods. But if you have an ext warranty contract ill put them in all day. Or if it just bugs you and want to spend the money
thanks brutal. My 06 str has degraded boots but no play. I will leave them alone for now. Need lower damper bushings front and back first
 

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