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Tune-up plans/checklist and progress - timing chains / transmission

XF and XFR ( X250 ) 2007 - 2015

Tune-up plans/checklist and progress - timing chains / transmission

 
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Old 02-24-2019, 07:35 PM
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Default Tune-up plans/checklist and progress - timing chains / transmission

I'm starting this thread mostly as a way to track my progress but also to easier track the advice of people and hopefully to help others that might want to do the same.
My plan is to start taking things apart as soon warm weather hits Canada (usually end of April) - I'm not up to work in the cold in garage anymore (I guess something to do with getting older.. ). Also with the warmer weather and no car for a few weeks, I will be able to enjoy riding my bicycles.

Right now I am in the process of gathering things.
Here is what I have so far (too bad I cannot edit this list over time. If stuff will be added on).

- - -

Engine

I am I guess lucky to know that my model was built using the 8mm chains. This makes things easier and there is no need to "upgrade" other parts in order to use the 8mm chains.
Things that I have (and recommended by the Jaguar):

- C2Z22078 x2 - Chain primary
- C2Z28429 x1 - Guide chain
- C2Z28430 x1 - Guide chain
- C2Z28431 x2 - Blade chain
- C2Z28428 x2 - Tensioner-C

Plus an engine alignment kit (not ordered at this time).
As a fun fact, I know there are ways to change timing chains (on other engines) without an actual "alignment". As long as you lock everything in place as is (if you have the possibility) BEFORE you remove everything - also mark and note the color links placement of the chain. Usually NOT a recommended way to do things since the risk of screwing up things is much higher.
I've actually seen videos of people tackling the chain replacement by locking the cams in place before remove the old components.


I will also be looking to replace the spark plugs (already have a new set waiting) and check to see if there is a need for valve cleaning.
Speaking of this - I am also looking to install an oil catch can, thanks to the direct injectors. I will probably need some advise on what hose to cut .

I am bracing myself for any other unexpected encounters... but as everyone else that was in similar situations, hope and pray I won't :|.

Reason:
- high mileage car (around 185,000 km at the writing of this post), third owner; unknown if this was done in the past on the car and at the same time there is some chatter from the engine.
- I am planning to do it myself because I cannot justify spending another 6-7k when the whole car by itself was around 14k (CAD). Also, I have some experience on taking things apart when it comes to cars, so this will be a fun project for me.

- - -

Transmission

Not much going on here... doing this because I am sure the oil inside the transmission was never changed (by the way that pan and bolts looks like).
And no, please, let's not debate the "sealed for life" issue here. Let's agree to disagree and let's move on - I'm doing it .

- Oil pan
- Sleeve connector seal kit 6pcs

Again, I am bracing myself on this one as well... I'm really not in the mood to remove transmission from the car for a complete rebuild - never liked doing this and always hated it.
Really annoying to remove/install transmissions when you are under the car on your back, even with a floor jack :|.

- - -

What I need at this stage if possible...

Torque specs... for EVERYTHING - if anyone knows them (or some manual that I can grab the info from it). Putting them here however, will be much easier for someone else to follow.
Any monkey with a wrench can take things apart... problem is when you put them together and you have to make sure everything is tight up properly.

Anyone is more than welcome to chime in with any advice - I am more than happy to read and learn.
I am opened to other suggestions, if is a good idea to change/check other things that I do not have on the list; but I might be limited by budget (unfortunately I do have limitations ).

With that said, this thread will start slow... it won't get too exciting until I get to pull things apart. I have like 2 months to get all my things in order, get all the parts and come up with a good plan, thanks to all of you who had experience working on these beauties.
 
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Old 02-24-2019, 08:00 PM
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A couple of things:
  • Order parts using the Land Rover part numbers rather than the Jaguar ones - they're exactly the same parts but there can be a significant difference in cost.
    • LR051011 x 1 - Guide Chain
    • LR051012 x 1 - Guide Chain
    • LR051008 x 2 - Chain Tensioner
    • LR051013 x 2 - Blade Chain
    • LR023048 x 2 - Chain Primary
  • Workshop manual has all torques required. See attached.
  • You'll need a injector puller tool to remove the injectors, which you'll need to do to remove the rocker covers to lock the cams into place.
  • You'll need a few tools for removing and refitting the crank pulley. Make sure you note bolt type by numbers on head of crank bolt before removal - most are reverse-threaded.
  • When refitting the tensioners with the chains, you are required to lever the blade so that the ratchet in the tensioner clicks. This is important, because not every guide mentions this, but the workshop manual does. Warning: The workshop manual says to use "considerable force" and they're really not f**king around here - I had to use a large bar to get enough leverage. The click may not be as audible as the manual suggests but you'll know you've got it because you won't be able to push the blade/tensioner back in.
  • The workshop manual also recommends replacing the high-pressure fuel pipes that you remove as part of this. Personally, I doubt you need to, but I did.
 
Attached Files
File Type: pdf
Timing Drive Components.pdf (2.21 MB, 23 views)
File Type: pdf
Timing Cover.pdf (353.5 KB, 23 views)

Last edited by davetibbs; 02-24-2019 at 08:22 PM.
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Old 02-24-2019, 08:30 PM
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davetibbs - those manuals will come in very handy - thank you for sharing them! Looks like I have some studying to do

I had a quick look at the prices on the LR parts you have provided and it looks like what I have paid locally in CAD, is actually better than if I would of ordered the LR parts online (shipping and customs would of killed me).
But maybe this will be helpful for someone else - check LR prices before getting the Jaguar parts! Great idea, thanks!

Thanks for mentioning the injector puller tool... did not thought about needing one. I have none, so I guess I should start looking for one.

I'll definitely make a note on the fuel pipes. I guess that for now I will reserve the decision of replacing them when putting things together.
 

Last edited by mrNewt; 02-24-2019 at 08:36 PM.
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Old 02-24-2019, 09:18 PM
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If you haven't already done so, get yourself a copy of the 2010-2011 XFR Workshop Manual and the AJ133 Technical Training PDF from my Dropbox (links below).
Both cover the NA as well as the SC.
No index or listing of torque specs that I can see, rather they are scattered throughout both.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/bet26xniua...kshop.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8y4iax9hm2...%20V8.pdf?dl=0
 
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Old 02-24-2019, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by OzXFR View Post
If you haven't already done so, get yourself a copy of the 2010-2011 XFR Workshop Manual and the AJ133 Technical Training PDF from my Dropbox (links below).
Both cover the NA as well as the SC.
No index or listing of torque specs that I can see, rather they are scattered throughout both.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/bet26xniua...kshop.pdf?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8y4iax9hm2...%20V8.pdf?dl=0
Thank you!
Already had the 5 litre V8 - from you, you linked it to me before.
I grabbed the other one as well!
 

Last edited by mrNewt; 02-25-2019 at 07:13 AM.
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Old 02-24-2019, 11:26 PM
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Attaching other manual sections for posterity
 
Attached Files
File Type: pdf
Crankshaft Pulley.pdf (997.1 KB, 20 views)
File Type: pdf
Valve Cover LH.pdf (182.0 KB, 18 views)
File Type: pdf
Valve Cover RH.pdf (176.7 KB, 16 views)
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Old 02-24-2019, 11:36 PM
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Oh, another random thing I remembered - there's a mistake in the workshop manual - it advises you to fit the oil vacuum tube after the VVT/Chain/Tensioner assembly (step 39 in the "timing drive components" section) - this is not physically possible as the lower bolt on the tube is behind the primary chain. You need to install the oil vacuum tube before the chains, and install and tighten the lower bolt. There will still be enough flex in the upper part of the tube to allow you to install the chains and VVTs before installing and tightening the top bolt.

Not sure how this was missed when they wrote the workshop manual, as you can clearly see on the diagram for Step 39 the lower bolt is hidden by the chain.
 
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Old 02-25-2019, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by davetibbs View Post
Oh, another random thing I remembered - there's a mistake in the workshop manual - it advises you to fit the oil vacuum tube after the VVT/Chain/Tensioner assembly (step 39 in the "timing drive components" section) - this is not physically possible as the lower bolt on the tube is behind the primary chain. You need to install the oil vacuum tube before the chains, and install and tighten the lower bolt. There will still be enough flex in the upper part of the tube to allow you to install the chains and VVTs before installing and tightening the top bolt.

Not sure how this was missed when they wrote the workshop manual, as you can clearly see on the diagram for Step 39 the lower bolt is hidden by the chain.
Yep, as our friend Brutal has mentioned the Workshop Manual (not just the XF but many other Jags) is quite wrong on many procedures.
I have also found that the specified procedure for all sorts of things (across XFS, XFR and F-Type) is completely OTT as to how many components you need to remove before you can do some quite simple things, and most times I found obvious short cuts which saved me a heap of time and angst.
 

Last edited by OzXFR; 02-25-2019 at 12:06 AM.
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Old 02-25-2019, 12:11 AM
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davetibbs - Thanks for mentioning that. It would probably left me perplex a little lol
 
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Old 04-05-2019, 07:45 PM
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As an update, still waiting for the end of this month (kind of excited) - still cold around here.

I have placed an order for the alignment kit and the transmission sleeve connector seal kit 6pcs - on their way.
I still have to order oil for everything (quick calculation... is going to be around $340 CAD for all the oil I need - engine, transmission and read differential ), the injectors extractor and new seals for them.

After that I think I will be good to go .
 

Last edited by mrNewt; 04-05-2019 at 07:51 PM.
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Old 04-06-2019, 08:59 PM
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Good Luck!!!
 
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Old 04-08-2019, 07:48 AM
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Originally Posted by jahmezis45 View Post
Good Luck!!!
Thank you - I'll probably need it .

- - - - - - - - -

davetibbs - I was looking for an injector puller and there are so many flavours out there, I have no idea what to choose.
Are all the same or do I need something specific for this car? Which one did you used for your car?
 
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Old 04-15-2019, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by davetibbs View Post
Attaching other manual sections for posterity
davetibbs, I read the crankshat pulley pdf document you posted. Acording to this pdf the flywheel locking tool (mounted replacing the starter motor) is not mounted when you remove the pulley bolt. The bolt is very tight so makes no sense to me, is it another workshop manual mistake?
 
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Old 05-08-2019, 07:53 AM
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So next week is the week... hopefully by the end of it I will have a running car or a... "finished car" :|.

I was going trough the manuals and I keep on seeing this image with a black square on top it... how important is this thing!? :|


 
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Old 05-09-2019, 12:20 AM
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That may have been a problem converting/saving the PDF - I can see if I can get a good copy.

From memory it's just showing how to identify you're fitting the right parts - and if you buy the new ones you don't need to worry.

I listed a few things I came across when doing the chains that the manual got wrong in my rebuild thread I think - like when to install the bolts holding the oil vacuum tube in place.

You'll definitely get a workout setting the tensioner blades in place - I've seen some (landrover-centric) guides not mention it but the workshop manual talks about how you have to lever the tensioner blades so the ratchet clicks, and they say to use "considerable force" - "considerable" is accurate. In my experience the "click" the manual talks about isn't always that audible, but you'll know if you've got it because you won't be able to push the blade back to compress the tensioner.
 
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Old 05-09-2019, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by davetibbs View Post
That may have been a problem converting/saving the PDF - I can see if I can get a good copy.

From memory it's just showing how to identify you're fitting the right parts - and if you buy the new ones you don't need to worry.

I listed a few things I came across when doing the chains that the manual got wrong in my rebuild thread I think - like when to install the bolts holding the oil vacuum tube in place.

You'll definitely get a workout setting the tensioner blades in place - I've seen some (landrover-centric) guides not mention it but the workshop manual talks about how you have to lever the tensioner blades so the ratchet clicks, and they say to use "considerable force" - "considerable" is accurate. In my experience the "click" the manual talks about isn't always that audible, but you'll know if you've got it because you won't be able to push the blade back to compress the tensioner.
Hi Dave, thanks for the input - if is just the image of the parts needed it then don't worry about it .
I'm pretty sure I do have the right ones.

Here is a question though... maybe I missed this in the manuals I've read (I guess I should go trough them again), but how do they want you to lever the blades if is such a workout. From what I can see, they are pretty much aluminium parts and they can easily be damaged if you put too much force on them.

Also, the new tensioners come with the pin in place to block the piston from coming out. Wouldn't the procedure be to install the chain, then the tensioner, then the blade and only after everything is in place you release the pins from the tensioners?
At least that is what I remember from the Hondas that I did similar work in the past.
 

Last edited by mrNewt; 05-09-2019 at 06:50 AM.
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Old 05-09-2019, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by mrNewt View Post
Here is a question though... maybe I missed this in the manuals I've read (I guess I should go trough them again), but how do they want you to lever the blades if is such a workout. From what I can see, they are pretty much aluminium parts and they can easily be damaged if you put too much force on them.
They are some sort of alloy, but they're pretty strong - think about the tension they're constantly under. From memory I used a pretty long 1/2" extension bar to lever the blade against the block webbing.

Originally Posted by mrNewt View Post
Also, the new tensioners come with the pin in place to block the piston from coming out. Wouldn't the procedure be to install the chain, then the tensioner, then the blade and only after everything is in place you release the pins from the tensioners?
At least that is what I remember from the Hondas that I did similar work in the past.
Yes you are correct, you don't pull the locking pin on the tensioner until the tensioner, both blades, and the chain are installed correctly and you want to apply tension to the chain. Check out step 14 of the reassembly steps in the workshop manual, which shows the tensioner installed with the pin still in it.
 
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Old 05-09-2019, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by davetibbs View Post
They are some sort of alloy, but they're pretty strong - think about the tension they're constantly under. From memory I used a pretty long 1/2" extension bar to lever the blade against the block webbing.
...
Yes you are correct, you don't pull the locking pin on the tensioner until the tensioner, both blades, and the chain are installed correctly and you want to apply tension to the chain. Check out step 14 of the reassembly steps in the workshop manual, which shows the tensioner installed with the pin still in it.
That's good to know! I guess I will realize more of how it works once I am actually doing it .
 

Last edited by mrNewt; 05-09-2019 at 06:32 PM.
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Old 05-10-2019, 08:09 AM
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If doing a ZF transmission service I get my parts from The CTSC.
They really are top of the line on ZF stuff! I used them for my old 6 speed ZF service.

ZF Parts
.
.
.
 
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Old 05-10-2019, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by clubairth1 View Post
If doing a ZF transmission service I get my parts from The CTSC.
They really are top of the line on ZF stuff! I used them for my old 6 speed ZF service.

ZF Parts
.
.
.
Thanks - I already have all the parts that I need for the transmission work,, but it should help someone else that is looking for the parts .
Managed to find them at a dscount from some guy directly from Germany. Should be interesting, never did a job on a transmission like this . Curious how seized the filler bolt is... :|. That's what I am afraid the most.
 

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