my 1997 X300 4.0l sport is suffering from double speed indicators .all bulbs are good .the lamp failure warning light comes on when right or left turn is selected and the indicators flash at double speed .if I reach behind me and pull the brown relay on the drivers side heelboard the indicators function normally but of course the engine dies .The hazard lights go at double speed with ignition on and normal speed with it off.I have replaced all bulbs and cleaned holders and tried a different LCM .ANY ideas anyone please

 

Welcome to the forum ax300,

I've moved your question from General Tech Help to X300 forum. Members here with the same model will be able to help.

Graham

 

Get the correct bulbs.

The indicators will double flash on bulb failure.

The circuit measures current draw.

Mine did that with LED's but went away when relays
were interposed to provide additional functionality
in the circuit. The relays draw more current than the
LED.

Too bad, I rather liked the double speed tick tock.

 

Also if a 24v bulb has gotten in the bunch, but usually only on that one side.

I believe you know that the front have 2 bulbs per side??.

 

Thanks all my bulbs have been changed and are correct this vin number only has single bulbs at front

 

Not going into an extened discussion on this but this parts drawing shows 2 bulb sockets per side.

The lamp part #'s are as follows:
LNA8401SB for the LH.
LNA8400AB for the RH.

There is no mention of up to or after Vin # for any market I can find.

If someone has only put 1 bulb per side in the large front lamps, the backfeed load will give double flash.

I had NO idea there were 2 per side when I got my X300, and I learnt something. Strange to have 2 per side, but thats how it is.

 

Hi Grant i see what you mean but the front indicators on my model have only 1 bulb in a single bulb holder in the amber lens .I have discovered today that if I remove the brake light 10amp fuse from right hand heelboard panel obviously the brake lights do not work but the indicator function returns to normal only to go back to double speed when the fuse is put back.I wonder if I can power the brake light switch and brakelights on an independent line and do away with the heelboard fuse link

 

AX300, are you sure you have an X300(4.0l inline 6) or X308(4.0l V8)? You mention only having one bulb in your front turn indicator, which illustrated below is from the X308.

In the USA the X300 was a 1995-1997 model year, and the X308 was 1998-2003. But ROW (Rest of World) the X308 may be considered to have begun in 1997.

Which do you have? You VIN will tell the tale.

IF you have an X308, there may still be folks here that can help, but you may get more visibility if your post is moved to the correct X308 forum.

.

 

Well picked up Al, never ventured to that scenario.

 

Hi all thanks for all your input my jag is an inline 6 cylinder x300 built in UK in June1997 As you all know this is nearing the end of the line for this model to be superceded by the x308 V8 engine .My VIN is 810413 .In January 1997 Jaguar issued a new wiring diagram which covered x300 series all variants from vin 787954 until the end of production .All models starting with this vin onwards had one single front indicator each side exactly as you mentioned the same as the x308 until whatever vin ended the x300 production series
Regards Alec
PS I still only get working indicators when I pull the brake light fuse !!

 

Hi just consulted heritage jaguar trust
The first of these 1997 x300 models was 787954 .
807185 was the last 12cylinder off the line and 812255 was the last 6 cylinder off the line in July 1997 .The first xj8 x308 was 812256 in july 1997
Regards Alec

 

I'd carefully inspect each bulb in the brake circuit for the problem, then. I know.... you've already done that..... I'd repeat that part.

 

I agree here.

My son, who knows it all at 34yo, has a 2002 Commodore Calais (Google will help those up there) and decided for some bizarre reason to replace all the bulbs in the car.

Nicked them from my stash, as only kids can do, and proceded.

Bulb failure now on, NOT there before, and then it got too hard for his brain cells, but there was strange things happening when he put it in reverse and stood on the brakes. Brake light circuit active, and reverse light circuit active.

Dad to the rescue, as only us Dad's can.

Much alcohol (Dad supplied as usual), and then back to basics, start at the beginning and work slowly through where he had been.

Eventually found that "genius" had somehow managed to install a single contact bulb in a twin bulb socket, thus cross feeding the brake/tail light circuit, and upsetting the cars internals.

Took some care to extract said bulb without breaking the plastic holder/socket. He did a good job of getting the bloody thing in there. Intsalled the correct bulb, the correct way around (offset pins bulb), and whoopee, all sweet in Commodore land.

His indicators were just fine, but just saying, how some silly event can reek havoc.

 

Not to argue, but I think we may need more info

The VIN range for the X300 is (V)720125 to (V)812255. As you point out, your VIN 810413 falls within the very end of this range. So it is definitely possible some X308 features "leaked" into the end of the X300 production, like the updated rear seat in 97, but this is the first I've heard of anything else.

FYI, referencing your comment about all X300's after VIN 787954 having an updated wiring harness with a single bulb turn indicator, my USA 1997 XJR6 is VIN 795492 and has the X300 rectangular dual bulb front turn indicator lamps as illustrated above and per the links to the correct part numbers below from Jaguar Classic Parts, not single bulb X300 or oval X308 lamps.

Referencing Jaguar Classic Parts, there is only one part number for the X300 front turn indicator lamps, and that part as illustrated above is a dual lamp unit. These are the LH and RH part numbers.


Direction Indicator Lamp-Front - Parts For XJ Series from (V)720125 to (V)812255 (X300) | Jaguar Classic Parts UK


LH LNA4801AB

Part no. LNA4801AB | Direction indicator lamp parts from Jaguar Classic Parts UK


RH LNA4800AB

Part no. LNA4800AB | Direction indicator lamp parts from Jaguar Classic Parts UK

You mention the Jaguar Classic Parts indicate that after VIN 787954 the change to the X308 lamps and/or single bulb harness occurred. Can you provide the link at Jaguar Classic Parts? That might help us diagnose the electrical problem and help other owners that may face this unusual configuration.

Also can you post a photo of your X300's front end? I've never seen an X300 with the X308 bumpers that have the oval single bulb X308 lenses (among other differences) versus the square X300 dual bulb lenses. If you have the X308 bumpers, that is something rather unique.

....intriguing.


Also, just to re-clarify, we are talking about the front facing bumper mounted turn signal/indicator/flasher lights.

You aren't talking about he side marker or side turn signal/indicator/flasher lights are you? Those side lamps are indeed single bulb units in both the X300 and X308
.

These flash on the X300, and do not exist on the X308. They are replaced by a "leaper" badge on the X308 although the wiring and socket on the LH side for a lamp is present behind the fender on the X308. The harness and socket are not present on the RH side in the X308.

http://www.jaguarclassicparts.com/uk...-repeater-lamp


These don't flash on the X300, but I beleive the oval versions on the X308 do as the side turn indicator function since the lamp above is absent on the X308.

http://www.jaguarclassicparts.com/uk...nd-reflex-lamp



Regarding your pulling the brake light fuse, two questions/observations:

1) Which fuse location are you pulling?
2) If your turn blinker/indicator flash rate returns to normal when pulling the brake fuse, I'd check the brake bulbs and brake switch. The brake and rear turn indicator on the X300 are not integrated into one bulb, so pulling the fuse shouldn't make any difference. But who knows Also, if the brake lights are influencing the flash rate, maybe the rear lighting module is malfunctioning?




Below are photos of an X300 and X308 front end, showing the bumper and lamp differences:

 

Hi all I will try and put some pics up for you all to see my1997 x300 xj sport has got the x308 front bumper and round fog lamps as shown in the pics .I believe this was only done in the UK market although I may be wrong.My hood also has the growler badge as well as the leaping cat on it so this maybe a mix of x300 andx308

 

As for indicator setup I have two single bulb indicators in oval holders in the front bumper two amber bulbs in the rear clear cluster (one each side}and one 5w side repeater in each front wing adjacent to the B pillar.The lights are controlled by one combined lamp control module mounted in the trunk with the fuse board.There are no side marker lights the apertures for these have plain amber reflectors in them.I am pulling a 10A fuse located in the RH side heelboard panel.This stops the brake lights from working but allows all indicators to operate at normal speed and puts bulb failure light on dash out.As soon as this fuse is reinstated the brake lights work the indicators all go back to double speed and the bulb failure light illumunatesI have tried a known good LCM from another vehicle and it makes no difference .When I put the module from my vehicle to the other all is good.I am guessing there must be a ground issue here somewhere but I am getting nowhere.I have tried a seperate ground from indicators to battery but it made no diifference.I hope I will be able to post some pics but I aint very good at that bit .Hope this explains my issue a little clearer .Thanks for all your input to date Regards Alec

 

Thanks for the additional info Alex. Definitely an interesting combination.

Coincidentally, today I just replaced my LH front turn signal lamp as my lens was cracked, and upon doing so my "bulb out" indicator lit as soon as I pressed the brake. In my case I think this is just coincidence as I was tinkering around in the trunk and removed the rear brake/turn light cover and was banging around the area. I probably knocked a bulb loose or broke a filament. But I thought of this thread as soon as I started the car, pressed the brake and saw the lamp out indicator.... which BTW is the first time I've ever seen it lit in the 2 years I've owned the car. So something new

Should be an easy fix...

.

 

Hi all .So here is the final answer the problem is solved.It is true that some of the parts for the :new:x308 were used to finish off the last of the x300 series ,however lights and indicators was not involved.Further investigation on a four post lift has revealed some cut and shut wiring bodgery.The previous owner must have suffered front bumper damage and has replaced the damaged x300 bumper with anx308 one .The indicators were flashing at double speed because the LCM in trunk was looking for two more bulbs in the circuit that now dont exist as we have previously discussed .Until I can find a correct bumper in the right colour I have wired two bulbs into place so now the system is flashing normally even though the two extra bulbs are in the trunk.!!!!!I still cannot work out how removing the brake light fuse made this problem go away but that is one of lifes mysteries.Thanks to you all for your input and interest
Happy motoring
PS my other toy is a 1976 series 1 lotus eclat which failed to start on Sunday .That took about 20 mins to fix .No ECU,S engine management or lighting modules on that just straight forward electrics and mechanics!!!!
Happy Days Alec

 

Glad to hear you figured out the problem Alec, and to be honest this was going to be my next suggestion if we didn't seem to be getting anywhere.... to ask if perhaps someone fitted an X308 bumper to your X300 somewhere along the line and knackered the wiring.

But goes to show that previous owners and their bodgery can cause some seriously difficult headaches to decipher. Usually these are in the electrical area, often with aftermarket audio installs where they cut harnesses and pull electrical supplies and grounds from odd random places.

Again, good news the mystery is solved!

.

 

Thanks Al I am interested in your other vehicles .I am familiar with the Riviera and the Moto Guzzi but can you enlighten me as to what a Buick Roadmaster is please .This is new to me