XJ XJ8 / XJR ( X308 ) 1997 - 2003

2000 xj8 starts and immediately dies

 
  #1  
Old 02-11-2019, 12:50 PM
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Default 2000 xj8 starts and immediately dies

i have spent hours searching for this in other threads. I may have missed the one that I needed, so apologies up front.

We bought a 2000 xj8 van den Plas a couple weeks ago. We had a 95 xj6 so I knew that jags had their own personalities.

I made a huge mistake and washed the engine. Previous owners or mechanics had pretty much overtightened every bolt on the covers and created cracks and such. Water got into everything and car wouldnít run well. Restricted performance. I removed the coils, and blew out the cylinders and cleaned all the connections with electronics cleaner. I was only able to replace one plug, the rest are stuck. Got rid of the water in air filter housing and replaced air filter. Replaced maf sensor. Blew out the air hoses with a leaf blower. Blew the entire engine with the leaf blower too. She started right up and ran fine after 30 seconds or so. Idled perfectly, could floor it from a dead stop, went to 70mph no problem. The only problem I had was when flooring it while already traveling around 35 mph. Stuttered bad, like turning the engine on and off. I ordered some throttle housing cleaner arriving tomorrow, which I saw suggested on another post pertaining the stutter. I also have more electronic cleaner coming, to clean the electrical connections around the throttle. I ran out.

It has been raining and or snowing pretty much solid the last two weeks. Idk if that pertains at all.

Just got an obd2 scanner. I cleared the error codes to get rid of the CIL. They were all about misfires from when the water was in the cylinders. I went to start it, but it died within 2 seconds. Really rough idle, like itís not getting fuel. It just keeps starting and then it dies.

the only error code Iím getting is p1000 I think it was, something about scan not completed.

I checked the fuel and coil relays, they are working. I checked the two fuse boxes in the engine compartment and the one in the boot. Nothing was blown, but I changed out anything pertaining to fuel and ignition just in case.

i think that Iím hearing the fuel pump engage when I turn the ignition.

i looked through the vacuum hoses, but donít see anything obvious, and everything seems snug.

i donít have a garage. If it ever stops raining, I was going to replace the fuel filter.

anyone have any ideas of where to look next?

Even after 40 attempts over 6 hours, it always starts for a couple seconds and dies. So I was thinking that it wasnít the fuel pump shrug. Thinking itís something electrical. But Iím no mechanic, I know just enough to get me into trouble. Whereís the ecu/ecm module? I donít see it in my handbook.

have battery on a decent trickle charger, so shouldnít be the battery.

i love these forums, and would greatly appreciate any ideas. Thank you
 
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Old 02-11-2019, 01:32 PM
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The # 1 fuel pump relay gets it's 3rd click back on when the ECU sees engine rotation by the Crankshaft position sensor

This is a safety design

Clean the face of the sensor first

You only have the # 1 pump on the non - supercharged engine

See post X

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...fusion-213762/
 

Last edited by Lady Penelope; 02-11-2019 at 01:36 PM.
  #3  
Old 02-11-2019, 03:10 PM
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Thank you for your reply.

I just got my tent up, so will start disassembling to get to the sensor.

if I am reading the diagram correctly, it’s about half way down the engine, on the backside, a bit off center closer to the passenger side (USA). Correct? Never played with a crankshaft sensor before. I pulled up a pic from autozone too to help

thanks again and if I can get it done before the rain becomes snow here in a bit, I’ll post an update. I’m missing all the stuff in one knee, so snow and I don’t mix.
 
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:15 PM
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Update

I'm guessing that the sensor is only accessible and visible from underneath? Under the transmission? I can’t find it.

While looking around, I found the ecu... a great big box in the corner. There were a couple dead bugs and some leaves in there. I blew it out and pushed on all the connectors.

Two of my corners of the air filter are cracked off. Someone just didn’t like the connectors in the engine compartment. I tried using gorilla glue and a 5 second uv weld, but there’s just too much tension and it didn’t hold. Now I’m missing an entire corner. It must have fallen off. I just used electric tape to seal the gaps, the only thing that would stick.

The covers protecting the coils are broken where the screws go through. Previous owner actually had them rotated 180 degrees, leaving an inch or so gap in the front. Water could potentially still get in the cracks.

I blew the engine compartment out again with a leaf blower.

i tried starting it again before heading inside. It started. It ran extremely rough for maybe 8 seconds, then cleared up. The restricted performance came on, with an orange bar, for maybe 30 seconds, then disappeared. I let it idle for 10 minutes, occasionally revving the engine to 3000 to 3500 rpm. It did not miss at all during this time. No Check engine light.

so ummmm.... what is it? Do I need to carry a leaf blower in the boot?

are the cracks in the air filter housing causing problems, or the cracks in the coil covers allowing moisture into the coils?

eventually I will repair both, but I’m disabled on a fixed income, so might not be until next month unless one or both of these are the problems. I was thinking of using flex tape for now, to seal the gaps.

Sorry for the long post, but wanted to cover what I did, primarily sealing the air filter housing and blowing the engine off.

thank you for your time and input
 
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:44 PM
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Should be item # 3

Old gas ?

On the earlier 95 - 97 X300 version of the same chassis there is no anti - siphoning trap in the fill pipe

Fuel filter change ?

Sorry , I don't have this engine

My Mom says I should stay in my lane
 

Last edited by Lady Penelope; 02-11-2019 at 06:55 PM.
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  #6  
Old 02-12-2019, 05:44 AM
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We are supposed to have a few hour reprieve from the rain tomorrow, so I’ll try replacing the fuel filter tomorrow. My throttle body cleaner and electrical cleaner is supposed to come today, so will drag the tent over and work on that today.

This rain is so annoying. I’ve got a beautiful car and want to spit polish her up, but can’t do a thing. Well, there’s the massive flooding happening too, which isn’t all that fun either.

thanks so much
 
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:48 AM
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Joe,
It sounds like you got it to start and run OK yesterday? At this point, I think I'd be going through and making sure all the various coil covers etc are in place and correctly tightened down. It sounds to me as though it was a moisture problem that had you sidelined. Once you know everything is watertight the way Jaguar intended, then go through and make sure all electrical connections are dry, clean, and tight.
Another thing, you will want to replace the valve cover gaskets including spark plug bore seals pretty soon. Those tend to flatten out over time and will leak both water and oil.
Also, and this should be pretty obvious, if the timing chains and tensioners haven't already been replaced with the 3rd-gen parts (metal tensioner bodies) do it ASAP. You'll want to do the water pump then, too, and probably should do the alternator, serp belt, and idler/tensioner assembly while you can get at all of it.
Good luck! These are fantastic automobiles when given the proper care.
-Steve-
 
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Old 02-12-2019, 03:17 PM
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Hi Steve

the timing chains and tensioners were changed and upgraded 35-40k miles ago by previous owner. He said water pump, alternator and belt were done 20k ago. So have those out of the way at least. I actually asked about the timing chain, not knowing of the defect. Mine had just gone through my engine on the pt cruiser, was why we were in the market for a new car. I could spend $1600 plus on repairs, or buy a beautiful jag for a bit more. No brainer!

not sure on idler/tensioner. Is it something that a noob like me could visually inspect and determine if it has been replaced? Not something I’ve ever done or even looked at.

I do have one cylinder with a tiny bit of oil. So will definitely have to replace the plug seals. My problem is that 7 of the plugs won’t budge. What’s the best way to get them out? Soak with pb blaster over night? I’m scared to try too much brute strength, I have a history of breaking and stripping things. I can already tell this girl needs a gentle touch. The one plug that I did remove was some brand that I’m unfamiliar with... autolite? It didn’t look in the best of shape, looked like it had some carbon buildup, more than I would like at least. I have ngk platinums to replace. Couldn’t really afford the iridium, and seems like the forum is pretty split on platinum vs iridium, ngk vs Bosch etc.

I’m going to bite the bullet and get the coil covers and the air filter assembly. Two corners of the assembly are broken, both of the covers are cracked and missing grommets. I’m sure that this is not helping things. Guess I’m eating ramen the rest of the month lol. The coils themselves look newish, but will probably swap them out next month.

The gasket replacement looks scarier than my 95 xj6 was, but you’re right, it probably needs done.

even though the weather people were wrong and it has either snowed or rained this entire time from my last posting, she started right up. Seems to run fine, though I did not drive it because of the snow.

I was was working on the high mount brake light before it started to snow and had to retreat inside. It had fallen off the rear screen like most do. I cleaned it up, replaced the halogens with LED, but nothing I have tried will stick to the painted glass to reattach it. I have looked through several posts. Is there a definitive answer and solution to reattach the housing? I can’t make a new apparatus like the one gentleman did, though it looks awesome. I see several different glues tried, but all seemed to have failed in the updates.
I had made a platform out of wood to support the 95 xj6 that we had, and though not visible from the outside, every time that I looked in the rear view mirror, I could see it and wasn’t happy. I ended up using a hot glue gun with the support. I don’t know how on earth it stuck, but it was my wife’s suggestion, so tried it to appease her. Only thing that would stick on the xj6. I can’t remember everything that I had tried back then. Primarily it was pretty much everything the dollar tree and Walmart had. I even watched a YouTube video where the mechanic gave up and was able to wedge it within the little gap between the window and the rear dash, but I can’t even get it to fit. I’m scared to put much pressure on the plastic trim and the video didn’t show how he got it in, just the end result which looked fine to me. I tried looking up the jaguar oem kit, but couldn’t find it with the part number listed. Probably discontinued shrug.

anyways, I’m sorry for rambling and posting a couple more questions within this post.

I am always awed by the knowledge and kindness of the members here, and thank you in advance

-Joe

 
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Old 02-12-2019, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Joe Enge View Post
I was was working on the high mount brake light before it started to snow and had to retreat inside. It had fallen off the rear screen like most do. I cleaned it up, replaced the halogens with LED, but nothing I have tried will stick to the painted glass to reattach it. I have looked through several posts. Is there a definitive answer and solution to reattach the housing?
It appears that the brake light is held at the bottom by two pad-clips glued to the windscreen (see pic) onto which the light housing slots. The pads are probably glued with epoxy. As for the vertical sides and the top of the light frame, I would use a narrow strip of strong double sided Skotch tape, black or clear. If using double sided tape (and epoxy for the pad-clips), you will need to thoroughly degrease (I use Zippo lighter fluid) the windscreen glass and the light housing surfaces.


 
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Old 02-13-2019, 05:34 AM
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Good idea. I didn’t see that listed on the other posts. I was using goo gone and rubbing alcohol but I’ll dig up my zippo fluid. Running to pep boys in a few hours to get some more mothers plastic polish. This stuff is incredible. I’ll see what they have for epoxy there.

I got up 3 hours ago and saw something amazing... stars. Haven’t seen them for nearly a month. So hopefully I have a dry day to get some stuff done.

ordered a used set of coil covers for $50 and found an air filter assembly for $43. It looks brand new. So hopefully that will fix my moisture problem.

as always, I appreciate everyone’s time and knowledge.
 
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Joe Enge View Post
Iíll see what they have for epoxy there.
Don't use 5-minute epoxy as, by the time you mix the two components, apply the epoxy and get ready to stick the piece on, the epoxy hardens. Or, if you rush the mixing, the components will not be mixed thoroughly and the epoxy will not set properly and have little strength. Use a "standard cure" (~60 minutes) epoxy. Mix the components very well, for a longer time, and do not apply too much as it will run down before it sets. Find a way to, after sticking the pieces on, to keep them in place steady and leave overnight. Also, as a precaution, place something under the area of gluing to prevent any epoxy run down gluing something you don't want.
 
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Old 02-14-2019, 05:35 AM
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I’m not sure how to change the title to resolved. I think it’s fixed for now, until next week when more parts come in.

i cleaned the throttle assembly, which wasn’t dirty at all. Cleaned the air intake, it was disgusting. I eventually just had to let it soak with cleaner then run hot water through it. And repeat. I was getting a red oil out of it, and these big black globs. I have no idea what that was.

played around with the throttle cable. There was at least an inch of play in it. Now when I press the accelerator it instantly reacts. Spun out a couple times getting used to the difference. The stutter while simulating a pass seems to be gone too. She really purrs now, better than when I got it.

the hard reset was a long, scary minute while it was relearning.

supposed to hit 55 today, so going to work on the high mount brake light.

thank you all for your replies
 
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Old 02-14-2019, 11:32 AM
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Well, I spoke too soon.

I started the car a couple times last night and she was fine. This morning she was back to the initial problem.

i ended up doing another hard reset, and she started right up. I have it idling now, sounds good.

any ideas?

it didn’t rain or even snow last night

 
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Old 02-14-2019, 02:49 PM
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My initial thought was a bad vacuum leak, based on your report of plastic cracking.

The plastic 'snakes' on the top of the motor aren't a cover. Ask me how I know

Given your last post, I had to replace the TB on mine, some electronic failure but it was intermittent like your problem. Could be caused by washing? During this time I found gas in the bottom of the TB. Rebuilt TB was about $430.
 
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Old 02-15-2019, 02:32 AM
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A crack causing an air leak can overcome the car's ability to fuel correctly and thus cause a stall. Worth some very careful checking e.g. via fuel trims.
 
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Old 02-15-2019, 05:55 AM
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Alrighty, more things on my list to check.

thanks for your input
 
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Old 02-15-2019, 03:34 PM
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Bah.

it started and ran fine at 3:30am and 5:30am. I tried around 1pm, wouldn’t start.

i put the new air filter assembly on, and noticed the little hose was dirty, so ordered a new one. It was called several things, like air pump hose or full something or other. Shrug. It had duct tape on it from previous owner, so probably needs replaced anyways.

when done, it started first try, though ran a bit rough for 10 seconds.

any tips on how to remove the harnesses from the throttle body? I can’t get any off at all.

dont laugh, but what are these things, is it normal to have some oil seepage, or is this yet another problem. There’s one on either side, towards the front of the bonnet. I noticed the passenger side when I removed the old air filter assembly.

are there any precautions to take so my new air filter assembly won’t crack?

thanks
 
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Old 02-16-2019, 09:53 AM
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What kind of screw holds the crankshaft sensor? I found it, but with hardly any feeling in my fingers, can’t figure it out. I can sense a hole, so probably a torque or Allen, but don’t want to force a bit in there ***** nilly. Doesn’t seem like enough room for a ratchet. So... a bit on vise grips?

I can’t see it no matter what angle I can attain (type). I thought that I read it was a 10mm bolt, but mine sure isn’t.
 
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Old 02-16-2019, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Joe Enge View Post
dont laugh, but what are these things, is it normal to have some oil seepage, or is this yet another problem. Thereís one on either side, towards the front of the bonnet. I noticed the passenger side when I removed the old air filter assembly.
Those are your VVT solenoids. Mine weep a little, even with brand-new seals. I've chalked it up to being British. It would be nice if they sealed tight, but I don't know if that's possible after 100,000+ miles and 19 years...
-Steve-
 
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Old 02-17-2019, 11:05 AM
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1. An air leak upstream from the MAF, like in the air filter box, would not normally cause problems for the engine running. Even a small leak downstream can mess up things.

2. You can look inside the TB just by taking off the plastic tube that sits on top. Then push open the butterfly with fingers. That's when I saw a puddle of gas in mine.

3. I don't remember anything unusual about removing the harnesses from the TB. Just look carefully and see how they want to be pressed to be released.

4. FWIW, I stopped the VVT seepage with new seals. In any case, I would not expect seepage to affect how the engine runs.

5. Any new codes?
 

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