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Hi, Recently purchased a 1999 XJ8 3.2L with just 57,500 miles recorded. Have undertaken a full service inc new spark plugs, new alternator and drive belt plus a series of other little jobs. However, I find that when the car has been standing over night and is cold, when I go to use it, it seems very sluggish for about 3 to 4 minutes, then picks up and performs as one expects. No warning lights are shown on the dash so I am at a loss to know what the issue could be. Has anyone experienced this and knows what the issue might be? One other factor that might have a bearing, the car had only covered 235 miles since 2010. I have put on about 500 miles since owwning it so hopefully, everything is loosen up.
I'm a believer of long sitting cars need to "have the carbon & cobwebs blown out" theory lol. I assume w/ your service you did the vital fluids(oil etc.) I'd take it out & get semi-aggressive with it to ensure everything is lubed up & clear of any sediment. Semi dry fuel pumps may be partially blocked from sitting, same w/ fuel injectors etc. Also check your MAF sensor to ensure it's not dirty w/ dust etc. If it was sitting with fuel in it, it may be the residual old fuel as well.
Last edited by King Charles; Jan 14, 2019 at 07:53 PM.
I would check the coolant temperature sensor. It might be bad making the ECU "think" that the engine is always warm so the ECU is not enriching the mixture at the cold start and during the engine warm-up.
Thanks. New fuel filter fitted at service. MAF cleaned out. No codes to indicate anything untoward. However, just purchased a iCarsoft i930 diagnostic tool (Jaguar/Land Rover edition) and will interrogate the cars ECU's to see if anything turns up.
I think I would clean the throttle bore and plate; adjust the throttle linkage (remove slack in cable); and replace the temperature sensor (see #3). Maybe a gentle tightening of the intake manifold bolts.
My 4.0 does the same exact thing -- first mile or so it does not want to GO. I already did fuel pump, filter, cleaned the throttle body, adjusted the linkage, etc etc while I had it all apart after I first got it. Today I ordered the new coolant temp sensor from Amazon -- for 11 bucks, can't go wrong!
Steve
Today I ordered the new coolant temp sensor from Amazon -- for 11 bucks, can't go wrong!
Oh yes, it can! Just joking but one has to be careful when ordering the CTS as there were two types with different threads. The early type (smaller diameter thread) was up to VIN 853935 for NA engines and up to VIN 878717 for SC engines. Engines after the mentioned VIN-s had CTS with larger tapered thread.
Well, I'm gonna find out real soon.... Rock Auto has the parts exactly opposite your pictures -- long probe on later VINs. My VIN is F05601, so I ordered the one like the second image which is what Rock said is up to VIN G27725. Hope I'm right. If not, at least Amazon is easy on returns.....
Steve
Thanks for showing the different sensors. Mine would be the early sensor. Any idea what the part number this will be?
LNA1600AA. I bought a genuine one from Barratt a couple of years ago at GBP 23 but I see that they have now reduced its price to just GBP 13. They also have an aftermarket one for GBP 8.50.
Have undertaken diagnostic of the car and the following code showed up. P1647 “Heated oxygen sensor control module, bank 2 open/shorted”
Maybe this is responsible for the sluggishness? Checking with my local parts department at a Jaguar franchised dealer, they have indicated that it could be the upper heated oxygen sensor or the lower one. Does anyone know how this can be identified? Otherwise, to replace both costs £300 just for the parts.
Have undertaken diagnostic of the car and the following code showed up. P1647 “Heated oxygen sensor control module, bank 2 open/shorted”
According to the Jaguar fault codes list, P1647 means "Heated oxygen sensor 1 (upstream), bank 2 – control malfunction", "probable cause: Wiring, 02 Sensor or ECM"
Thanks M. I’m assuming this is the top sensor, which is the easier one to get to in the engine bay. However, I am now concerned that after purchasing the iCarsoft i930 diagnostic reader and that it read some functions like engine and transmission control modules, many other modules were not read and it came up with error messages. Having contacted iCarsoft in the USA they have indicated that this reader is not suitable for my age of car. Not impressed! The reason I purchased this unit was because the advert from a UK supplier indicated it was suitable! Not only that, when selecting the make and model, the year of manufacture was shown on the menu of the reader. This worries me now, that the information indicated on the reader can be relied upon. Awaiting for an explanation from the UK supplier.
I’m assuming this is the top sensor, which is the easier one to get to in the engine bay.
Yes, it is the upper sensor. But check its wiring connector first to make sure its pins are not corroded (may not necessarily be a bad O2 sensor).
I also have Icarsoft i930 and find it ok (for the price). It reads some modules (I use 1999 year selection for my Jag) and it doesn't read many other. The good thing about it is that it reads ABS codes. I also have (bought a used one) Actron CP-9575 which doesn't read ABS but reads many more engine and body codes than the i930. So, with the two of them, the diagnostics are not too bad.
In your case, i930 did, at least, the minimum. It recognised the bank but it described P1647 wrongly as “Heated oxygen sensor control module, bank 2" (there is no separate "control module" for the O2 sensor). This is because i930 probably has generic codes in its database and not Jaguar specific. Anyhow, don't throw it away - it will be useful if you have any troubles with the ABS.
Last edited by M. Stojanovic; Jan 18, 2019 at 11:01 PM.
Oh yes, it can! Just joking but one has to be careful when ordering the CTS as there were two types with different threads. The early type (smaller diameter thread) was up to VIN 853935 for NA engines and up to VIN 878717 for SC engines. Engines after the mentioned VIN-s had CTS with larger tapered thread.
Well, guess what? Despite what's listed on Rock Auto's website, the part I ordered ( Standard Motor Products/Intermotor TX145) is NOT the same as the part in my car. Go figure...
So my VIN, as I've mentioned, is LF05601. Rock says the part in the second picture above is for cars with VIN up to G49701, which would certainly suggest that's the part I need. However, the actual part in the car is like the first picture, which would be a TX40. Looking at my original part, I can read a part number 17970-00220. Rock's description of TX40 says it's a direct interchange for a bunch of parts including 1797000220, so that must be the one.
Will order that one, install, and report if the car starts any easier cold. Chicago area is in for some typical January weather (daily highs in the teens F) for the next week or so, so it'll be a good test.
-Steve-
Last edited by SteveXJ8L; Jan 19, 2019 at 02:16 PM.
Welcome to the club! I also initially bought the wrong (second) one following the parts catalogue (and Barratt website) showing that the "fat" sensor is for VIN-s after 853935 (mine is 87xxxx). However, my engine is supercharged and it seems that the CTS on SC engines, did not change at 853935 but some time later. But the parts catalogue does not show this.
As I was writing this, I had a look at the parts catalogue and the Coolant Outlet Pipe. The change point of the outlet pipe (where the CTS is sitting) on NA engines was from after Engine No. 990412 0000 (12 April 1999, after midnight) and this is probably when the "fat" CTS was introduced on NA engines. Thus, in the catalogue, the change point of the CTS should have been tied to the Engine No. and not to VIN. So, your engine is probably prior to 990412 and therefore still having the slim CTS. If your engine is after the mentioned number, then your outlet pipe was probably replaced in the past with the early outlet pipe.
In the case of SC engines, it appears that the CTS was never changed to the "fat" one. The page G08 in the section "Engine Management/Emission Systems" shows that the CTS change was from after VIN 853935 for all engines (including SC) but this is incorrect for SC engines. Another page in the section "Engine Cooling System", page J08 which is specific to SC engines, only one type of the CTS is shown, the "slim" M12 thread one, with no indication of any change point.
So there we go, rather confusing information in the catalogue. The "fat" CTS is also used as the Oil Temperature Sensor so you can keep it as spare for that (if your engine actually has an oil temperature sensor, some did not).
Sluggish when cold
