XJ6 & XJ12 Series I, II & III 1968-1992

attempting to free a seized xk engine

 
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Old 11-26-2014, 11:01 AM
jjd
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Default attempting to free a seized xk engine

Well here goes folks. As you may know i purchased a 75 series 2 vdp non runner apparently seized but no one as yet knows how or why for sure so here is my attempts to free it out maybe this will be helpful to someone and the outcome is favourable!

Ok first things first, tried the key with fresh battery. All i get is a strong click from the starter.
So i decide to remove starter and check it out.
In order to do this I

1. Removed air breather box. Then the two brackets holding air box to manifold.

2. Removed intake manifold carbs, aed etc. Four 13mm nuts, couple of springs and various pipes, then its wriggled free. 13 nuts are awkward enough but manageable after airbox removed.

3. Starter is easily accessed now just two 14mm bolts and couple of wires removed from solenoid, make sure battery disconnected beforehand! I had to cut down a 14mm spanner to get the top bolt as there was only a little clearance to get at it.

4. Starter is out! Tested on bench. Solenoid is ok but starter motor itself is seized. Good stuff, maybe this is the problem?
5. Attempt to turn engine by turning ring gear to see if its free. No movement. Back to square one. Perhaps starter burned out trying to turn seized engine?
6. Made a concoction to free engine from kerosene, atf and brake fluid. (Recommended by almost everyone on the old interweb) poured it into each plug hole and leave it sit.
7. In order to get at the big nut on front of crank i need to remove, top front slam panel, aircon rad, coolant rad, fan assembly, fan.
8. Slam panel easily removed, four bolts, cold air intake pipe and light loom. Lifts up and clear.
9. Rads are removed undoing two bolts under front crossmember behind front bumper, water pipes removed, various little clips and brackets found by trial and error and teasing out the rads.
10. Remove fan blades by holding large bolt near pump and screw out 14mm bolt thru fan center.
11. Now i can see the bugger, a 34mm bolt on the front of the crank. I place a socket and bar on it and hope for the best! I check the direction of engine rotation by cranking over my other xj. Clockwise as you look from the front.
12. With extension bar i turn clockwise. It appears to budge but im not sure if im just tightening the bolt. I drop a screwdriver into one of the plug holes to try and gauge piston travel, (not very technical but its all i could think of!)
13. Give it a good turn again. It turns maybe 10 degrees but screwdriver doesn't budge. Im concerned about wringing the bolt in the crank as engine itself is apparently not moving.

This is where im at folks. Bar is moving the big 34mm bolt engine doesn't "seem" to be turning but im reluctant to really give it welly in case i wring the bolt. The concoction i put down cylinders last week remains in the three cylinders nearest bulkhead. Suggestions?
 
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Old 11-26-2014, 11:08 AM
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Is crank pulley turning when you turn nut? If hard to tell mark it with chalk
 
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Old 11-26-2014, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Darrenmb View Post
Is crank pulley turning when you turn nut? If hard to tell mark it with chalk
Dont think so darren.
 
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Old 11-26-2014, 02:10 PM
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Default My perspective

Here's the way I see it. If you can't wrench it over, then it's best you remove the engine entirely and prepare for a rebuild, or get a new (used) engine.

If you've been letting the pistons soak for a few days and it still won't budge, that means that the rings have rusted to the cylinders. You need new rings. You probably should have the cylinders bored .030" larger as well to remove the rust pits from the walls. If you don't, the rings & seals will leak and wear out that much quicker causing additional damage to your cylinder walls in the process.

Let's suppose you do get the rotating assembly to finally turn. The truth is, you're most likely still dealing with the situation I mentioned above. To get it to turn over and even start now is fine, but you still have damaged rings & cylinder walls that require attention. There will be little pride or satisfaction in driving a "coal rolling" Jaguar.

As far as you are into it now, to reassemble everything and "see if it will run" puts you that much farther behind...IMHO. You will simply be doing all that assembly and dis-assembly work twice.

Do it once, do it right and spare yourself the extra time. Plus, you'll have the piece of mind knowing that everything from the block, crank, pistons, rings, seals, bearings, gaskets, even chains are tested, crack checked and will last for thousands of kilometers.

Please forgive my semi-rant. Some people are obsessive about their car's body, the interior, or even the external appearance of the engine bay. Obviously, I'm the guy who is overly obsessed with what's going on inside the engine.
 
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Old 11-26-2014, 02:55 PM
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Yeah fair point just its worth a shot seeing if i can free it out, but if im changing the engine ill be transplanting the running gear from one of my x300s over. Im doing some background research on a engine swap at the mo. Would really love to keep it matching numbers though if i could. But beggars cant be choosers i guess.
 
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Old 11-27-2014, 10:50 AM
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Yeah, if all that has not moved it, there is trouble inside. One more faint hope. Can you access the teeth on the flywheel. levering on the teeth with a really big old screw driver or pry bar might budge it. If you can get a budge, lever back and forth bit by bit. but, caveat,as I understand this engine doesn't like to be turned backwards!


My derelict VW flat four can be turned about 3/4 of a revolution, but so far, not all the way.


Another engine????


Carl
 
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Old 11-27-2014, 04:17 PM
jjd
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Doesnt budge on flywheel. Another lump is most likely outcome chaps.
 
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Old 01-17-2015, 01:48 PM
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Its free! Turns out with the engine out and plenty of access to front pulley we were able to free it, and its turning over very smoothly indeed. We took off crank pulley, drilled holes in three places and put steel bolts in from rear, reconnected the pulley with large 34mm nut and fed a concoction of diesel, brake fluid and semi synthetic oil into each plug hole for past month. We then put a large bar across the bolts, gently rocked it and with a faint cracking noise it turned. So we gently brought it full revolution over a few days just to make sure it was lubricating itself. Gradually we brought it full revolution a few times and now she turns smoothly and steadily by hand with just a wrench on the crank bolt. Looks promising, im glad ill be putting back in the matching engine now, plus ill be able to clean and paint the block and engine bay easier now. Ill keep ye updated but just goes to show dont give up hope! Cheers jjd.
 
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Old 01-17-2015, 03:16 PM
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Three cheers for the engine!
While you have the engine out, you may consider machining the rear crank for a modern oil seal conversion and install some hold-down plates over the loose valve tappet guides.
XK Cylinder Head Problems
 
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Old 01-17-2015, 03:45 PM
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Yep ill do some future proofing and run it on the bench before it goes back in just to make sure. Feeling pretty smug at the moment to be honest.
 
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Old 01-17-2015, 06:17 PM
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Don't blame you.

You should check the state of the bores. Either take the head off or get a boresope/ endoscope.

I'm guessing you don't want to rebuild the engine completely, but do as much as you can now to save pulling the engine out again later.
 
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Old 01-18-2015, 11:03 AM
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OK!!!


With some luck, it might have been a seized bearing on the crank. And, with some more luck, it didn't spin within the cap!!!!


Fix or replace the starter and run a compression test. A couple of things to be deduced from that.


1. All bores and rings good, even compression or close across the board.


2. Seizure not a ring to bore issue.


3. All is well, crank and bores.


4. One or more poor cylinders. Out with it and replace or rebuild.


5. I forgot, out of the chassis? If so, drop the sump pan and inspect main and rod bearings. Good for peace of mind anyway.


6. Put it back together and try to fire it up!! It might just be fine.


Carl
 
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