Hi need the experts !
In what countries were left hand drive XJ6 Sovereigns sold in 1985 ? It has 7" Euro headlights, driving lights, rear guards and correct badging etc but what "looks like" US rubber impact bumpers ? Looking at one on a auction site and the seller does not seem to realize it is an import. Looks really NICE but I have a feeling if I try to get it, I will get outbid AGAIN, aghh! Thanks for any info on where it might have come from.

Cheers,
Brian

 

Germany and Canada come to mind; I suppose there were others.

Bumpers: to clarify, all the Series IIIs had the rubber bumpers. On the USA cars the rubber section protrudes much further. By 1985 I reckon the Canadian cars were the same. If the car in question has the lower profile rubber bumpers it was probably imported from continental Europe. For some reason it seems like most such cars came from Germany, or at least it seems that way to me.

Cheers
DD

 

Yes, the Sovereign was sold in Canada (along with the XJ6 and the V12 Vanden Plas), and as Doug correctly says (he is always and irritatingly correct!) the Canadian cars had the same bumper system as the US cars. There is one additional way of determining whether the Sovereign is Canadian-market or German/other European market: the latter did not have the console computer as standard equipment (all the Canadian cars did); the German-market cars had the earlier small clock on that console panel as standard equipment.

 

Thanks for the info, after studying the pictures again I realized it has the shorter no-shock rubber bumpers so with the clock instead of trip computer I think it might be from Germany. Are there any books detailing all the various differences between markets and models ? If not someone should try to write one but I imagine it could be a real headache ( if not impossible ) to get 100% correct.
If I get out bid quickly ( most likely ), I'll post the link and pictures here. Hopefully it goes to a real Jag lover instead of an investor / flipper type.

Thanks everyone !
Brian

 

Mine came from Switzerland or Belgium? 'Grey Market' import with US safety and emission stuff added. (like a BMW cataverter system)
It has the huge black rubber bumpers. (Ogle Wheels (pepperpot) are a dead giveaway)
The reason I think those 2 Countries is because it has a .305:1 diff ratio. Apparently that was the ratio for those Countries?

bob

 

Bob beat me to the "gray market car" point. Sounds very likely. Some cars had more required corrections than others?"? r

Or, a service person bought one in Europe and brought it home. leniency on DOT requirements for those cars.

I brought a Belgian assembled 50 Chevrolet home in 55. pretty much the same car as the USA version. Except for the speedo in KPM... A very nice black four door.

Carl,

 

Hi,
Thanks for all the information. I contacted the seller, seems the car was special ordered new direct from England to the US. Hate to see the shipping charge on that invoice !
Guess that would make it be considered a "gray market" car. Would LOVE to win the auction, but have a feeling the bids will get into Jay Leno territory or beyond ( as he put it once "crazy money" ! And it is on E-PAY )
Question for you Bob, do Jags used in Texas ( Houston to points inland ) suffer much rust ? None shows in the pictures - not even around windshields - but there are no under body pics and I've already been burnt once on a KY car.

Cheers,
Brian
Maybe all the other bidder's internet will crash till after the auction !
If anyone here does start bidding on it, let me know so I don't get in a hopeless bidding war !

 

I've seen quite a lot variances in how grey market cars are certified for USA importation.

There are private companies that do grey-market conversions. Some probably know the "ins and outs" better than others. And dealing with the DOT (like any large agency, public or private) a lot can depend and who you know and who you talk to...and what mood they're in that day.

Cheers
DD

 

I have my doubts about that. All Jaguars came 'direct' from England. What'd being described amounts to, simply, Jaguar overtly circumventing USA requirements. Jaguar wouldn't sell a non-compliant car to the USA simply because the customer requested it via special order. I just can't envision it.....unless the buyer had lots of friends in high places

Is the seller the original owner? If not, I suspect he thinks he's telling you the truth.

I think he has been misinformed.

Cheers
DD

 

I live North of the DFW area and the rust around the windows is always a problem.
I have 3 Series III XJ6 cars. Two for parts and one I plan to get running again.
All have surface rust in places. None have rust so bad that the parts or body can't be used.

 

Canadian market cars didn't get 7" outside headlights until the 1987 model year.

 

Hi, thanks for all the new information. The seller is handling the auction for a close friend who is the heir of the original owner, so he is relying on what they have told him. The Carfax shows it being originally titled in Texas in 1985 with 21 miles on the clock. Only one owner / title number since new. I don't know if they bought it in England and then arraigned shipping themselves or came up with another "work around" to get it here but it is one sweet ride regardless. Per the seller today, a 20+ year Jag mechanic flew up from Florida to inspect it and could not find any rust ( looked under mats etc ). Was that you Jose ?? Even though the price is still low, I'm pretty sure it will launch into orbit faster than Space-X at closing time and out of my reach again, oh well !

Here's the ebay link in case anyone wants to look at the pictures or bid themselves.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-Jaguar...%7C1000%7C2500

Gonna get a snack and drink then watch the auction Friday just like it's on Barrett Jackson ! I'm guessing over 12k !

Cheers,
Brian

 

[QUOTE=kudzu;2193543]Hi, thanks for all the new information. The seller is handling the auction for a close friend who is the heir of the original owner, so he is relying on what they have told him. The Carfax shows it being originally titled in Texas in 1985 with 21 miles on the clock. Only one owner / title number since new. I don't know if they bought it in England and then arraigned shipping themselves or came up with another "work around" to get it here but it is one sweet ride regardless. Per the seller today, a 20+ year Jag mechanic flew up from Florida to inspect it and could not find any rust ( looked under mats etc ).

Here's the ebay link in case anyone wants to look at the pictures or bid themselves.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1980-Jaguar...%7C1000%7C2500 [Quote]


Well, to my eye (and I have owned a lot of these cars) that engine compartment has seen more than the reported mileage. It is odd that whichever importer did the alterations for US registration did not bother to get a set of (easily available) correct side marker lights...and given that the model year corresponds to the year of registration (1985) how did it pass emissions testing? - since this is a non-catalyst model (the non-elevated fuel caps are the proof) and since it has not been fitted with the US specification air pump? I'd be very interested in the answer.

 

Hi Gregory,
Not sure how they did / do emissions in TX, could have been some "Jacksons" left on the dash during the import inspection ! In the left side engine picture there appears to be some kind of air pump but the injection looks like it goes into the exhaust manifold instead of cylinder head. Would be a cool car to really inspect and document all the options / modifications. When did Texas start requiring emissions testing ? The Carfax ( page attached below ) shows the import inspection in 1985 then nothing until 1997 with 37553, could be because of older paper records never being computerized ?
Still sure the bidding will get too crazy for my budget !

Cheers,
Brian

 

Back in the early 1980s the only emission thing I did as a STATE INSPECTOR when I worked in DALLAS was to clip a piece of chemical paper to the tailpipe with the engine running to see if someone used LEADED GASOLINE in a car/truck with a 'cataverter'.

Then the visual inspection was implemented in the mid-1980s to check for air pump, cataverter, PCV etc. I quit the inspection/repair shop and found a job in Fort Worth where I lived at the time.

Full-blown rolling-road (dynamometer) with tailpipe monitor did not start in the major cities until the 1990s.

Only TEXAS Counties with an EPA non-attainment clean air rating are currently performing 'emission-testing'. I currently do not live in a 'non-attainment' county so I don't know (or care) what the cities are doing now, (I live in a low population rural county) so NO emission testing here.

Hope this helps

 

Interesting car, lot's of oddities !

I like the color of the leather. I wonder what the trim code is?

Gregory? Is it "parchment"?

Cheers
DD

 

I also wouldn't necessary rely on the mileage indicated, it's incredibly easy to roll back the odometers on these cars.

Looks to me like a German market car, the speedometer would have been changed upon import to the MPH unit. It was quite common to bring in European spec cars in the mid 80's, the currency exchange made it viable and there were a number of importers operating then to "federalize" the imports. Obviously varying quality and competency of each importer.

 

Nice looking Sovereign. I've come across a few Sovereigns in the US when looking at XJ6s and I always liked the spec with the clock, the VDP door panels, shorter bumper extensions, etc. it's a shame it doesn't have the Pepper Pot wheels most of them seemed to have. I saw one in the rare steel blue color not a mile from my office that I almost bought.

Time is short, but if you're bidding I'd want a lot more detail on the recent service described in the ad. If it's been sitting since roughly 1997 it would need a fair amount to get it fully roadworthy. I'd be surprised if it goes much over $8k. It's a rare spec but I don't know if it's any more desirable than a nice Vanden Plas model. Low mileage, if it's accurate, can help the value, but sitting for 23 years can also be a negative.

 

No, it isn't - it is Doeskin, which in photos often looks slightly lighter than it really is. It is the same as in this V12 VDP (1990): Alpine Green and Doeskin:


and, anticipating the inevitable comment that this isn't a VDP - yes it is - it is a perfectly correct V12 VDP for Canada in the model year range 1988 to 1991 inclusive - these cars were taken from the Sovereign line and fitted with the Daimler door panels, over mats, heavily burled walnut, stitched leather centre armrest, door armrests and map pockets etc...these cars are in the factory build records as "Sovereign V12" and then in brackets "(Canadian Jaguar V12 Vanden Plas)". The V12 VDP outside this model year range, including the 1992 model, were taken directly from the Daimler Double Six line (and identified as such in the build records), modified by the fitting of Jaguar exterior trim, the Canada-only washer nozzles on the bonnet, the mudflaps, coolant preheater, etc.
Some of the very last cars, such as my #92/100, escaped with some Daimler identification: the car had a Daimler driver's mat (not sure if you can see that; note the very late single knob mirror control - Jaguar was running out of some of the Series III trim components by the time this car was built. Earlier 1992 cars still had the dual stalk control


and Daimler stickers on the engine:


and here is a photo of the trunk: note the standard CD changer and the toolkit):


Gregory

 

Ahhh, yes. Doeskin. Thank you

I very well remember your Alpine Green car is it was my favorite.

Cheers
DD