Hello again everyone,

I bought in XJ-S with some rust but mostly in great shape for any body panels that require any actual fabrication to fix.

Parts that are rotting:

• LH Front Wing/Fender
• RH Door Panel
• RH Rocker Panel
• RH Floor panel around jack point near front wheel (looks like someone dropped it on a jack or something)

Parts that have small surface rust:

• All 4 quarter panels
• Deck Lid

Those rotting panels will all need to be replaced (I may elect to not mess with the floor jack point now). It looks like I can get most of these without too much trouble in steel parts.
This seems like maybe a good time to do some weight reduction while I have the car apart.

Does anyone have a lead on where I could get some quality composite body parts that won't flap in the breeze?
I don't have ambitions of making a track car or anything but I do like a snappy response and in addition to gearing changes, weight reduction is a great way to add to that feeling.
So replacing rotting steel panels with lighter composites seems like a good start.

 

I don't think such things as composites exist commercially for the XJS, I've been scouring the planet for spares and parts for a couple of years and can't recall ever encountering such things - doesn't mean they don't exist but if they do they're pretty rare.

The fender would be a very difficult trick to pull off as it is actually welded to the front corner / apron. The rocker panel is a structural component so I wouldn't be in too much of a hurry for anything but steel in that area.

There may be composite doors - when you say deck do you mean the trunk ?? -

As for the jacking point it could be a clumsy garage that didn't pay attention when they jacked the car - tyre shops in particular are major offenders - you got to be real fussy jacking these cars or you will collapse the floor - it is specifically braced above the jacking point and nowhere else. I also have little doughnuts made from hockey pucks specifically for ham fisted garages - and myself.

 

Yeah sorry I mean trunk. Yeah I know the inner fender bits are welded and important, but it's my outer fender/wing thing that's rotted (aka the panel visible from the outside). All the inner stuff is fine somehow, which I'm pretty happy about . I thought the outer front wings were just a bunch of bolts with 2-3 of them being annoying?

Also those rocker panels are structural?? That's rough.

For jacking it up, so far I've just been shoving my low profile floor jack under the subrame with an extra hunk of metal I dug out of a scrap heap so I don't dent it or anything. Hopefully that's not wrong haha.

 

Nope - in fact that method of lifting the front is listed in one of the Jag service docs I read as an approved location - 10 out of 10 for getting a weight spreader to prevent dents as many don't.

Outer fenders are bolted on, there are 5 concealed behind the splashguard, there are a couple high up that you can see with the door open, one of which is an absolute pig , there are four or five pozi drive screws in the front and the angle makes these fun too - then there's the bumper ...

But the fender is actually welded or brazed to the lower panel and lead filled - at least it was on mine - I don't have any images of them but I can nab one tomorrow as both my fenders are off the car currently - I had to cut them off where they meet the front lower panel.

There are rocker panels available, at least I've seen them come up once or twice for sale.

Can't help with the composites though - although potentially you could make master moulds if you can find a good example. If you do track down composites make sure that they are epoxy based not polyester (cheap option) and you will pay for the latter in misery when you try to get a paint finish that won't suffer osmosis problems - same issue that affects older yachts.

 

[QUOTE=Hdptrequalsnull;2544027]Hello again everyone,

I bought in XJ-S with some rust but mostly in great shape for any body panels that require any actual fabrication to fix.

Parts that are rotting:

• LH Front Wing/Fender
• RH Door Panel
• RH Rocker Panel
• RH Floor panel around jack point near front wheel (looks like someone dropped it on a jack or something)

Parts that have small surface rust:

• All 4 quarter panels
• Deck Lid

Those rotting panels will all need to be replaced (I may elect to not mess with the floor jack point now). It looks like I can get most of these without too much trouble in steel parts.
This seems like maybe a good time to do some weight reduction while I have the car apart.

Does anyone have a lead on where I could get some quality composite body parts that won't flap in the breeze?
I don't have ambitions of making a track car or anything but I do like a snappy response and in addition to gearing changes, weight reduction is a great way to add to that feeling.
So replacing rotting steel panels with lighter composites seems like a good start.[/N

 

Turning my Jaguar into a vintage race car means I’m taking off rust free Southern California panels which I’ll sell cheap. However crate and freight will add to the cost. If you’re local come and pick them up save yourself some serious money.
. Check local yards first. Periodically I see non running non rusty cars sell for modest prices.

If anyone is looking for track car quality fiberglass or carbon fibers parts, I’m running a small batch soon.

 

While I have personally seen fiberglass hoods, and one person's ambitious entire front clip in CF, the only commercially available *priced* body bits in F'glass I've ever seen (besides body kits and wings) are just a few lower front pieces: https://www.jagsparesinternational.c...7%7C&offset=40

I've always thought I might one day manage to make some molds and do some infusion CF pieces but they'd probably be for me as demand is clearly low.

~Paul K.

 

Yeah demand must be pretty low otherwise there would be more. I did a fair bit of research and I'll be trying to make my own molds and CF pieces. Seems like a learning process that involves less oil drips than anything else on my XJ-S so far haha.

 

There are three YouTube channels you want to visit, and take notes. Easy Composites LDT, Throttle Stop Garage, and AJ Hartman Aero (probably in that order). You'll need to be able to post-cure parts, so consider both the way TSG and AJH did it.

Unless you're going for the look of CF or ease of use, there may be reason to explore the use of other materials:

Aramid Fiber/Kevlar: (will never break due to being hit with a shopping cart - but requires infusion and is hell to cut, and is lighter than CF although not as stiff).
Dyneema/Cuben fiber: Ultralight (45% lighter than aramid) and tougher, but cuttable.

None of it ends up being cheap, and you've got to have a good bit of space + setup equipment to do anything of any size.

~Paul K.



The pix below aren't my work (just photos I've saved), but might serve as inspiration (although the surface finish is awful.. as if it were a skin).

 

Thank you! I had already stumbled across two of those channels and thought they were pretty good so I'm glad to get some confirmation from someone who has some experience! Or at least knows more than I do. Yeah the finish looks a bit questionable, but that's fine if whoever did that is just going for a racer or something.

 

The only cost effective way to reduce weight in an XJS, apart from dumping the aircon sysyem entirely, is to acid dip the OEM panels: doors, bonnet, wings etc etc.

 

you are right. Restoration people want original steel only a few racers like myself are looking for fiberglass/carbon fiber. While the finished price of the part isn’t that bad the crate and freight costs really add a lot to the customer.

 

Actually if you follow what Group 44 did with the three race cars they built you’ll get the three full options. ( well actually there are 4+ options.
The first car they built the only parts that weren’t stock off the actual car were the hood ( bonnet ) and trunk ( boot) which were fiberglass. wt. 3150 #
The second car was one select pieces were carefully acid dipped and the hood, trunk.
& fenders were fiberglas. wt. 2710 #. The third one was the tube frame version. All fiberglass except the roof panel. wt. 2560# note; the engine was set back 8 inches and it had a Franklin quick change.
There is not much weight savings on the fenders. Perhaps 10# each. I can’t really tell because the Flairs group 44 used add weight. The hood weight is really serious. While the trunk weight sort of depends on how it’s finished.
Above that you can use Carbon Fiber. And save a lot of weight over steel plus with a Kevlar 2nd layer they will really prevent impact damage.
No, you don’t need access to a Autoclave. While you will if you use prepeg.
You can treat it like regular fiberglass cloth. Wet it down and use a squeegee to remove excess resin. Suddenly carbon fiber is not a lot more expensive than fiberglass cloth. And only a small percentage heavier.
Those fiberglass fenders group 44 used are still available from the guy who did them for Group 44 He’s in Virginia close to Washington DC. They are Chopper gun made. And only modestly lighter than steel. The fronts bolt on with the same holes used on the original. While the backs are put on with adhesive or rivets.
I’m going to do a run of hood, trunks and doors for my race car. If you’d care to join me and share the work they’d be very cheap.

 

hmmm

 

Well color me interested! (I missed your first message about doing a small run of these things sorry)

I started to get really interested in making these myself but I lack a lot of the equipment to do it so the startup cost is pretty intense for something that I might end up hating with the white hot intensity of a thousand suns.

When you say "race quality" what do you mean? I ask because my goal would be to have these look pretty good painted, but that means I genuinely don't care about the aesthetics of the specific carbon fiber weaves or anything like that.
Unfortunately, the statistical odds of me being close enough to you to help with the labor are extremely slim

 

That used to be true, but not anymore. There are quite a variety of prepregs that only require an oven cure (or some sort of medium-high heat cycle) under vacuum, but no autoclave. There are even pre-pregs that don't require refrigeration now, and stay at the B stage at room temp for months.
e.g. https://store.acpcomposites.com/5.8-...-prepreg-tw-50

Personally I think for the small scale DIYer, pre-Preg is going to be good for small parts that are easy to handle. BIG parts like hoods/fenders etc... probably better to do a layup on those.

These days it's not much harder to do an infusion part than hand lay up and the results are much better and lighter. It does take a little more equipment and is setup differently though. Also the mold needs to have a relatively large flange on it.

~Paul K.

 

If you use a squeegee and remove excess resin while wet. The weight isn’t that much higher than prepeg. Oh, if you’re a formula 1 car the few pounds heavier would be devastating but since we aren’t doing that. •••••
.

 

that’s interesting. But I make a splash mold first using cheap matt ( I used to have a chopper gun which speeds up the process) and then Make a part or two from the splash mold.
Front fenders are designed to mostly go on the stock bolt holes. While the rear fenders go on with adhesive.
The front Air dam Group 44 used I’ll have to make a pattern to then make a splash mold from followed by a cloth finger glass and Kevlar part. I’ll see after I get the car at race height if it will be molded together with the front fenders or I’ll make it quickly removable. In order to get it in and out of the trailer without damage.

Here’s the rear.

Front fender

 

By race quality I mean the surface will look nice but it won’t have the interior bracing. I use the stiffness of carbon Fiber to keep it rigid and will either make it completely mounted with hood pins or dzues buttons. ( my preference since they are lighter and much more aero dynamic).
With Carbon fiber and a Gel coat layer. The paint is much more durable than fiberglass and you don’t need that flexible paint used on bumpers.

Since I’m vintage racing and no contact is allowed I’ll avoid using a Kevlar layer which adds weight but no real stiffness.
SCCA I’d double even triple the Kevlar.

The really tough part is shipping to someone. I looked into shipping the fenders from Virginia where they are made to Minnesota where I live and it would have actually been higher than what I paid for the parts. While shipping is expensive the parts require crating which by the time you buy the wood add the time to make it so the parts arrive safely and then bring it into a shipping point. It gets silly expensive.
I just jumped into my truck and drove for 15 hours one way, tossed the parts in the truck with a blanket between each and drove back.
Figuring gas and tolls I still came out way ahead.

 

That's a hell of wide arch you've got there @Mguar. It looks good though! I've thought about what tire widths I can fit on mine
without it looking ridiculous and/or how much the wheel arches can be widened without it being obvious.

Using adhesive on the rear fenders, does that turn out pretty well at the end if I'm going for a street car that looks mostly normal?