One I expected use of the C-Tek to actually prolong the life of the battery and two I didn’t expect such a short life with this one. It’s not about cost, batteries are relatively inexpensive, less than $50 per year, it’s more about expectation and waste.

 

deleted. not useful

 

You know, Larry King agrees with you and does the same thing with wives!

 

Make sure to lock the door when the car is not used. Draws less power when locked.

 

Going forward there has to be a way to change the behavior of the XK electrical system, Did you know that just by opening the drivers door that all sorts of things like the fuel pump, plus many other ignition related only things one would think is related to starting up only when you select ignition position.

I found this out when I was trying to find an ignition only 12v source to properly wire the K40 Calibre system that was in my XK when I bought it. Everything I thought would be an ignition only 12v supply(active during starter engagement) would activate just by opening the door, and would stay on even after turning off ignition and staying in the car. I had the same problem with both the under hood and rear passenger fuse panels, took me almost a dozen tries to find something that didn't activate this way.. I get that the car is preparing itself for departure when you open the door, but I still find it pretty crazy how many things activate just from that. There just has to be a better way.

Cheers,

Dave

 

 

I last had the car out last Friday for my 160 mile round trip to my dealer for it's annual oil service. Came home and plugged in the 4.3 Cetek. It sits at 13.7 V on step 7 after it goes trough it's 6 steps of normal cycle. So today I took the car down from the lift and loaded my golf clubs for my league later today. Now doors were locked and I opened the boot. Voltage dropped from 13.7 to 13.5 with the boot open. Took about a minute to load the clubs and shut the boot. Next I opened the driver door and unlatched the bonnet. Rear side marker lights go on and stay on. Went to check my coolant and then closed the bonnet. Lights went out. Also pushed the button on the door to lock the car. I went to the back and look at my volt meter and it was at 13.0 volts. This is all with the charger still plugged in. Came back 15 minutes later and it was back to 13.7 volts. Checked the car and nothing appeared to be running. Oh usually when I unplug the Cetek and go in and start the car the start volts drop to 13.0 v then settle to 13.4 on initial drive and then reduce to 12.7 to 13.4 depending on what the ECM/ALT calls for. 2012 XKR just an FYI

 

I did a bit of research and determined there are only 2 compatible batteries specs wise, a traditional flooded and an AGM that fit our cars. They are of course branded under many different names but they all have the same case, same specifications and probably all made by VARTA/Johnson Controls, however prices vary widely. The only fitment difference I could find between the flood and AGM was a half-inch height difference. I measured the one currently fitted and it was indeed 7-inches tall, then placed a half-inch tall block of wood on top of the battery and replaced the cover. No fitment issues for mine so I then went to a store a few blocks away and measured the height of the AGM and it was indeed 7.5-inches tall so I went ahead and had it installed since I was doing a core swap. I paid about the same price as Interstate would have charged for the flooded battery at a prorated 45% discount and got a better warranty and a better battery.

Here's the interesting part, I had him test the 4-year old Interstate battery and it passed! Over 1100 cranking amps, no bad cells, etc. He said it was perfect! Now when I found it dead I did put the CTEK into recondition mode. So now I am curious, did the recondition fix it or is their analyzer junk and the battery would have eventually died?

After driving around for an hour or so, the CTEK indicator in the trunk was still flashing green, this would not always be the case with the previous battery as often it would be yellow on short trips and would take a few hours on the maintainer to get back to green.

The CTEK is now connected and after 30 minutes hasn't passed step 3 even though the status light on the indicator is still green. I'll keep checking on it.

 

How do you drive around with the Cetek attached to the battery. You must have a long power cord.

 

I fitted the quick release indicator panel in the right side if the boot.

 

jahummer,

Do you have any idea how the retailer maintained his battery inventory, or how long your new AGM battery was sitting on the shelf before you bought it? Did you ask if he had more than one in stock and, if so, did you choose the battery with the most recent production date? It's possible that the dealer sold you the battery with the oldest date or that it wasn't fully charged when installed, so that could be why your CTEK is still charging it.

Please keep us updated with your experience with your AGM battery and if you have any issues with the alternator or other electrical gremlins. Hopefully, it will exceed your expectations, particularly since you'll keep it fully charged with your CTEK.

So, if anyone needs a new battery in the future, I thought you might want to keep the following in mind. All batteries slowly self-discharge, even when they're not in use. So, if a dealer fails to properly maintain his battery inventory, the customer will drive out with a brand-new battery that's below its peak. Proper dealer maintenance includes regular periodic charging and cleaning the battery terminals. Most battery dealers rotate their inventory and try to sell their oldest batteries first. For you non-accountants, that's known as the FIFO method - First In, First Out. A knowledgeable battery buyer does the opposite - he wants to buy LIFO - the Last In, First Out and get the freshest battery. Just a bit of insight for the next time you need a new battery.

Stuart

 

Stuart

You're absolutely correct and I meant to indicate in my update that the manufacture date on the new battery is April 2018 so it should be fairly fresh, I think. Jaguar's workshop guide has a section about inventory cars and batteries and even mentions checking them every 30 days.

 

Another point I neglected to mention in my first post is the car was locked when I found the battery was dead, so I couldn’t even get into the car until I used the mechanical key to unlock the hatch and attach the CTEK.

 

This is the culprit(highlighted with yellow rectangle) that is causing the cover fitment issues on my 2010 with a taller AGM battery. This is part of the negative cable that monitors input/output usage for the 5.0 charging system.




Cheers,

Dave

 

I believe you. There is a bulletin about the 2010 cars with regards to flooded v AGM. Appparently some came setup for flooded only and some came setup for AGM only and per Jaguar no substitutions should be made. Also when a battery is replaced on a 5 litre car it is imperative SDD be used to run the battery replacement routine in order to reset the charging profile for a new battery.

https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/a...eplacement.pdf

 

You believe me?? About what? I am so confused! Maybe one too many tonight? LOL

Yeah, I have read so many like that my head is spinning :-). Too bad they didn't put those info labels about whether the car came originally with a flooded or AGM on the battery frame/mount instead of just the battery. Heck you can read the battery label to know what kind it is. BUT, if the battery has been replaced a few times there is no way to know for sure what it came with, or is programmed for. Maybe they should update that bulletin and say if it has xx volts at idle it is programmed for this battery and if voltage at idle is xy volts it is for this type. IMHO that would be more helpful than a sticker on a battery that is a known replacement item.

Hopefully some of the savvy guys here may know a concrete way to find that out, now that would be much more helpful than Jaguar creating a read the battery label bulletin.

Regardless, I want to fit an AGM in there because I feel strongly it is the right thing to do given all the additional electronics and more advanced systems on the 2010-up.

I will update if I find a solution, maybe the photo I posted will jog someone's memory that has been down that road before..

Cheers,

Dave

 

I take the point - while Jaguar say 'replace like with like' (i.e., replace a flooded battery with a flooded battery, and an AGM one with an AGM one), that doesn't help if the battery has already been replaced at least once, and you don't know if it was replaced with the correct type!

It seems odd that Jaguar do not publish anywhere a clear guide as to which models / VIN nos. of the X150 were fitted with each type of battery. However, most battery manufacturers, distributors and retailers usually have a look-up facility where you can check this.

My understanding is that all the older, 4.2 litre models (like mine) had a flooded battery. I think the 5.0 litre ones had an AGM one, but others here may be better informed than me on this. Certainly any stop-start versions of the car would presumably need an AGM battery.

HOWEVER - while a car which needs an AGM battery should always have an AGM battery fitted, I suspected that it may be possible (even, perhaps, for some patterns of car usage, an advantage) for an older car, when its worn-out, original flooded battery has to be replaced, to fit an AGM battery in its place. I therefore sought the advice of the technical department of the Yuasa battery company (whose batteries I have used and been pleased with in the past) and below is the correspondence in full, in case the information is useful to others.

About a month ago, when my original 12-year-old Jaguar / Varta flooded battery started to become unreliable and my little Sealey BT102 battery tester (about £60, and well worth it) said 'replace battery immediately' (although it continued to start the engine satisfactorily) I decided - on the basis of this information from Yuasa - to replace it with one of their YBX9019 AGM batteries (about £170 from an independent distributor). And so far, so good!
_ _ _

-----Original Message-----
Sent: 26 March 2018 12:34
To: Peter Whittaker Peter.Whittaker@gs-yuasa.uk
Subject: FW: Best Battery for 2007 Jaguar XK

Dear Sir
I may soon need to replace the battery (size 019) in my 2007 4.2 litre Jaguar XK convertible and I would appreciate advice on selecting the most suitable battery for my particular requirements. I don't mind paying a bit more for a better battery, provided it is 'better' in ways which are relevant for my needs.
This car
- has a lot of features which consume electrical power, such as air conditioning and electrically heated seats
- has a lot of very temperamental electronics which start to play up if the battery voltage drops even slightly
- has quite a lot of electronics running permanently, even when the car is switched off- my own car can quite often end up parked, unused, for a week or two, without a battery charger connected

I therefore need to choose the battery-type which
- suffers the least voltage drop if it is simply left
- suffers the least if it is still has to power 'standby' electronics when left
- suffers the least damage/deterioration, when subjected to any given level of discharge
- suffers the least damage/deterioration, when subjected to discharge for any given period of time
- suffers the least damage/deterioration, when subjected to discharge on any given jumber of occasions

In the 019 size, your four options appear to be
- the basic '3000' type
- the (presumably!) slightly higher-spec '5000' type
- the 'Black' type, which Halfords offer with a 'lifetime guarantee'
- the AGM (glass mat) type, apparently designed primarily for 'stop-start' cars

Which type would best for my particular requirements? Would the 'Black' battery be more suitable / more 'robust' or more 'resilient', electrically, than an AGM battery? Or vice-versa?
And out of interest: the 'Black' battery is claimed to be capable of withstanding 130,000 engine starts, in contrast to the 20,000 or so for most conventional 'flooded' batteries. This number of engine starts sounds more like the performance of an AGM battery. What is the technology of a 'Black' battery which permits this level of performance please?
Your advice / help / guidance, and any other technical information you can provide, would be much appreciated and I would hope to share any such advice / information with other Jaguar XK owners.
Regards- [Titus2]
_ _ _

on 26/03/2018 15:42, Peter Whittaker wrote:

Dear Mr [Titus2]
The Black series of product is based on an advanced flooded formulation and is a high endurance type. This product is good for vehicles going out on short, intermittent journeys because the battery accepts charge faster than others (it will recover voltage faster over shorter driving distances, as does the AGM type). Like most flooded types however, it will not stand up well to long-term storage in a low state of charge. This is typical of most lead-acid batteries on the market.

We generally advise customers that annual mileage of less than 3,000 miles can result in a higher likelihood of problems with their battery. Sulphation caused by over-discharge or long-term storage in a low voltage state can occur in all of these battery types and can cause irreversible damage. For low mileage duty cycles, we always recommend some form of maintenance charging to maintain battery health.

In response to your requirements, please see my comments below:

I therefore need to choose the battery-type which
- suffers the least voltage drop if it is simply left
Provided that no loads are present, the AGM battery has the slowest self-discharge rate of all of the types in our automotive range. If loads are present, voltage drop is similar for all battery types. If the vehicle is sensitive to voltage drop, there is no benefit in using any of these battery types. If any lead-acid battery is discharged to circa 50% capacity, voltage will be approx. 12.4V. If the vehicle has a requirement for a higher voltage, the only way to assure this is maintained is to charge the battery to the required capacity.
- suffers the least if it is still has to power 'standby' electronics when left
AGM will withstand this better than other types, but is still subject to damage if left for extended periods in a discharged state. The benefit of AGM technology is in the battery’s ability to repeatedly recover from deep cycling, but the battery must be recovered (recharged) in order to see the benefit, long-term.
- suffers the least damage/deterioration, when subjected to any given level of discharge
AGM is best.
- suffers the least damage/deterioration, when subjected to discharge for any given period of time
AGM is best, but it should be noted that the battery is designed to be cycled, not parked.
- suffers the least damage/deterioration, when subjected to discharge on any given number of occasions
AGM is best.
Whilst AMG stands up to harsh conditions better than other technologies, it’s difficult to make this recommendation without knowing the drive-cycle and typical loads on the vehicle. To my knowledge, there isn’t a lead-acid product on the market designed specifically for this scenario.
I hope this helps.
Kind regards,
Peter Whittaker Technical Services Manager - Automotive and MC Division
E: Peter.Whittaker@gs-yuasa.uk%7C W: www.yuasa.com www.gs-battery.com
GS Yuasa Battery Sales UK Ltd, Unit 13, Hunts Rise, South Marston Park, Swindon, Wiltshire, SN3 4TG
_ _ _

 

Well...went to check the CTEK status this morning and...it is now on step 4 over 12 hours later...hmmmm

 

jahummer,

Are you sure that April 2018 date is the date of manufacture, or is it a "Use By" date?

Seriously, if that AGM battery was fully charged when it was installed, your CTEK MUS4.3 would have been at Step 7 a long time ago. Your CTEK is a maintainer, not a charger. There's a big difference. What's in a name? The CTEK MUS4.3's output is 4.3 amps, which is much lower than a charger, which typically puts out 10 amps or more. So, do the math - it will take much longer for your CTEK to bring a weak battery up to a full charge, particularly since the program is constantly adjusting the charge rate and timing to optimize it for AGM.

You could speed up the process by using a quick charger, but you must be careful to not overcharge and damage your battery. I'd just be patient and let your CTEK do it's thing, as a slow, controlled charge is probably better for your new AGM battery.

Stuart

 

As I mentioned above the CTEK indicator panel was green from the time the AGM battery was installed to the time I arrived home, about an hour of driving. This was not always the case with the previous battery. I’ll have to check the date again but these Varta/JC German batteries typically only show the manuafacture
Date in my experience.

I reset the CTEK but that made no difference.