Back in May I chronicled the battery issues on my 2011 XK. At the time the dealership had assured me that the electrical issues within the car had been located and resolved. A new battery was installed and I was told I wouldn't be back.
This past September the car once again was DOA in my garage.
Car was brought to dealership again and I pretty much expected dealership and Jaguar corporate would finally reach the same conclusion that I had about this specific car.
That it is a LEMON.
A week ago and 14 weeks after the car first went into service no repairs had been performed and the car was returned to me.
About 8 weeks in to this saga the dealerships service manager told me that corporate wanted them to attach a monitor to my car and have it returned to me, so that when the battery died AGAIN they would have an understanding of the problem and I suppose fix it.
To his credit the service manager wasn't that thrilled with this idea either and he agreed when I pointed out that if corporate had this so-called "Magic Wand" why had they failed to put in in place on the first four visits I had with this exact issues or for that matter the numerous times the previous owner had a dead battery?
As weeks went by with no resolution I decided that maybe I should look for a replacement for this car with the understanding that eventually the dealership and Jag corporate would take this vehicle back.
I found a 2013 XKR in Red in New Jersey that had just dropped significantly in price. I test drove it and left a deposit with that dealer. I told that dealer of my issues and he was of the opinion that Jaguar Corporate could intervene and facilitate a buyback-trade scenario.
I informed Jaguar corporate at this time of what I had done hoping that they could accelerate a decision and put me in another one of the company's vehicles.
Needless to say the exact opposite took place as Corporate reiterated their claim that they were unable to reproduce the dead battery issues that I had and made no reasonable attempt to end the dragged-out affair.
The dealership claimed that corporate wasn't giving them any assistance in a buyback and did I guess what all dealers do, offered me $5,000 more than they said the car was currently valued at. Unfortunately that number came in $1,000 below a trade-in offer I received from a BMW dealer just before this incident took place.
After 12 weeks Jag corporate asked me to return the loaner and pick up my car with an attitude that I had refused to accept the dealers offer and there was nothing else they could do. The stalemate appeared to revolve around my refusal to take the car with the monitor as well as my refusal to let the dealer drive my car with the monitor.
At this point I decided to give the dealer one week to drive my car with an understanding that a resolution of some sort would take place after that period. The dealer agreed.
One week after allowing this the service manager requested a bit more time since there had been weather issues. I allowed the extra time with the belief that I could wait a few more days.
Two days before the Christmas holiday Jag corporate called me to tell me that their extended test didn't produce a dead battery or for that matter any electrical issues. They instructed me to return the loaner vehicle at once. I asked whether any repairs had been done to the car and I asked what the value of a Jaguar warranty is, since every issue took place either during the initial warranty or during the CPO period of time.
I didn't get an answer.
Two days after Christmas the service manager left a message on my phone. I returned the phone call but got voicemail.
A few hours later the service manager called me to tell me that they were cleaning up my car and would return it to me. At the same time the service manager informed me that the dealership had in fact already taken the loaner vehicle out of my driveway with my personal belongings inside.
Apparently he waited to call me until after they had seized the car.
After I hung up I first realized that my property was in the car and kindly asked that it be returned when the dealer returned my vehicle. Fortunately I have a second car or I could have been stranded.
My lawyer has since been in contact with the dealership and after 16 weeks of wasted time and energy I am happy that I will be getting very close to a complete refund on the car.
What I am not happy about is that the 2013 Red XKR is no longer available.
Friends and family suggest that I have to be crazy to actually want another one of these cars. That this 2011 spent nearly half of 2016 in the shop is ample reason for their conclusions. For me I simply loved the car when it wasn't depressing me with a dead battery.
In the end the dealership proved itself in how they stole the loaner car back from me. At most times I felt that Jaguar corporate wasn't backing its warranty in any realistic form. I don't know what to conclude about the corporation at this time only that it would appear they didn't seem to mind losing a customer that actually wanted to own one of their cars.
Wishing all here a Happy, Healthy and great driving year.
I would much rather have paid the upcharge for the 13 XKR than have the money back in my pocket, sadly the company didn't see it that way.
Jay

 

Sad tale.

I sure wish Jaguar would police their dealers. Ones who behave badly also ruin Jaguar's image yet still they don't police them. Weird.

 

A sad tale indeed.

I suspect I know why they repo'd the loaner. At the end of the year the dealership has to account to their lender for every car in inventory. Remember that dealerships do not own the cars on their lot. Often the lender DEMANDS that these cars are present at the dealership. Any shortfall can lead to financial penalties or withdrawal of credit.

Happened to a used car dealership in Vegas when some of the nicer items in their inventory were AWOL, mostly because sales staff were swanning around Vegas in them trying to impress girls.

 

Yes, as agentorange said, sometimes they do not own the cars. It is called Floor Planning.

Two things, the first is that the car was obviously a lemon as stated and glad that at least this part was resolved. Second, I agree with your family and friends in saying you were nuts wanting to buy another Jag. While it is admirable that you realize that they are good cars but you had a bad one I would never be treated like you were and still buy the brand.

 

To referesh my recollection, I reread the OP's first thread: https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...-straw-162836/, and noted that many forum members, including myself, recommended that the OP use a CTEK or similar battery maintainer. He steadfastly refused to do so, stating in his post #4: "My difficulty adapting to that daily procedure is a fundamental belief that the manufacturer should identify the problems and correct them." And, in his post #18, stated: "At the same time I believe it is Jaguar's responsibility to create a vehicle that can maintain its battery power during "normal" driving conditions."

While I agree in theory with the OP, sometimes it makes more sense to try taking the easy way out. Because there was a battery drain due to difficult, if not impossible, to find causes, if using an inexpensive CTEK solved his dead battery problems he could have avoided all of the subsequent aggravation. I want to take this opportunity to reiterate my view of life, as stated in my post #25 in the OP's original thread:

"Life is fragile, and the road of life is filled with ups, downs, curves, potholes, and other unforeseen dangers. We're here for only a short time, so make the most of every day; you never know when it will be your last. Here are my personal "Rules of the Road":

Rule 1. "Don't sweat the small stuff" - the key to a long and happy life.
Rule 2. EVERYTHING is the small stuff, EXCEPT your own health.
Rule 3. Repeat Rules 1 & 2. Otherwise, you can't help anyone else.
Rule 4. There are 2 ways to solve every problem; the hard way or the easy way. Only masochists choose the hard way.
Rule 5. KISS - Keep It Simple, Stupid
Rule 6. Don't let your ego get in the way of Rules 1-5.

Applying the above rules to resolve Jay's battery problem: Take it easy and buy a CTEK - the best bang for the buck. It's cheaper than a psychiatrist. Or a cardiologist.

Your life, your choice."

Just my

Stuart
__________________

 

Jag will never be more than an automotive footnote. They need to stand behind their **** or they'll never be a major competitor in the open market. This is the stuff I hate about them. This may well be my last Jag but over my lifetime I've owned 19 Toyotas. Tata is blowing it.

 

Did you get screwed by a dealer or Jag corporate also?

I hope this isn't just because of this one guy and one car...we give the benefit of the doubt but I know there are always two sides to a story, I do not make that strong of a judgement based on half the info.

If I were to dump every manufacturer of products I own based on internet posts from unhappy customers I wouldn't be able to buy anything.

 

Stuart, permit me to add, after "a cardiologist" ......."not to mention, the lawyer's fees, as well"

 

While I do agree with the general thought "you can't help those that don't help themselves" it seemed the OP's problem was deeper than the normal battery fatigue suffered by most. I can go 3 week or so with short interval drives around town before I start to notice that the battery is at a low charge state, this indicated by a sluggish turnover. I try to attach my maintainer (a Schumacher) at least once a week but at times I do not.

This dude reported that he could go for a 2 hour drive and the car not start a day or two later. That to me indicates abnormal drain, if that is indeed the case. Is he telling us the truth or doctoring the story to eliminate criticism for failing to heed advice to use a maintainer...well that I do not know. I don't put anything past anyone on the internet.

I guess we will never know if he is a stubborn *** who insists on ignoring the obvious solution or a well justified indignant consumer with a car failing to operate in an acceptable manner.

I remain indifferent and refuse to vilify or absolve either side since we can never know the whole story here. My only comment is to tell the OP to move on from the brand if he really feels he was on the wrong side of this deal. It sounds like the brand has moved on from him...

 

I don't believe the best decision is to give up on the Jaguar brand. Sure, the OP got a real lemon ... but then his problems were exacerbated by dealing with a Jag dealership every bit as bad as Byer's Imports in Columbus Ohio.

Remember, a 'lemon' is just that ... an aberration! So giving up on the Jag brand is like going through a divorce and deciding never to date or marry again because of the problems you experienced with your 1st spouse.

No brand is perfect ... look at Stuart's (?) experience with his Lexus! Other than this one episode, the OP loved his Jag . I've had mine over 4 completely trouble-free years, as have most Jag owners on this forum.

Few cars stir the emotion like an XK-XKR Jag. So, my recommendations are -

1. Sue the Jag dealership for their abhorrent, unconscionable, illegal actions.

2. Buy a well-sorted, low-mileage XK or XKR after having it thoroughly inspected and take it, when necessary, to a different Jag dealer for service.

3. Swallow the pill (and your pride) buy a CTEK Mus 4.3 battery maintainer and hook it up every night, without fail.

4. Then, be prepared to have trouble going to sleep knowing how excited you'll be the next day driving your fabulous, beautiful Jag!

That's what I'd do. Just sayin' ...

 

One other point - I think there may have been a Technical Service Bulletin on reflashing some of the early 5L X150 models that didn't completely shut off the infomation system. I'm posting this from my cellphone and can't search for it. If my memory is right, I wonder if that TSB was done on the OP's car? Might that have been the cause of his problem? And was his dealer (and the contact person at Jaguar USA) ignorant and incompetent?

There is always a reason for a problem. In the good old days, you could fix it because you could see it. Not so with today's cars where everything is electronically interconnected with computers and you can't "see" what's broken without the proper diagnostic equipment. Progress ... ... ? Bring back the dipstick! They always worked and never broke!

 

Your '09 doesn't have a dipstick?

 

Yep, it's a 4.2L. But I wish my 5.0L XJ had one, as well as gauges for water temperature, oil pressure and voltage. I make do with the virtual gauges on the free Torque app and Bluetooth OBDII code reader.

 

buy an aston and forget all this

 

Erm...

22 Nov 2016 - Toyota (tm, +0.14%) is recalling almost 850,000 Sienna minivans
26 Oct 2016 - Toyota recalls 5.8 million cars
29 Jun 2016 - Around the world, 1.43m Toyota vehicles are being recalled.

There are plenty more where those came from. Don't be fooled just because these forums are where the tiny minority of people come for help with issues. This is not indicative of the general condition. All makes have a degree of issues, Toyota included. My prediction is that Jaguar will be remembered long after both Toyota and Jaguar are dust simply because Jaguar make memorable cars and Toyota don't. Perhaps you are more suited to the latter?

FYI Tata is the entire reason Jaguar is the current success that it is.

 

I thought it was Ford that turned Jaguar around........... The pre-Ford days were spotty quality at best, and then came Ford and we have the near bullet-proof reliability that we have now, other than a few nitnoid things here and there. I believe TATA has promoted the brand better, however. How many television commercials touted Jaguar while in Ford's hands? I can't remember many... if any at all. Can't sell a product that nobody knows exists.

 

Before everybody on this thread climbs all over Jaguar NA and the dealer, remember you are only reading about that part of one side of the issue that the op wants you to know. My guess is we are only getting some small fraction of one side of the story.

 

You would have to assume the dealer and Jaguar did everything to resolve the issue and I gather from what the OP has said and considering how long the service department had the vehicle in their care, the dealer found the car to be operating to specification and did NOT observe the same battery behavior the OP did. Certainly would be nice to have the full story from all parties.


Ford certainly made the product modern, reliable and IMHO one of the best car brands on the road but they gave up on it and never took it all the way. Tata has deep pockets and unlike Ford has not been afraid to spend the money, especially on marketing, something Ford neglected to do.

 

Didn't you get the "Gorgeous" campaign in the US? They seemed to be constantly on TV here in NZ in around 2007:

 

Ford certainly brought them back from the brink, no doubt there, but essentially kept them on a life-support machine. Tata have them off the machine and flourishing. You would never have the F-Type under Ford ownership, for example.