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Without exploring the electrical schematics may I suggest that you open the 'T' valve on the hydraulic pump and manually operate the top from your current full down to full up and locked using the Allen key and back to full down. There has been comments on this subject and I have experienced 'confusion' of the top system that the above has resolved.
Be sure to close the valve.
Beyond that you are going to have to get the DVOM and schematic out.
Thank you again Mr. Test Point. In the light of day, I did exactly what you suggested. Opened the T-valve. Raised the top (did not latch yet). Looked in truck (boot). Found some oil on hydraulic lines. Good News: The end of one line was NOT connected to a fitting. Has to stop for awhile because it is 94F here and very humid.
OK. I will try to refit the end of the hydraulic line back into the fitting. I can do this. The new question for anyone: "Where is the fill port for the convertible top hydraulic fluid?"
It is the bolt on top of the pump tank. On the XKR you will need some vinyl tubing to fill it unless you remove the tank.
When you say the end is of the hydraulic line is not in the fitting, is it the bare plastic end or is there a mating fitting attached to the hose?
If it is a bare plastic end, the hose ruptured at the fitting and will need to be replaced. There is 1600 PSI in these hoses and they cannot be repaired.
Hello whiteXKR. Thank you for helping me again. Your sage advice has always been very helpful.
1) yes, I located the tank and found a photo on Jaguar Forums showing the fill nut. I thought I would have to remove the pump assembly to fill, but I will first try your suggestion with some flex tube in my possession.
2) your comments on the hydraulic line. Earlier I did not explain myself very well. The braided line and internal plastic tube separated at the fitting. There is no evidence of a break in the line. Appears it has been loose for awhile. The outside of the line was coated with hydraulic oil. The plastic tank is about 1/4 full, so I am surprised the top had worked as well as it did. I removed the fitting. It seems to have two parts. One, the threaded female end which screws into the pump (looks good, no thread damage), and the slip fit other end that accepts the plastic inner portion of the line. I am able to manually insert the white inner plastic portion of the separated line into the fitting, about 3/4 inch. There does NOT appear to be any strain relief. Unsure what would keep it from coming loose again. Maybe clean it all up and use super glue? Your thoughts?
3) all the literature says refill the Hydraulic reservoir with ONLY one unique type of fluid. Excuse me for asking, but isn't all hydraulic fluid of same viscosity the same?
Any comments you can offer are always appreciated.
No, all hydraulic fluid is not the same. You need to use Pentosin CHF 11S only.
It is available at NAPA and lots of other places. A previous Jaguar fluid gummed up and created a lot of recalls.
The point that Steve was making is that at 1600 pounds per square inch a repaired hose is not going to work. These hoses have a long history of failing and I am not aware of anyone successfully repairing one.
From your description, you hydraulic hose is irreparably damaged and will need to be replaced. The slip fit will not withstand the pressure. The plastic hose probably deteriorated which caused the crimp to fail.
Thank you both Test Point and WhiteXKR. Your replies are spot on. My local NAPA store carries the fluid (yea), and the link shows where I can get quality replacement hydraulic lines. Thank you both for making time to help me (again). It is appreciated!
Dear WhiteXKR. You said "From your description, you hydraulic hose is irreparably damaged and will need to be replaced. The slip fit will not withstand the pressure. The plastic hose probably deteriorated which caused the crimp to fail."
You're incredibly correct,
Here is a photo of the, now un-crimped, plastic hose portion.
sorry, white on white is hard to show contrast, but the damaged crimp is just like you said.
Which hose is that. To the front latch or to the rams? From your description sounds like the Ram hoses (which are easier to replace I believe). Will you replace all four or just the two?
Thank you for asking. Yes, there are four hydraulic lines.
I have attached a photo, with a cloth on the line. The hyd hose crimp failed at the fitting to the 11 o'clock position from the pressure release valve. I stuck it back together.
I am unsure whether this is the easier one to replace. Whatever you can tell me will help.
The hoses on the same side of the pump body as the petcock are latch hoses. There are two of these. The one you've draped a cloth over is a latch hose.
On the other side of the pump body you will find four hoses. These go to the rams.
This morning (Monday) I visited my local hydraulic hose and fittings fabricator. He knew immediately that I was holding a cut off section of a car's convertible top hydraulic system. He looked at my photo of the pump in the trunk. He said all four lines need to be replaced. The coating (black) is gone and hydraulic lines will burst without it. It is just a matter of time.
He said that they make them up for the dealers all the time. The dealers, or a vendor, does the installation.
Very disappointing for a 20 year old car. I guess this is one of the blessings for owning a Jaguar.
So, here is my new inquiry.
I learned how to MANUALLY open/close the latch with the allen wrench. Since the hose that burst was for the latch, can I disable the hydraulics to the front latch, using the allen wrench instead, and still use the pump to raise/lower the top?
I know that I would have to cap off the two lines to the latch. The Hydraulic line and fitting person this morning made me a 12 x 1.5 metric cap from a hydraulic fitting, and welded the opening shut.
Will this work? I am not yet prepared to pay $750 for the lines, and take most of the interior of the car apart for the install.
I look forward to any sage replies you might offer.
There are other threads on how to convert to full manual operation.
As an FYI, my dealer quoted me 10 hours of labor to swap the lines and latch if I provided them from Top Hydraulics. This seemed like a reasonable quote, honestly. If you do eventually get the lines, I would recommend having your latch rebuilt too. It's only $150 and with new lines you'll never worry about this system again.
Hello dsd. I know that I will have to bite the bullet sooner or later. Probably sooner. Can you recall how much your local dealer charged for the 10 hours of labor? I already have a price for the replacement lines from Top Hydraulics. Thank you very much, again. Very respectfully, Bob G.
Hello dsd. I know that I will have to bite the bullet sooner or later. Probably sooner. Can you recall how much your local dealer charged for the 10 hours of labor? I already have a price for the replacement lines from Top Hydraulics. Thank you very much, again. Very respectfully, Bob G.
I actually only needed a latch-- it appears my hoses were already redone.
10 hours would have been around $1500 at dealer labor rates. The dealer has always been good to me and we discussed. It's not a hard job just a PITA. I just couldn't get the time to do it so I was prepared to have them.
06-28-2017, 07:15 PM
Convertible Top Died - Maybe
