Hello - I have a 2003 XKR with 54k miles on it. Just this morning driving to work I noticed it seemed to be shifting erratically. Yesterday everything was perfectly fine. Sometimes when stopped @ a red light it would drop hard into gear when taking off. Now after driving around a bit, it seems that it is getting worse. It downshifts very erratically @ highway speed (example: for passing) and when stopped sometimes it stalls out, especially if in Park. It also has a very rough idle and almost sounds like it is mis-firing. Does anyone know any obvious/easy things to check for such a vacuum hose off etc. before I take her to the dealer ? Any common problems with these cars that could be the cuprit ? Any chance bad gas could cause these type of problems (my wife filled it the other day but it seemed fine until now) ? I'm not sure if the problem is the engine, transmission, computer control, or a combination of any/all of them. I definitely don't want to chance making the problem worse by driving it around. I have no error or warning messages, check engine lights, etc. coming up. Any insight would be appreciated. Thanks

 

I would suggest going to a chain auto parts store and get the fault codes read for free (or buy an inexpensive code reader). Come back and post the results. Without that information it is total guesswork.

 

I agree get the codes first!

 

Thanks for the quick response. That was my first guess, but when I jacked in my OBD scanner all I got was code P1000, which indicates "tests not complete" per JTIS. Just now, I went out, cleared it, and followed the procedure on Page 3, drove it around for a while etc. I kept my OBD online with the car the whole time and that is all that ever came up. I even cleared it again, stopped & restarted the ignition, then ran for another 15 minutes - Nothing. Am I doing something wrong ?

On the plus side, it did seem a little better toward the end of the trip. I was able to put it in park 2x and it did not die immediately on me.

 

It'll take a few drive cycles to score the check engine light and get a code for a massive air leak causing rough idling. You could access your scanner's live data if it has it, and see if the fuel trims are relatively steady at + 7%...IIRC, when you get over 10 or 12, for a few consecutive drive cycles, you'll get the CEL. Mine idled rough at those levels at idle before tracking down the leak.

I'm gonna lean towards your wife filling up with sub-par gas (dont tell her I said that though), most likely <92 octane, grill her and if she fesses up to the Wallmart gas station 'plus' fuel, put some fuel treatment into the tank, BG44K is a popular recommendation for cleaning out injectors and general combustion byproducts.

 

oooh, another question...did she get a car wash while she was out also?

 

If you have sub-par gas, it would just be lower octane. Then you would have pinging. Even severe pinging, sounding like a hand full a marbles. There would be pore performance but not actual misfire. Unless you have put gas in the car from a gas can. Then it could have some water in it. It's not likely to get water from a filling station pump now days. Can you tell if the misfire is consistant? Like the same cylinders misfiring all of the time. Look at your exhaust. Does the smoke from one side look different from the other? Do you have any knew engine noise? Check at idle, then rev it up quickly and listen. From what Iv'e heard it's difficult to tell if you will damage it by driving. If you can't tell, you need a machanic to listen and give you advice.

 

Guys - Well the CEL finally came on. Amber warning light, CEL, "Restricted Performance". I checked the codes again, and I got P0171 and P0174, both of which are apparently "System too lean". I also grabbed the freeze frame data if needed.

I made an appontment with my dealer for tomorrow but they told me it is most likely clogged injectors and quite possibly related to ethanol in fuel, they have had a lot of these issues because our engines are not designed to use ethanol. I asked my wife & she filled it with 89 Shell the other day (DOH!). Anyway, do any of you think running a bottle of off-shelf injector cleaner through it would solve the problem or is it better to just let the dealer deal with it ? If so, any product recommendations ? I know these are finicky cats and I don't want to just use regular gumout etc unless that's really ok. Any ideas on how involved the dealer's work would be or would they just do a higher-end (and more expensive) version of the same thing ?

Thanks all of you for your time, advice & suggestons !

 

Could also be the intake pipe or one of the plastic breather hoses it connects to has come loose, or developed a crack. These are easy DIY fixes if you want to check them out.

A bad MAFS is another common cause of this problem.

BG-44K is about the best 'pour in the tank' fuel system cleaner out there if you want to try that. It is around $20 a can and you have to buy it from a service shop or ebay. Many independent shops or dealers will sell you a can.

If I were you I would top up with premium, add some BG-44K and check the intake system integrity before rushing to the dealer.

 

I think you have a big air leak in the intake system between the MAF and the throttle body. It's possible the intake pipe mount at the thottle body is loose. I worry about taking it to the dealer that guessed injector cleaner on a low mileage car with serious misfiring due to lean conditions without looking at the car. Your engine can use ethanol just fine, forget that as a problem. I do not like fuel additives, and would never put it in the car. The stuff that's in some injector cleaner can do just as much or more damage as bad gas. BG44k cost me 2 expensive O2 sensors once. These are not finicky cats, they are well built precision machines that need competent mechanics, just like any modern car.

 

Oldmots, I have to say I have agreed with nearly everything you have ever posted, but beg to diagree regarding BG-44K.

Nearly every dealer service department in N. Va. uses BG-44K on Mercedes, Jaguar and other premium marques. I realize this is a profit center for them, but find it hard to believe that they would be using it if it damaged O2 sensors.

 

i agree too. Jaguar even has a special service message to install bg44 into tanks on the new cars with direct injection is there a rough idle issue beyond normal. 2 thinbgs on the sc engine other than mafs. Air intake tube cracked, and intercooler ducts leaking air also. Check the intake tube at the bellows for craking. Pull on it there and rub the fins of the beloows especially on the bottom. If its fine you wont do anything to it. Otherwise it slip open and flake off and youll know for sure. On the ducts, sprake with carb/brake clean while idleing and listen for roughness in the engine. Past that i would replace the mafs on that engine for lean codes.
Still doesnt meen you dont have coils misfiring also. But you either need codes for cylinders, or misfire counts with a capable scanner

 

Well I had in @ the dealer yesterday. The good news - my intake hose was loose/off at the engine end (or so they tell me), had it reattached & problem has gone away. At least that was simple.

Now for the fun stuff - They say I need
1) NEW TRANNY FOR $10k. It slips into gear a little when starting from a stop sign, also slips a little when coming to a stop. This problem is intermittent, happens occasionally. They tried to re-flash the control module and that did not help. They tell me they cannot service the tranny on these vehicles and when any problems that come up they just replace it. Sounds like a load of BS to me but I really don't know.

They also said I need 4 new tires even though the ones I have are less than a year old and look fine to me. Then I have a headlight out due to ballast failure which they can kindly fix for me for the low low price of $1500. I purchased an aftermarket ballast and asked if they could install it for me & the guy looked at me like I have 3 heads - I guess I'm doing that one myself.

Then i also need about $800 worth of general maintenance things, fluid flushes etc. Ugh. The car has 54,000 miles on it and the coolant was replaced by the previous owner about 20k ago - looks fine to me. not sure about the rest.

Needless to say I was not a very happy customer. Is there any truth to the transmission issue ? Any insight into what causes slips like this ? Is there any reason why I can't take it to an outside shop & have it worked on ?

Sounds to me like they are trying to gouge me for all I got. I will have to go find a better dealer I guess. It sucks because they are close by my house and I have used them several times over the last few yrs with both this car & a previous Jag & they were great before and very helpful.

Sorry for the rant I guess I just needed to vent a little. Anyway, thanks all of you for your advice & for just listening...

 

Your transmission can be rebuilt ($2500 to $3000)but I would find someone that is familiar with your transmission before they take on the project. Also be sure that they use the correct quality fluid for that trans. You can also get a trans on line for around the same price. As for the rest of the suggested repair list, you are not alone. Use good judgment when correcting the suggested problems. Many of them may be a concern but not a problem that needs repair now. What we often fail to understand is that they give you this list covering the inadequacies they see so you know.

 

1) TRUE IT IS SEALED FOR LIFE BUT THATS NOT THE LIFE UNDER "ALL" CONDITIONS. EVEN ZF STATES THAT SPIRITED DRIVING AND FOR BEST PERFORMANCE THE FLUID CAN BE CHANGED AT 60K. DOESN'T SOUND LIKE LIFETIME TO ME. THERES A THREAD THAT SOMEONE POSTED A LETTER FROM ZF ON THIS VERY ISSUE. WE DONT "SERVICE" TRANS EITHER BECAUSE THERE IS TOO MUCH LIABILTY WITH LAWSUITS AND PEOPLE CLAIMING THAT IT DIDNT SHIFT LIKE THAT TILL YOU FLUSHED MY TRANS. THIS CAN IN SOME CASES BE TRUE OF NEVER SERVICED TRANS THAT GET NEW CLEAN FLUID AND NOLONGER HAVE CRAP FLOATING AROUND IN THE FLUID THAT HELPED TO SEAL WORN SEALS. BUT THERE ARE ALOT OF UNSCRUPULOUS(sp?)
PEOPLE THAT HAVE ISSUES AND GO TO A SHOP TO GET A TRANS FLUSH DONE AND THEN CLAIM IT DIDNT SLIP BEFORE AND NOW THEY WANT A NEW TRANS. FUNNY WE DONT SEEM TO HAVE THESE ISSUES WHEN WE REPLACE TRANS PANS(WHICH IS THE FILTER TOO) FOR CRACKS/LEAKS AND THEN REFILL THE TRANS. IF IT WERE ME, I BELIEVE IN ELIMINATING THE MOST LIKELY AND CHEAPER SUSPECTS FIRST. SO I WOULD CHANGE THE TRANS FLUID. FORGET THE PAN FOR NOW SINCE IF YOU DO END UP NEEDING A TRANS THEN THAT MONEY WASTED. THERE ARE SEVERAL THREADS ABOUT CHEAPER ZF FLUID AND I KNOW LANDROVER USES THE SAME AS DOES BMW AND BENZ AND THE FLUID IS CHEAPER FROM LROVER. IF YOU DRAIN OVERNIGHT YOULL DRAIN ABOUT 6LITRS OUT. PAST THAT ARE YOU SURE ITS SLIPPING? TRANNY FAULT WARNING OR ANY TRANS CODES?????
THEYRE NOT GOING TO KNOW ABOUT COOLANT FLUSH UNLESS THEY HAVE RECORDS. SINCE YOU KNOW ITS BEEN DONE I WOULDNT WORRY ABOUT IT, BUT DO FLUSH THE BRAKES EVERY 2 YEARS 24K MILES REGARDLESS SINCE IT ABSORBS MOISTURE FROM THE AIR AND CAUSES BRAKE SYSTEM CORROSION AND FLUID BOILING.
ON THE TRANS PROGRAMMING AND ADAPTATON CLEARING, YOUDE BE SURPRISED HOW MANY TIMES THIS FIXES TRANS ISSUES. DID THEY TELL YOU TO AVOID FORCED DOWNSHIFTS, AGGRESSIVE ACCELERATION AND DONT TURN ON THE "SPORT" BUTTON FOR THE FIRST COUPLE HUNDRED MILES WHILE THE TRANS RELEARNS??????

 

Well, I have a local indy that I am good with, he is a semi-retired Ferrari & Jag certified mechanic w/ credentials to back it up & very cool too. So my next stop is him. Only reason I went to dealer 1st is becuz they are closer and I wanted that complete list of everything they saw. I will see what he sez re the tranny but based on the responses here I would guess the same - flush/fluid change with good juice 1st and then see.

I'm annoyed tho. Dealer gave me the old "Well sometimes its the age not the mileage" spiel. Maybe. The car was bought from an older lady that definitely did not have a lead foot so for most of it's life it's been babied, at least as far as I can tell. I have dealer records re the previous coolant flush, etc. Now - I do drive it like it's meant to be driven (spirited), but never EVER go too crazy, go anywhere near redline, and do not even attempt to do anything it's not designed to handle, etc. Plus I had it @ same dealer 1 yr ago prior to purchase and they said it was a beautiful specimen, tip-top, etc. Oh well, I guess that really doesn't matter now. I just have a big problem with one of the supposedly best cars made having a major component failure at 54,000 miles. Even asked that Q to the shop guy @ dealer and he had nothing to say. Unfortunately I guess what they all say about Jags is true. But I still love her soooo much that despite it all it's worth it...

Anyway, I will have my indy guy check her out and write back. Take care...