Originally Posted by YRS

Well, this turned into an interesting discussion about differences between models over the year. All that said, I've picked up my new to me F Type. Went with white over black again, as is my preference. It is a 450 R Dynamic with rear wheel drive. I purchased it from Greenville (SC) Land Rover (nee Jaguar, they dropped Jag...the GM and GSM were still grieving to their credit). The car has 2700 miles, has 52 months of Jag's warranty left, and it's also certified...so close to six years all in. Out the door for $68K. The dealership was great throughout the process...couldn't have been more professional. After two days of ownership, some observations compared to my 16 R Coupe. I definitely believe the steering is more dynamic and natural (RWD versus AWD) and one thing I've not heard mentioned is the new front end permits better over the road visibility. The difference isn't huge, but for me, noticeable. I like the sports seats in the new car more than my R's, simply fit me better although the side bolster takes a bit more effort to navigate when getting in. I don't see a real difference in handling or ride except for one key point (to me). I think jounce control is better in the new car...that "whoop" I'd feel going over a bump at speed seems much more controlled. I was surprised at how little difference I felt in power...once you get up to higher speeds the R definitely had more urge, but aside from that, feels pretty close. And I really do prefer the new dash -- full stop. Also, I was ambivalent about the car's wheels in photos, but once I saw them in the metal...love 'em. All that said, the car is much, much quieter. The pops and burbles are gone...that's a real loss. I does sound great once I get on it, but otherwise, pretty demure. A funny thing...which all the guys will understand. As we're driving home, my bride (who had no issue with this purchase, in fact supported me 100%) said she'd like to buy a new high-end watch...smart strategy...of course I couldn't say no Bottom line, am thrilled with the car. Did I say how damned gorgeous it is? Have a couple of photos but won't load past 90%, will try again later.

Originally Posted by YRS

Well, this turned into an interesting discussion about differences between models over the year. I was surprised at how little difference I felt in power...once you get up to higher speeds the R definitely had more urge, but aside from that, feels pretty close. And I really do prefer the new dash -- full stop.

Originally Posted by Slip_Angle

Yeah, sorry about that - my bad. Didn't mean to steal your thread. Congrats on the new car!! Let's see pics.

I'm genuinly surprised about your power comments. I thought the R was a massive upgrade in power and was planning to get a stage 1 VAP tune. I would love to hear more of your thoughts on this as you get to know the car better. It is my understanding that the P450 actually has 500hp/500 lb-ft torque for 10 seconds and then dials it back to 450hp/400lb-ft for 20 seconds in a cycle.. maybe that is why it doesn't feel like a big difference?? Did your R have 550 or 575hp?

Originally Posted by DMeister

That’s an interesting detail. Didn’t realize that. Where did you get that information?

Originally Posted by Portlander

The difference between the 444HP P450 and the 575HP R in the quarter is around 8 tenths of a second (12.4 to 11.6) which equates to approximately 8 car lengths which is considerable in the world of drag racing. You can be relentless in your quest for horsepower gains and quicker times but there will always be something out there faster which may lead to frustration but you can have a lot of fun trying. A stock P450 that magically increases its HP output to 500 for 10 seconds is news to me and seems more in line with a vehicle that has a bottle in the back.

Originally Posted by Portlander

Agree, but the 131 HP difference between the two is tremendous and the P450 does counter some of the disadvantage by being around 100 pounds lighter but can lose it back if it is the RWD variant due to traction limitations. Car & Driver did choose the P450 AWD as their pick when overall price and performance were considered and I am personally biased when it comes to Fuji White exteriors!

Originally Posted by AHarmlessDolphin

I have a ‘23 P450/awd and confirm the above comments.

The jump from stock to a stage 1 tune, regardless of 450 v 500hp estimates, really does wake up the experience as well as addresses several additional shortcomings (Auto-stop, detuned exhaust, cold start.)

I have not fully investigated the variations in suspension, but when attempting to order lowering springs last year VAP didn’t not have a solution for non-R models.

I am in the process of swapping out the factory 255/295s to 265/305s PS4 on style 1066 wheels. I found the factory rubber underwhelming in that it neither happy at 9/10th nor GT when it needed to be. I have the impression the compound on the R suffers similar challenges. I only mention this as you may find yourself, as me, “fixing” the difference before the rubber needs to be replaced.

Originally Posted by DMeister

Who we kidding here? 450hp on the street is more than enough. I’m pretty sure I personally would have been satisfied with a P450 power-wise.

Originally Posted by scm

But "more than enough" doesn't satiate the "wants".

Originally Posted by YRS

Well, this turned into an interesting discussion about differences between models over the year. All that said, I've picked up my new to me F Type. Went with white over black again, as is my preference. It is a 450 R Dynamic with rear wheel drive. I purchased it from Greenville (SC) Land Rover (nee Jaguar, they dropped Jag...the GM and GSM were still grieving to their credit). The car has 2700 miles, has 52 months of Jag's warranty left, and it's also certified...so close to six years all in. Out the door for $68K. The dealership was great throughout the process...couldn't have been more professional. After two days of ownership, some observations compared to my 16 R Coupe. I definitely believe the steering is more dynamic and natural (RWD versus AWD) and one thing I've not heard mentioned is the new front end permits better over the road visibility. The difference isn't huge, but for me, noticeable. I like the sports seats in the new car more than my R's, simply fit me better although the side bolster takes a bit more effort to navigate when getting in. I don't see a real difference in handling or ride except for one key point (to me). I think jounce control is better in the new car...that "whoop" I'd feel going over a bump at speed seems much more controlled. I was surprised at how little difference I felt in power...once you get up to higher speeds the R definitely had more urge, but aside from that, feels pretty close. And I really do prefer the new dash -- full stop. Also, I was ambivalent about the car's wheels in photos, but once I saw them in the metal...love 'em. All that said, the car is much, much quieter. The pops and burbles are gone...that's a real loss. I does sound great once I get on it, but otherwise, pretty demure. A funny thing...which all the guys will understand. As we're driving home, my bride (who had no issue with this purchase, in fact supported me 100%) said she'd like to buy a new high-end watch...smart strategy...of course I couldn't say no Bottom line, am thrilled with the car. Did I say how damned gorgeous it is? Have a couple of photos but won't load past 90%, will try again later.

Originally Posted by Slip_Angle

Having done the Stage 1 and taking into account the potential for warranty issues -- would you do it again?