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Flashing EML, now solid EML

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Old Mar 19, 2020 | 01:36 PM
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Default Flashing EML, now solid EML

Hi guys. Stay with me while I give you all the details so you can give the best answer.

2005 X, 62000 miles, Jag dealer serviced. Last serviced October 2019. During the 50,000 mile service I was advised by the dealer that I had a small oil leak at the oil pan gasket. As you know this is expensive to replace due to the location of that one bolt. Dealer said I was OK keeping an eye on it and checking oil often. I keep a large piece of cardboard under the car to monitor it and it loses about 2-3 drops per week from the oil pan area. I add oil as needed.

Last service in October 2019 I had to have one O2 sensor replaced. While there they also told me there was a small oil leak around the timing cover. I did not get it replaced but I do watch it and it looks like a drop or two per week is showing up. Much smaller than the oil pan gasket, which itself is not much. Again I check the oil weekly and top off as needed, generally keeping it at or just below MAX at all times.

Two days ago I was running an errand, on roads with a max speed of 40 MPH. Seemed like the car was not running smoothly, maybe stuttered a little. No warning lights or anything and I drove it home. Today I took it out and it seemed fine for the first few miles, never going over 40 MPH. Turned onto a highway with a 55 MPH limit and once I got about 45 the EML started flashing, which I have never seen before. After about 10 seconds it turned solid. Stopped car, turned off engine. Checked gas cap, as I have had multiple instances of that setting off the EML. Returned to car and stared engine, EML was gone. Decided to take car home and on the way, and once again when I got about 45 MPH the process repeated itself. Ten seconds of flashing followed by a solid EML. Got home and turned engine off. Waited about two minutes and restarted, now the EML is solid.

I do not have a code reader, I have always used a local parts shop for that but not sure if I should even drive the car over there. I understand that a flashing light is bad, but what would cause it to flash and then go to solid, then off, then flash and go to solid, now on all the time apparently? Catalytic converter failure? I only drove it a total of less than 4 miles from the time of the first flashing light until I got home and part of that time there were no lights at all. Only two occurrences of a flashing EML, each lasting about 10 seconds followed by a solid EML light.

As always appreciate your suggestions, guidance and advice. Thanks! PS-Stay safe out there.
 
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Old Mar 19, 2020 | 03:02 PM
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I would not recommend a lot of driving but you should be able to safely drive it to get the codes read. Without the codes we would be just guessing and that never has a good conclusion..
Get the codes and get back to us.
 
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Old Mar 19, 2020 | 03:06 PM
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You have a misfire somewhere, possibly caused by a bad coil or maybe a spark plug that is fouled. Could be other things as well. Possibly the intake gaskets are leaking. Would have to get it scanned to know what cylinder is misfiring. and where to start looking.
 
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Old Mar 19, 2020 | 03:45 PM
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Thanks. If the consensus is that I should drive it to get the codes I will do that tomorrow. Not a good time to be out driving around but I will give it a shot. Thanks
 
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Old Mar 19, 2020 | 04:08 PM
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Flashing MIL = actual cat damage occurring as it flashes.

The usual advice is not to drive at all like that as the repair may be horrifically costly.
 
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Old Mar 19, 2020 | 07:15 PM
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tarheel, take it easy on the car and find a local auto parts store that is not too far away. From the sounds of things, you are going to find that you have one or more of the following codes: P0300, P0301, P0303, and/or P0305 (misfires on the associated cylinders). These will also be associated with a P1316 code (conditions that can lead to cat damage/failure). if this is the case, odds are, you have a plug well or two that has oil in it and this is causing that cylinder to misfire. With the mileage on the car, I would say to do a plug change unless the dealer just did it with the 50K mile service (shouldn't have, but they do silly things like that saying you need it done). Probably a good idea to also get a set of upper intake gaskets at a minimum. These gaskets are like $20 at the local auto parts store (if they say that they don't have them, ask them for the gaskets of an 05 Lincoln LS with the 3.0L engine, I bet they have these, same part). From here, it is just a matter of doing a plug change and seeing what you have. If you find a plug well full of oil, you may want to consider doing a valve cover gasket replacement which will also replace the gaskets around the plug wells and is just a few more bolts from where you are with the plug change.

If you need more info, let me know.
 
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 11:06 AM
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Here are the codes:

P0174 System Too Lean (Bank 2)
P0171 System Too Lean (Bank 1)
P0301 Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected
P1313 Misfire Rate Catalyst Damage Fault - Bank 1
P0301 Cylinder 1 Misfire Detected
P1313 Misfire Rate Catalyst Damage Fault - Bank 1
P1316 Misfire Rate Exceeds Emissions
P1111 System Pass

On the way to the auto shop the EML remained steady excepts for two brief periods. While I never exceed 40 MPH I did have to accelerate from a stop at intersections and twice the EML started to blink when I did. I immediately backed off the gas and the light went back to solid. Perhaps that accounts for the double P0301/P1313 fault code reading? Total mileage was around six miles.

The auto shop suggested it might be a bad plug(s). From the maintenance schedule it looks like spark plug replacement is scheduled for 70,000 miles. As best I can tell they have never been changed. Would this be a place to start? I have changed plugs in other cars but never touched the Jag. Is it one of those jobs that would require removing half of the engine bay to accomplish, like most everything else on this car?

As always, thanks for the advice

UPDATE: I went back and looked at service records. In June 2017 at 51236 miles, the EML came on . Codes were P0300, P0301, P0302, P0303, P0304, P0305 P0306 P1316 P0455. Took the car to Jag dealer and they cleared codes and started car and no EML. They test drove car and keep it for two days and could not get codes to reappear They did find the lead in the oil pan gasket at that time. They did a 50k service but did not change plugs. The codes never came back. I do not remember the car running poorly, just that the EML popped on. I got it read and took the car in for service.
 

Last edited by tarheel72; Mar 20, 2020 at 11:26 AM.
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 11:09 AM
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duplicate post
 

Last edited by tarheel72; Mar 20, 2020 at 11:12 AM.
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 11:11 AM
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Thanks Chris, just read your reply. Now that I have posted the codes does that change your advice?
 
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Thermo
tarheel, take it easy on the car and find a local auto parts store that is not too far away. From the sounds of things, you are going to find that you have one or more of the following codes: P0300, P0301, P0303, and/or P0305 (misfires on the associated cylinders). These will also be associated with a P1316 code (conditions that can lead to cat damage/failure). if this is the case, odds are, you have a plug well or two that has oil in it and this is causing that cylinder to misfire. With the mileage on the car, I would say to do a plug change unless the dealer just did it with the 50K mile service (shouldn't have, but they do silly things like that saying you need it done). Probably a good idea to also get a set of upper intake gaskets at a minimum. These gaskets are like $20 at the local auto parts store (if they say that they don't have them, ask them for the gaskets of an 05 Lincoln LS with the 3.0L engine, I bet they have these, same part). From here, it is just a matter of doing a plug change and seeing what you have. If you find a plug well full of oil, you may want to consider doing a valve cover gasket replacement which will also replace the gaskets around the plug wells and is just a few more bolts from where you are with the plug change.

If you need more info, let me know.
Thanks Chris, just read your reply. Now that I have posted the codes does that change your advice?
 
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 12:19 PM
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P0171 and P0174 are generally signs of a vacuum leak. Check the "Big Three" , brake booster hoes, IMT O-rings, PCV hose. Still heed Thermo's advice on the misfire. Am guessing you need plugs and need to change the manifold gaskets. Whatever the exact cuse is, it needs to be addressed quickly.
 
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Alfadude
P0171 and P0174 are generally signs of a vacuum leak. Check the "Big Three" , brake booster hoes, IMT O-rings, PCV hose. Still heed Thermo's advice on the misfire. Am guessing you need plugs and need to change the manifold gaskets. Whatever the exact cuse is, it needs to be addressed quickly.
Thanks for the advice. Looks like I will be looking at YouTube videos shortly.
 
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 07:43 PM
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tarheel, before you rip the motor apart, I would be first checking the PCV hose. If you have the smooth hose, then definitely replace that. I am fairly sure that if you have a smooth hose there, that you are going to find that on the underside, that hose has a large split in it. That may be the source of all your problems. Do not just look at the hose. You need to pull it out and turn it over. The split is on the under side and is very hard to see and/or feel. if you have the ribbed hose, then I would be doing a quick look at your intake tubing to see if you have any rips in it. May want to even contemplate starting up the car, letting it idle and then using some starter fluid to spray the length of the intake. If the engine RPMs pick up, you are really close to the vacuum leak. Because you have both P0171 and P0174, this is telling me that it is either the PCV hose or you have a problem near the throttle body (or throttle body to intake filter). If you find the vacuum leak and fix it, but the P0301 codes continue, then I would be looking at changing plugs and the gaskets. For the few extra dollars, it will save you a lot of time since you will be really close to all of this stuff already.
 
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Old Mar 20, 2020 | 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Thermo
tarheel, before you rip the motor apart, I would be first checking the PCV hose. If you have the smooth hose, then definitely replace that. I am fairly sure that if you have a smooth hose there, that you are going to find that on the underside, that hose has a large split in it. That may be the source of all your problems. Do not just look at the hose. You need to pull it out and turn it over. The split is on the under side and is very hard to see and/or feel. if you have the ribbed hose, then I would be doing a quick look at your intake tubing to see if you have any rips in it. May want to even contemplate starting up the car, letting it idle and then using some starter fluid to spray the length of the intake. If the engine RPMs pick up, you are really close to the vacuum leak. Because you have both P0171 and P0174, this is telling me that it is either the PCV hose or you have a problem near the throttle body (or throttle body to intake filter). If you find the vacuum leak and fix it, but the P0301 codes continue, then I would be looking at changing plugs and the gaskets. For the few extra dollars, it will save you a lot of time since you will be really close to all of this stuff already.
I see a lot of YouTube in my weekend. Thank Chris.
 
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Old Mar 21, 2020 | 06:42 AM
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tarheel, inspecting this hose is easy. Remove the plastic cover off of the engine. Look next to the throttlebody. You will see a black hose about the diameter of your thumb. The whole hose is about 8 inches long. The end nearest you will be connected to a 90 degree plastic piece (this piece is your PCV valve). You can pull the hose off of that and then follow it to the other end (this will be the manifold) and pull straight towards you. It should pull off with a little resistance. Roll the tube to look at the underside.

If you look back on the engine, you will see where there is a bracket there that supports the tube and causes it to bend slightly upwards (towards the hood/bonnet). It is at this point that the tube normally splits.

As for the spark plugs, there are tons of videos out there for doing this. Not a hard job, but it will take a few hours. Wish you were closer to me as I would tell you to come over and we could do it in no time flat.
 
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Old Mar 21, 2020 | 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Thermo
tarheel, inspecting this hose is easy. Remove the plastic cover off of the engine. Look next to the throttlebody. You will see a black hose about the diameter of your thumb. The whole hose is about 8 inches long. The end nearest you will be connected to a 90 degree plastic piece (this piece is your PCV valve). You can pull the hose off of that and then follow it to the other end (this will be the manifold) and pull straight towards you. It should pull off with a little resistance. Roll the tube to look at the underside.

If you look back on the engine, you will see where there is a bracket there that supports the tube and causes it to bend slightly upwards (towards the hood/bonnet). It is at this point that the tube normally splits.

As for the spark plugs, there are tons of videos out there for doing this. Not a hard job, but it will take a few hours. Wish you were closer to me as I would tell you to come over and we could do it in no time flat.
My PVC hose is smooth and I will take it off this morning and check it out.Regardless I will replace it with the ribbed version. I doubt that AutoZone has that part in stock. Is there a Lincoln part number that I can use? Otherwise I will have to venture out at a much later date to the Jag dealer and at any moment we could go under lockdown, making that problematic. PS - no engine cover on my 2005 model.
 
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Old Mar 21, 2020 | 04:54 PM
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Think the part number you are looking for is c2s40863
Readily available. Rock Auto etc.

Check out my post from around a month ago. Lots of parts numbers for the work I had done on my car.
Plugs, gaskets, coil pack and a like.

Always listen to Thermo....and everyone else but Chris for sure.

Oh yeah, if you own a X-type go buy a code reader. There is a whole thread on which ones to buy.

 
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Old Mar 21, 2020 | 06:28 PM
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tarheels, for the moment, just take off the hose, go to your local auto parts store and get some similarly sized vacuum hose. That will get you by for a bit. Then you can order the correct part as needed. You can try asking them if they have the PCV hose for a Lincoln LS. They may or may not. hard to say. But, it would atleast be worth a try. Worst case, you take off your current hose and when you go to pick up the new hose, compare and see if they are similar. if they are not, then don't buy it.
 
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Old Mar 21, 2020 | 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Thermo
tarheels, for the moment, just take off the hose, go to your local auto parts store and get some similarly sized vacuum hose. That will get you by for a bit. Then you can order the correct part as needed. You can try asking them if they have the PCV hose for a Lincoln LS. They may or may not. hard to say. But, it would at-least be worth a try. Worst case, you take off your current hose and when you go to pick up the new hose, compare and see if they are similar. if they are not, then don't buy it.
Ordered the part online but have to check on delivery. Looks like the company is in NJ so my money may be down the toilet. $50 at local Jag dealer with three day delivery, $21 online. Probably should have gone with dealer, No one local stocks it. Shot in the dark. Hose looked OK no obvious cracks but decided to replace anyway. Flying by the seat of my pants here. I will be shocked if that is the reason for the codes. I have a feeling this car will never see the road again.
 
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Old Mar 22, 2020 | 04:59 AM
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Relax 72, this should not be an end life for your car. The forum is full of this stuff.
Vacuum and spark should be the issue. Following the steps people are outlining and all will be well.
I just did all the same stuff last month. My 2007 is running better then ever.

When I ordered all my parts the PVC valve and fuel filter could not be sourced locally as well.



 
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