Hi Guys:

Following on with the well documented ride quality that many consider to be much too firm, I was also one of those people.

Anyway, for some time, I was looking at upgrading my 19"s to 20"s, purely from a 'looks' point of view. Of course, I was concerned that larger wheels/tires would make the ride even worse than it was with the 19s but I took a chance and got a pleasant surprise!

I bought some new 20" Polished Kasuga wheels and outfitted them with Continental Extreme Contact Summer Tires. Found the tires on tirerack.com at a great price. Living in Florida, we don't have any cold weather to deal with, so summer tires are fine for me.

I went through the owner comments and surveys on tirerack.com and these tires scored very well in all regards and particularly well in ride comfort, so I thought I would take a chance. After all, how much harder could the ride be with 20s over 19s?

To my surprise, the ride was noticeably softer than with the original 19" factory wheels and tires. The roads where I live are all in fairly good condition but, nevertheless, the improvement in ride quality is still very noticeable.

Of course, I am not suggesting that anyone rushes out to buy these tires or that they will work for you but, for me, the cost was worth every penny not only for the improvement in ride but the polished Kasugas look absolutely stunning!!

All the best.

Roger

 

Very good news and surprising, as well.

I'm still fighting the ride issue with my XJL. As of now I hate to drive that car, given the frequent vibration issues as the suspension reacts to otherwise smooth road surfaces. I never had a car in my life that bothered me so much during freeway driving.

I already purchased a new set of tires to no avail. Not sure if I want to invest in new wheels and tires now, since this is a lease car and there is no way I would purchase an other one, unless the dealer can fix this one. But, they claim that the ride is "normal". I can't believe it as I suspect not too many people would take up with such near constant vibrations from any car, even a cheap one.

Glad your wheel/tire change improved you ride. I love everything about this car except can't stand driving it.

Albert

 

Roger

Could you describe what bothered you with the ride before you changed wheels and tires?

After the dealer declaring my ride "normal" for the 4th service attempt, I am starting to doubt my sanity. What I do find abnormal is the slight but persistent kickbacks and vibrations coming through the chassis at, at least, 50 percent of my freeway driving speeds (70 MPH).

Some people might accept such ride, including my wife, as little she has driven it. She feels the near constant vibrations and asks me if it is normal? My answer is; no way it is normal, not in a car of this caliber or even in the cheapest car on the market. I got much better ride from that Hyundai Sonata that the dealership provided as a loaner.

Most frustrating issue. Certainly not looking forward to driving this car with those issues 'till the end of my lease in 2 years. I would trade it in a heartbeat if it was not to the terrible bath I would have to take to break the lease.

Albert

 

Albert.... I can't say I have much (if any) 'vibration' but always felt that the ride was too 'firm'. The new wheels/tires have made a big improvement and the ride is now quite acceptable.

Mine is also a lease, with 2 years to go, but I figured, at the end of the lease, I will just put the original 19s back on and sell my Kasuga wheels and tires. I found the wheels at a bargain basement price, so figure that I should get at least half of my cost back at the end of the lease. At that price, it was well worth it for the softer ride alone but, add to that the looks of the polished 20" Kasugas and I consider the relatively small investment a bargain!

Albert, where are you in CA? I live in FL but I may be in Los Angeles in November and, if I am, could come by and drive your car to compare, assuming you are reasonably close to Los Angeles.

You may be interested to know that I have owned/leased many high end cars up to and including 2 Rolls Royces. I love all my cars but, often, after 6 months to a year I am wondering what to get next. The XJL is the first car I have had where, 12 months on, I would absolutely get the same car again. I love it!

Best regards,

Roger

 

Roger

Thanks for the offer but, we live about 400 miles north of LA in the Sierra foothills, just above Sacramento. You're welcome to stop by and visit if your trip takes you this far north.

I will try the 18" wheels and tires off my wife's XF and see if that makes a difference. The XJL would be a car that I could see getting again at the end of the lease - only if it had a ride that I could live with. I very much suspect the dampers as the cause for the vibration. Even on nearly perfect new road surfaces they are failing to dampen out the road texture. All my other cars are fine, except the one I would expect to give me the most sophisticated ride. When the car was new, I had the same complaints. Then, they found a code in the car for a damper failure, replaced a rear unit and the ride improved where I had no issues for 5K miles. Just recently the issues surfaced again. No codes this time.

Albert

 

I still haven't been able to figure out why, but i have had similar experiences.

The first vehicle was Excursion, went from 16" to 18". The second one was my LS, from 17" to 18" and the ride on both significantly improved.

 

So Albert, I've taken a bit more care to note the ride in my car. When the car is cold and sitting for some time, I feel a slight vibration through the wheel and seat. However, it disappears when the car gets warmed up and the ride is great. My previous comments on feeling the vibration were probably skewed by the fact that I have less than a 5 mile commute to the office and the car is cold for the whole trip.

Another data point. I had the pleasure of driving a 2012 XJ Supersport at the Top Gear Test track and though a small slalom course. The ride was smooth and quiet. Very comfortable. I had just finished with both the V6 S and V8 S of the new F-Type, so the smooth and comfortable ride was quite apparent. The F-Types were the highlight of the drive, but that's a topic of another post. During this visit to UK, I was driven in a BMW 7 and Mercedes S. I have the say I preferred the Jag ride the best.

The XJ has a great, quiet ride. If you are so dissatisfied, you probably have a dud.

 

Yes, the cold tire deformation issue is normal. That is not my problem. You probably would not notice my issues during a 5 miles commute or a short test drive during the event. I myself did not pick up on it during my short 5 miles test drive. However, following a few dozen miles into our very first long drive from the dealer to home, it was quite evident.

My commute is about 150 mostly freeway miles. It almost always seems to get worse as the distance and time increases. That makes me think that it is heat related, such as the damper oil temperature increases and changes the damping rates or, more or less loosing control over the damping at those temperatures. Not sure what else to think.

I know, I probably do have a dud. Now, if I could only have the dealer service "recognize" it and do something about it. The ride of my car is just the opposite from what you are describing; every single other (cheap or expensive) car drives and rides better than my XJL. When I test drove the V8 F-type I could not stop saying how much smoother and calmer it rode compared to my car. It is somewhat maddening having to hate driving a car that supposed to be a top of the line luxury saloon.

Most other reports that I have read thus far said that the F-type had the roughest ride of the Jaguar line. Hah... they have not tried my car... My car's suspension is basically never relaxes. There are constant inputs, vibrations coming through the chassis, as if the tire(s) would be ever slightly out of balance. Feels like as if a wheel or wheels would get into oscillation just due to regular smooth pavement texture (worst are the new blacktop surfaces with still rough surface textures) which the dampers can not dampen out. Since the chassis is always "nervous" and never relaxes, I can never relax in that car. Which is why after 2.5 - 3 hours driving I'm just disgusted and worn out. What a wasted 1-year ownership with 2 more years that I am not looking forward to with this car. Needless to say I purchased this car exactly for its expected great long distance ride, which is what I use it for.

Albert

 

Hey mate, I've got to ask...how did you get the opportunity to drive the XJ Supersport on the Top Gear test track along ith the F-Type?

 

Not to hijack this thread, but it was Jaguar driving event at the Dunsfold Aerodome, where the top gear test track is. We drove on a modified version as having cars drive in the figure 8 configuration simultaneously would be asking for trouble.

The course started at Chicago and went through hammerhead. Instead of followthrough we went straight with a chicane to slow the cars down (otherwise we would have got to 150+ MPH) Backwards though gambon and the second last corner and then onto chicago again. Even with the shortened straights we got to around 120 MPH.

We were encouraged to drive the cars hard and had pro drivers with us. Full on throttle and hard on the brakes. It was great way to drive the cars.

I never get a chance to drive my car like that on the streets. It really showed what the cars can do. The XJ SS was absolutely brilliant for a car of it's size. The F Type was the most fun and the XF-R was a beast with some comfort and practicality (A top pick if you had some roads to really push the car and had to use it every day).

Will try to post a couple pics if I get a chance

 

Some pictures from the event

 

Hey mate, thanks for the response and I love the pics above...feel like Im right there. Not to keep on hijacking this thread, but how were you able to attend the driving event in the first place? I see that you are in Virginia, right? So to get an opportunity and drive on the Top Gear track in the UK is definitely something special and I was just wondering if you won a Jag sweepstakes or if there was another way to get it! :-)

 

We've had Continental Extreme Contact DWS tires in the past and they were absolutely outstanding tires on the 2005 XJL we previously owned.

Currently we have crappy Pirelli's that are hard and noisy...and once enough of the life is gone we will be replacing them with the Continental's. I am sure the ride will improve quite a bit.

 

Finally a week ago I switched wheels/tires between the 2012 XF and the XJL. Both tires are the exact same sidewall-height but, the XF tires are a full 1" smaller in diameter. Hardly noticeable on the XJL, on the other hand, the larger tires make the XF look very muscle-bound.

This week I put about 300 miles on the XJL. Heading up to the High Sierras we encountered some of the worst rough, winter-textured surfaces with expansions joints running across every 10 feet, or so. Terrible surfaces for any suspension to deal with.

The good news is that the ride of the XJL with the XF's Conti tires is now quite acceptable. I will not go far enough to say that it is excellent as Jaguar obviously has made mistakes with the suspension calibration. They tried to correct it for 2013 with different spring-rates and dampers and I had recently seen a thread on this forum which claimed that Jaguar will adjust the rear suspension again for 2014 for "better passenger comfort".

So, the ride was OK through the real bad surfaces at the snow elevations, was fine on normal roads and was right down excellent on some long deserted, unused roads with excellent surfaces.

So, what did I learn? I changed the stock Pirellis at 2700 miles to the Hankook Ventus V12. I chose the Hankook because they worked very nicely on my XK for 2 years and 10K miles. Initially, following the tire changes I was just as content as I am now with the Contis. But, about 7K miles and 10 months later the ride deteriorated to the point that I had oscillating vibrations coming through the chassis when riding over some blacktop surfaces. Now, that I gave the car a set of fresh tires that had only 2K miles and were driven very carefully by my wife, the car's ride is once again acceptable. I think that the ride got worse as the tires aged and their rubber had become harder and harsher. What I also think is that the XJL's ride is more susceptible to tire sidewall quality than the XK was, where I did not have a similar issue with older tires of the same model and brand. Also, the same Hankook tires that caused all that nasty vibrations on the XJL are seemingly working fine on the XF with no irritating vibrations.

I hope that I will not have to change tires every 10 months and 7K miles just to have an acceptable ride out of my XJL. I'm actually considering leaving the 18" XF wheels on the XJL but change the tires to the 245/50 size that would provide an additional 0.5" sidewall for even better flex while matching exactly the original 19" tire diameters.

So, I am glad that the problem was identified with the tires. Now, I am once again truly enjoying the car. Just hope that the ride quality lasts. I thank everyone with tips and advice regarding this issue.

Albert

 

Very glad to hear you were able to identify tires as the problem. While your wheel swap indicates that the XJ's ride may be super sensitive to modest tire age and mileage, and the XF isn't, I suppose there could be something just as odd related to changing the tire's size and sidewall happening that just doesn't affect the XF. Some sort of weird harmonic vibration affected by sidewall flex, tread depth, or elasticity...who knows? Should you mess with success by increasing the XF tire diameters in case it somehow throws off the ride again? Might be better to leave well enough alone unless ride quality goes off again as those tires age.

Bruce

 

You read my mind there. While I would love to step up the ride quality one more notch in order to gain that ultimately silky ride that Jaguar XJs were known for years past, I'm not confident that I could get there. The smallest I could go with the wheels, due to the front brake sizes, is 18" which limits me to 50 series tires. The truly silky ride from the older XJs were on 60 and 65 series tires on 16" or smaller wheels. That is where you would get those slightly rounded sidewalls which do wonders for the ride while still providing pretty decent handling. I won the autocross championship on 60 series tires so I know what they are capable of, handling wise.

It is likely a good advice not to fight success and just stay with what is working now. I love this car enough that if I could maintain the present ride quality I would definitely consider it again at the end of my lease, maybe even a straight purchase of this very car.

We stayed at one of Lake Tahoe's very exclusive Incline Village Hotels where my XJL was once again placed in a premier display position by the valet parking crew. It was fun to over-hear several passerby comments about how great the Jaguar looked. No doubt, it was once again the best looking car on the lot full of expensive machinery.

Albert

 

I'm surprised that the ride was that sensitive to mildly worn tires. I hope it works out for you on the tire change. Although, I think the 20" rims look great on my car, I do agree that the low profile tires that come with them, compromise ride quality. The tire fitment is also staggered, which limits tire choice.

I will have to change my tires soon as the car came with summer tires and we do get a month or two of close to freezing temps and occasional snow. The summer rubber gets too hard at cold temps to work well. Probably have to switch them with less than 5000 miles on them.

Will go with rscuthlo's recommendation of the Continental DWS tires. Any here interested in a lightly used set of Dunlop Sport Maxx GTs?

 

PM'd you on these.

 

Glad to hear it sounds like you have finally found the problem Albert. For what it's worth I found the ride quality and noise of my original Dunlop Sport Maxx GT's went away at around 9000 miles. I have been following your posts for a while and have been trying see if I could detect a similar vibration even though I have 20 inch wheels. I could not detect any vibration but the noise made me finally give in at 14000 miles and get new tires. I put the Conti Extreme Contact DWS on and 2000 miles later I can't be happier. The ride is smoother and extremely quiet.

 

I'm glad you got the big improvement out of the Contis. From the small sample on this thread it appears that the XJs are very sensitive to tire quality and tire aging. I've never had an other car that would change its ride characteristics so much with relatively low mileage tires. Perhaps, that is what Jaguar is attempting to eliminate with its repeated retuning of the XJ suspension.

Like I said, the tires that gave me problems on the XJL after 7K miles, are working fine on the XF.

Albert