Guys,

I found this on another thread yesterday. It basically states that Pennzoil Ultra Platinum is 925A compliant even though it does not say it on the bottle. What do you think? To me this means that 945A is okay.

Am I missing something?

 

That is how I am reading it, that 945A is okay. Its certainly pretty damn official looking.

I got so fed up with trying to find oil that i just went to the dealer and bought a few quarts. it was cheaper than the same weight synthetics at Autozone and the like.

 

I would of bought the oil if I could find it anywhere. Its really a PITA to find it around here and the dealer told me to bring a container. I feel really dumb going to the dealer with a milk carton for my oil. HAHA.

It is possible that someone faked that thing. It looked pretty legit but I don't claim any owner ship of it. I have a 2011 XJL with 79K mile. I just change my oil with Mobile One Annual. We shall see what happens.

 

I don't see any reference to the 945A standard in the letter so I wouldn't assume that oil meeting the 945 standard is suitable. Pennzoil does meet the 925 standard though which is what's required for the engines needing 5W-20.

 

I felt the same way. I drove into the service area and was like, "this sounds ridiculous, but i cant find this damn oil anywhere." He just tells me no problem, we have it here, how many quarts? I was genuinely surprised because who ever thinks to go to a dealership for oil? Tho telling you to just bring a jug is a little weird.

I looked up the specs on Ultra Platinum 5W20, and thats where it refers to the 945A standard. The letter refers to "above product", which is UP 5W20, so that seems like it checks out. It also refers to that STJLR.03.5004, no idea what this is tho.

https://www.pennzoil.com/en_us/produ...-platinum.html

https://www.pennzoil.com/en_us/produ...inum-5W-20.pdf (PDF download)

 

Ah, I see. Honestly, I would never try and go the route of using the lists of specs an oil meets to infer that it meets other specs that aren't listed. In this instance it's very simple. The Pennzoil UP 5W-20 met the spec of the Ford 925 and the JLR spec equivalent back in 2015 (that that certification was good for 2 years). I don't know if it still does but it's what I use in my 2012 and it's what the Jaguar dealership used back in 2017. It's about $25 a gallon on Walmart.com so it's a no brainer for me.

 

FWIW: I'm pasting from another thread here (BTW Liquid Moly on amazon meets this spec )

Why you should only use Castrol Edge WSS-m2c925A

Posted by Member “Queen and Country” from the UK on the F-Type Forum 02-22-2019

“Jaguar has a Patent on the cam mechanism that not a lot of folks know about. It even licenses this technology to Ford.
https://patents.google.com/patent/US7841310B2/en
Basically if you open an engine from a regular car or even previous Jaguar's, you will find that oil naturally cooks on to many surfaces.
But it does not matter. These engines are fairly low tech when it comes to oil.

Your Jaguar engine get amazing performance (low end torque) by doing things with oil that no other manufacturer does.
It’s like a Swiss watch of delicate parts. The patent above is for a small pin that slides in and out. Oil moves this pin. No other engine in the world other than JLR and Ford have it.
What do you thing will happen if you use oil that cooks quickly (becomes coke). Where after you turn the engine off you have heat soak.

Your engine is not built the same as other engines.
It needs just 3 things from the oil.
1. Good cleaning abilities
2. Ability to clean after long term use.
3. Not leave too much deposit.
Now you can become an engineer and figure out the perfect oil, or just use the one their engineers already blended. (WSS-m2c925A)”

Also posted by Q and C

“I can explain it in a simple way.
In other cars oil is used for lubrication, cleaning and cooling only.
In our cars it’s also used for controlling the timing of the engine.”

Lastly, in the owner’s manual it reads “Castrol is "recommended" oil. WSS-m2c925A is the REQUIRED spec oil.

 

Pennzoil DOES NOT meet the Jaguar oil spec!

I am currently fighting my dealer on this and if it does NOT have it on the label then that oil does NOT meet WSS-M2C925A.
It DOES meet WSS-M2C945-A. These are NOT the same. And no they do not cross match as no one in Jaguar or Castrol or Pennzoil says it does.

People have been assuming 925 and 945 are the same and they might be close but again no one with any skin in this game has come out in print to verify this.
It's just a guess.

So please post any real documentation and we can go from there. Not hand waving and assuming.
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Did you see the attached letter in the first post from Jaguar Land Rover to Shell stating that "Based on the data submitted we confirm that the above product (Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5W-20) meets the requirements of Jaguar Land Rover engine oil specification STJLR.03.5004 for use in all Jaguar Land Rover vehicles where STJLR.03.5004 or WSS-M2C925A is specified"? This approval was issued in 2015 and lasted for 2 years so it may no longer be valid but it was from 2015 to 2017.

 

Madman's post has an attachment with a letter from JLR to Pennzoil indicating their oil does meet the necessary standard (at least at the time it did). Its more than an assumption.

But im not understanding how something can meet the standard for a time period, and then no longer. If it met in from '15-17, what changed in '18 that it no longer meets it? If the formulas didnt change and the car obviously didnt change, what makes it no longer "safe"?

 

I've attached 2 PDFs that conclusively prove that Pennzoil Ultra Platinum does NOT have the WSS-M2C925A spec but does have the STJLR.03.5004 spec

 

So now i am thoroughly confused. The letter from JLR seems to indicate, at least how im reading it, that as long as the oil you are using meets EITHER 925A or 5004, it is safe to use. But if that is true, how can the UP 5W20 meet one spec and not the other?

This is, by far, the most research i have ever done into oil weight specs.

 

Hank I don't see any 5L engines in the JLR sheet nor do I see the M2C925A spec in the Pennzoil sheet.

 

I see what you are saying now. That 5004 spec sheet does not mention the 5.0s at all. It is curious though reading that letter, because it seems to contradict Shell's own data.

The letter indicates that anywhere 925A/5004 is specified, that UP5W20 meets the requirements.

Maybe i just dont understand what the STJLR.03.5004 standard is, and how it is different than 925A.

 

So I found tthis on a Land Rover forum on the recommended oil for 2015 JLR​​​​​​​

 

You are absolutely correct, the engine type is not mentioned anywhere on the letter from JLR to Shell. What it says is "meets the requirements of Jaguar Land Rover engine oil specification STJLR.03.5004 for use in all Jaguar Land Rover vehicles where STJLR.03.5004 or WSS-M2C925A is specified".

My owners manual says to use 5W-20 oil meeting the requirements of WSS-M2C925A. So I'm good to go (or was until 2017). Since my engine hadn't changed, and I haven't seen anything from JLR regarding changing the oil type for my model year, I took the chance that the oil hadn't changed. I first decided to go with the Pennzoil UP after I spoke with the Jaguar dealer in Houston who told me that they used Pennzoil UP when doing oil changes. You pays your money and you takes your choice.

 

No I did not and thank you very much for posting that! Finally something in writing from Jaguar that totally invalidates the Castrol magic juice claim!
So when will Jaguar stop telling us to use only Castrol oil?

That's the part I am calling BS. Any modern 0w-20 or 5w-20 oil is more than adequate.
It's just an engine. Big Will has over 100K on his XFR and uses Walmart Synthetic oil. No tensioner problems and he drives it hard. So will Jaguar come out and OK the Walmart oil?

Plus this letter only gives the 5W-20 oil as OK. My dealer put in 0W-20. So do we need another letter to tell us that oil is OK too? Or do we just assume (again) that they are the same?

It's just a cluster caused 100% by Jaguar's phony marketing spiel.
The customers are the ones paying for this confusion and that's just wrong. Be honest will us and admit Castrol is simply marketing BS or hold a hard line and insist Castrol only?
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Yep, I've mentioned it a few times but I have done all the oil changes on my old XFR and on my F-Type (by my reckoning 6 or 7 changes) and I have NEVER used Castrol oil, and I have never had a single engine problem on either car. Nothing zip zilch zero nada.
I have used only Aussie brand oils Penrite and Nulon and only 5W-20 never 0W-20. Both oils claim to meet the Ford WSS M2C945-A spec, which after mucho research I am convinced replaced WSS M2C925-A three or four years ago and exceeds that standard.
Yes, when the AJ133 first came out in 2009 the special Castrol Unobtainium brew was the only oil which met the spec but a few years later many many oils met the spec and JLR still insisting on the Castrol brew is pure marketing BS.

 

I've never been an adherent that because the oil cap says Jag "recommends" Castrol that it is the only oil. There ARE other mc925a oils, ie that meet the REQUIREMENT of Jaguar. Just because somebody SAYS that they know of a guy who said that 945 REPLACES it, I wouldn't put it in MY engine. Synthetic BLENDS meet 945, while 925 is pure synthetic. The 925 oil is specified for this car, and 925 it shall have.

 

The 945 oils I have used for many years now ARE full/pure synthetic and there are heaps more out there.
And as I have pointed out on other threads (XF and F-Type included) I have never read or heard of a single instance of 945 oil causing a problem in any AJ133 or AJ126 engine, as long as it was full synthetic and 5W-20 or 0W-20.