Brutal,
You said all 2011 XJs don't have the roof popping, creaking issues. I don't believe it. I had my 1st xjl low vin i bought 2 yrs ago in June, it was brought in 4x for repairs, 1st the popping on twists , driveways , turns etc.
then the front electric sunshade made a loud noise popped off the track and was stuck open.
after 4 attempts they gave me a brand new car it's been in 4 x for the same roof issues and now after the 4th attempt again the rear sunshade just made a loud crash popped off the track and is stuck in the open position. the motor just spins nothing happens.
After looking with a flaslight in between those plastic pieces around the back glass I see rubber tape spacers or something , they look like square black tape and i saw some grey foam in there.
My qustion is is that the fix? and How can that be coincidental that I have the same exact issues in 2 separate cars?
Thank You.

 

I think it would have been better to say

"I find this hard to believe based on my own experience"

It is quite possible for faults in new car designs to be found only in some of the production. This can be production line issues or a bad batch of parts, which do not necessarily get installed on contiguous VIN numbers, hence can be difficult to trace when the complaints start coming through.

There is a lovely story of the early 60s when Jaguar had recently taken over Daimler, and were making the Daimler-designed 2.5 litre V8 engine for a variant of the Mark 2. Some engines were coming back with cracked main bearing caps. There was no pattern to it, so engineers decided to walk around the engine production line to see what was going on. One fitter was found to be using a lead-headed hammer to tap the end of the crankshaft, so he could measure up for the correct thrust washer thickness, and was ocasionally tapping too hard, thus cracking the caps.

 

Another example I know to be true because I was involved. There was an epidemic of broken cranks on military Land Rovers.
As part of the QC all cranks destined for MoD use were crack tested (soaking in a fluorescent dye + examined under UV light).
We eventually got round to testing the eyesight of the crack testers and it turned out that when someone's eyesight got too bad to work on the production line the shop steward had him moved to crack testing on the grounds that you didn't need to see in the dark.....

 

With all of the time and energy...and frustration and stress...that you spend hating your car, why don't you just cut your losses and get rid of it?

 

yes not all have issues and then many customers dont listen for every little noise, and some do. Its all about perception and the $$$ spent and expected acceptabilty of ANYTHING on a car. Im not saying your noise is small. Im saying that Ive seen some customer over the yrs complaining about noises that we have to drive around for miles and miles to get the noise to happen, happens once and lightly. How do you find and isolate something like that. we dont get paid to have a couple techs drive around all day 1 to drive and 1 to listen.
Now on the roofs yes not all make noise, I just had 1-2 weeks ago the customer wasnt complaining about roof noise but we did the bulletin cause its a "next visit" TSB well guess what. he came back with a noisy roof that wasnt before. And after replacing his sunblind feet(yours broke too releaseing the blind) they were bent in the Houston heat, and finally broke releasing the blind so you get the WINDING noise, imagine that. Not part of the bulleting and you cannot look and see that without taking the blind apart. I traced the noise to the glass to rubber contact. Used the 602/2 lube in the Jaguar squeek and rattle kit specifically desgned for rubber to glass contact that Ive used many times before with great results. It made it worse! I finally adjust the roof glass by loosening the attachement bolts slightly and then retightened. Noise goneand quiet as can be. Now heres the kicker no noise before, part of the TSB is to check the glass level and its to be even with the back panel or 1mm up to which it fit this criteria and no adjustment needed. So upon return I adjusted the glass like I said and quiet again. So I would have to assume that if techs are following the bulletin and doing what it says issues can/do still come up, and every car can be differant based upon stacked tollerances, customers, temps, humdity etc...Just because a bulletin has been done and properlyto instructions doesnt meen it work in every case as I just showed. Another thing is as a car is driven, hits pot holes, twists, bends etc things are gonna make noise. For years convertible topped car drivers came to expect that if you have a convertible top car your gonna hear more wind noise, creaks and pops since the cars are not as riggid as a solid ROOF sedan. Put a big moveable glass panel up there and now youre having issue because of the same forces. cars are much stiffer to day and lighter. And the first couple Jaguar fixes for the roofs was to try to increases rigidity and that was the wrong solution, now its to ALLOW some movement in smooth teflon washers with specific bolt torque spec so stop the popping and creaking. by and large if done correctly this IS the best fix for 90% of the cars its performed on. The other 10% or so need added time and work to resolve like I have now with 2 glass panel adjustments...

 

Well I for one, would like to thank Brutal for posting such a detailed post on this issue.

 

Me too, I think what he is saying is.......

 

Have an early VIN 2012. In the shop right now for the second fix for roof popping. Had the first fix done 5 months ago. Didn't resolve the issue. So having the new fix done. Service advisor said they are replacing the motors on the sunshades even though they were working fine. Is this part of the new fix along with the. New washers etc?

 

How do you know if it's an early VIN 2012? So far, mine has had no problems. My 2011, however, was a completely different story.

 

Would like to add to my earlier comment about my 2012 xjl in for roof fix. The loaner they gave me is a 2012 xf with 900 miles on it. The sunroof squeaks and shifts when going up and down driveways etc when the body twists. I believe jaguar has a serious design flaw with all the sunroofs! I've had Mercedes and Lexus vehicles and never had a sunroof make noises. This is my first and last jaguar. What's the process to have them give you a new car for the xj roof issues?

 

I don't remember the vin # But it was an early build because it came with the old touchscreen version and they replaced it with the new version after I purchased it. I bought my car on dec 26 2011. Buts it's a 2012 model.

 

Brutal,
You don't think it's coincidental that my 1st car and the replacement car have had the same exact issues ? And the dealer promised me Jaguar was aware of the roof they said it would be fixed by he factory when they delivered the new car.
I've had the replacement car a little over a year now, so that leave me to believe the roof is a design flaw from the jaguar factory.

 

No i dont think its coincidental, i think its a common problem on many, but not all cars. Some are totally quiet, some noisy, some very light and infrequent. I do see a few 2012's for noise, but not many and certainly nothing like the 2011 frequency

 

Is the fix for the 2011 cars what they do now in the factory for the 2012s and forward? Or do they have an entirely different assembly from the factory now?

 

Did the noise quit for a while after the fix or did it come back immediately after the repair?

 

Picked up the car yesterday Had the new fix done. Basically the same as before. Nuts washers etc replaced and everything adjusted with a differrent torque setting that is differrent from the first fix. Also the ticking popping rattling in the front dash is gone. Something adjusted under the hood. Service advisor knew exactly what it was and how to fix it. They know of this. Easy fix. As far as the roof. So far no loud creaking in a nd out of driveway and no rattling on wavy roads. It's only been a day. But I'm crossing my fingers that this 2 nd try is the real deal. Service advisor was very knowledgeable.

 

good luck

 

My techs seem to be able to fix this problem. If not the first time, the second time for sure when it gets to the shop forman. A sunroof is a floating unit on all cars, it's going to make some noise at some point. If you are tuned into something you are going to hear some kind of noise with body flex.

 

Had the same fix for a ticking sound in the dash on the passenger side--something to do with the hood hinge. When I complained about the noise they knew exactly what to do and it worked.

I would really like to know how prevalent the unresolved roof popping issue is--you obviously can't tell from this forum (except for Brutal's insights which I, for one, really appreciate). Mine has been noise free for over a year and a half now. Still think it's incompetant dealers at fault and if you can't find a good one then it's probably time to get rid of the car.

 

Was your repair the k 117?