Car key signal blocker for XJ
#1
04-21-2018, 06:57 AM
Car key signal blocker for XJ
I purchased something like this from ebay
Its got decent ratings but some people say it doesnt work for some car models, I tried it anyway and it doesn't work for the XJ. I can open my car nearby even when the key is in the wallet.
Whats the reason for this? Surely its just a radio signal regardless?
One thing I did have is my lock and key upgraded recently under warranty to the latest version (wondering if it works differently on the XJ or less/more secure?)
Its got decent ratings but some people say it doesnt work for some car models, I tried it anyway and it doesn't work for the XJ. I can open my car nearby even when the key is in the wallet.
Whats the reason for this? Surely its just a radio signal regardless?
One thing I did have is my lock and key upgraded recently under warranty to the latest version (wondering if it works differently on the XJ or less/more secure?)
#2
04-21-2018, 08:20 AM
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As I understand how a faraday suit/cage works, it simply makes the potential around something equal so there is no difference to have electricity flow through what is being protected. In the case of a human inside of a suit, everything that the human can touch is placed at the same potential, therefore, when the suit jumps to say 1 million volts, so does the person in side, but because everything is at the same potential, the human is just fine. In the case of your key, when it transmits a signal, it is placing a potential on the surrounding air and that is what moves the signal around to the car. Putting that bag around it would only cause the signal to be applied to the bag and then retransmitted since there is no where for the signal to go unless the bag was in contact with a part of the fob that was the ground of the keyfob. So, it is possible that the reason why it doesn't work on jaguar keyfobs is the exterior of the keyfob is not grounded to the circuit card inside the fob. Therefore, there is nothing that will sink the signal, killing the transmission.
How you would make it work with the Jag keyfob, you would have to figure out a way to get the faraday portion of the bag to a ground point inside the keyfob. Not sure it is really worth it.
How you would make it work with the Jag keyfob, you would have to figure out a way to get the faraday portion of the bag to a ground point inside the keyfob. Not sure it is really worth it.
#3
04-21-2018, 08:29 PM
Veteran Member
I'm pretty sure, but not absolutely certain, that even if a thief used a black box to capture the signal transmitted by your Smartkey, he would not be able to steal your car. Jaguar had that problem of easily cloned keys with earlier models and, to stop it, re-engineered the new XJ Smartkey so that it had to be paired with the car it left the factory with, like a parent and child. The thief's cloned key would be an orphan and wouldn't work.
So, there's no reason to have a Faraday cage for your Jaguar Smartkey.
Hopefully, a Tech who knows for sure will confirm.
So, there's no reason to have a Faraday cage for your Jaguar Smartkey.
Hopefully, a Tech who knows for sure will confirm.
#4
04-22-2018, 12:43 AM
Veteran Member
I don't think the latest ones are capturing the signal as such, they relay the signal from your own fob to the car. The F Pace and some Land Rovers are on this list so I assume other models will be too:
https://www.express.co.uk/life-style...-theft-warning
https://www.express.co.uk/life-style...-Birmingham-UK
This guy on the X351 list had his car broken in to using something similar:
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...hacked-141846/
https://www.express.co.uk/life-style...-theft-warning
https://www.express.co.uk/life-style...-Birmingham-UK
This guy on the X351 list had his car broken in to using something similar:
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/x...hacked-141846/
#5
04-22-2018, 05:01 AM
^ thats correct, the flaw is that the relay attack makes the car think that the key is nearby, they use essentially what is an antenna/signal booster to make the key in your home "appear" closer to the car, hence unlock it.
i really dont know how they are going to get around this, other than change the tech itself.
if i put foil around my key it certainly stops the signal but for obvious reasons this isnt really practical
i really dont know how they are going to get around this, other than change the tech itself.
if i put foil around my key it certainly stops the signal but for obvious reasons this isnt really practical
#7
04-22-2018, 11:23 AM
Veteran Member
See Post #8 by Cambo, a Forum Moderator, in this thread from the F-type Forum:
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f...rt-key-200290/
https://www.jaguarforums.com/forum/f...rt-key-200290/
"Since 2015 (or late 2014, hard to say when exactly) JLR changed the way that keys are programmed, in response to a wave of vehicle thefts in the UK where the thieves were programming new keys to cars and simply driving them away.
The KVM (Keyless Vehicle Module) also known as RFA (Remote Function Actuator) was changed to be read-only, and can no longer have a new key programmed to it, so to program a new key to the vehicle, the KVM and any existing keys needs to be replaced.
Makes it quite an expensive exercise.
You may be lucky with a 2014 car it could still have the older software in it which would still allow a new key to be programmed but the catch-22 is if the car goes back to the dealer for any key/security related matters, the software in the KVM get's updated to the new version which does not allow keys to be programmed...
The dealer you bought the car from simply giving you a new key without programming is feeding you lines.
There are some 3rd party key programming tools which can bypass all of this additional security, but finding an independent automotive locksmith who has one of these tools may not be so easy...
__________________
2009 XKR Portfolio, coupe ̶1̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶1̶0̶ 1 of 9 in Oz - 12.61 @ 114.75, in progress
2005 XJR, Black with Cranberry Leather 12.93 @ 107.21, 340.7RWHP ex-UK/Swiss
2008 LR2 HSE, all Black 3.2L, family wagon, work in progress
2005 X-Type & 2001 S-Type, no longer with us...
@oldjaguarau and some stuff for sale"
The KVM (Keyless Vehicle Module) also known as RFA (Remote Function Actuator) was changed to be read-only, and can no longer have a new key programmed to it, so to program a new key to the vehicle, the KVM and any existing keys needs to be replaced.
Makes it quite an expensive exercise.
You may be lucky with a 2014 car it could still have the older software in it which would still allow a new key to be programmed but the catch-22 is if the car goes back to the dealer for any key/security related matters, the software in the KVM get's updated to the new version which does not allow keys to be programmed...
The dealer you bought the car from simply giving you a new key without programming is feeding you lines.
There are some 3rd party key programming tools which can bypass all of this additional security, but finding an independent automotive locksmith who has one of these tools may not be so easy...
__________________
2009 XKR Portfolio, coupe ̶1̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶1̶0̶ 1 of 9 in Oz - 12.61 @ 114.75, in progress
2005 XJR, Black with Cranberry Leather 12.93 @ 107.21, 340.7RWHP ex-UK/Swiss
2008 LR2 HSE, all Black 3.2L, family wagon, work in progress
2005 X-Type & 2001 S-Type, no longer with us...
@oldjaguarau and some stuff for sale"
Last edited by Stuart S; 04-22-2018 at 11:30 AM. Reason: Added linked text, indented
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#8
04-22-2018, 07:12 PM
Veteran Member
See Post #8 by Cambo, a Forum Moderator, in this thread from the F-type Forum:
"Since 2015 (or late 2014, hard to say when exactly) JLR changed the way that keys are programmed, in response to a wave of vehicle thefts in the UK where the thieves were programming new keys to cars and simply driving them away.
"Since 2015 (or late 2014, hard to say when exactly) JLR changed the way that keys are programmed, in response to a wave of vehicle thefts in the UK where the thieves were programming new keys to cars and simply driving them away.
It is reliant on people leaving their fobs close enough for the relay gear to be able to talk to it though, e.g. by the front door.
The article I linked to mentions that the F Pace is one of the cars affected and the first of those weren't delivered to customers until 2016.
#9
04-22-2018, 09:47 PM
Veteran Member
I agree that the "relay method" doesn't clone a new key, but simply amplifies the existing key's signal and relays it to the accomplice who uses his device to open the door. Will opening the door without having the key present allow the thief to start the engine and steal the car?
I doubt it, but I'd like to know what a Jaguar technician thinks.
I doubt it, but I'd like to know what a Jaguar technician thinks.
#10
04-23-2018, 02:16 AM
Veteran Member
#11
04-23-2018, 05:31 AM
Veteran Member
2016 XJ stolen:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/...f=23&t=1664515
2016 F Pace stolen:
https://www.fpaceforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3540
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/...f=23&t=1664515
2016 F Pace stolen:
https://www.fpaceforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3540
#13
04-23-2018, 07:29 AM
Senior Member
The KVM (Keyless Vehicle Module) also known as RFA (Remote Function Actuator) was changed to be read-only, and can no longer have a new key programmed to it, so to program a new key to the vehicle, the KVM and any existing keys needs to be replaced.
Makes it quite an expensive exercise.
Makes it quite an expensive exercise.
#15
04-23-2018, 07:35 AM
Senior Member
JimC64 posted on the UK fora (and maybe here too, I can't manage the search!) about faraday pouches for the nervous:
My XJ X351 ownership thread... - Page 13
My XJ X351 ownership thread... - Page 13
I approached the locked car, key in pocket and tried the handle, she opened up at my request nice n quickly, no issues.
I then re locked the car and popped the keys into the pouch, holding it only perhaps a foot away from the door lock and tried again....No joy, she did not open, so they did their job. I bought two pouches, one for my spare key to be kept in the house for safe keeping and one for my everyday use key, should be all good hopefully...
I then re locked the car and popped the keys into the pouch, holding it only perhaps a foot away from the door lock and tried again....No joy, she did not open, so they did their job. I bought two pouches, one for my spare key to be kept in the house for safe keeping and one for my everyday use key, should be all good hopefully...
#16
04-24-2018, 05:15 AM
Veteran Member
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