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do you have any recommendations for that scenario?
Sorry, I have not.
As indicated by Motorcarman, they are not available separately, and I don't think gluing will be a lasting solution.
This problem will probably get worse over time due to aging plastic, so maybe a group-buy for a batch of 3-D printed ones, by a specialist following an unbroken sample?
Just thinking out loud ...
Originally Posted by nilanium
I think it may be part 18 here
I don't think it is, look to me this is the raw (without the required trim) rain deflector itself.
The plastic piece breaking is part of the track, circled below from the TB (working mostly on memory here, so I hope I am correct).
Ah okay, I guess I misunderstood the part that was broken. Thought it was the retaining tabs on the rearward (shorter) sliding interior roof section that had broken.
Ah okay, I guess I misunderstood the part that was broken. Thought it was the retaining tabs on the rearward (shorter) sliding interior roof section that had broken.
I am sure that someone who had the part actually broken will chime in with details on what, where and how.
I should have known it is almost impossible to make any pictures in such restricted area.
Anyway, I hope this helps, a little explanation:
After you remove the large inner lining through the tilted open sunroof (slides backwards, be careful with some springs which can hook), you will see a spring operated arm on each side.
This arm supports the inner lining, and has a pin to connect to each side of the rear trim panel.
With the sunroof tilted, and the rear trim panel more or less in place, you will need to force rotate the arm down, then hook the pin in the hole.
The problem is that either the plastic holder is snapped (that's a real problem), or more common, these arms do not line up with the hole, and can snap loose every now and then.
I had the last problem, and fabricated 2 small, U-shaped brackets.
They act as springs, hold the arm and the plastic loosely together, still allowing for the necessary movement.
I made those brackets from the stainless steel spring of an old wiper blade, they are thin enough, super strong, and can be bent and cut with pliers.
It is a bit of trial and error, the first one I made was wrong, but after that they work as they should.
The shape is actually not an U, but has 2 extra bents to go into the hole on the opposite side, to prevent it from falling off.
The spring tension keeps it in place once you click them in.
The tape is left over from installation, I taped the bracket on a long screwdriver to hold it in place while clicking into position.
I hope this shed a bit of light on how it is fitted, and how to improve the operation.
Thank you - very helpful!
To confirm what I think I understood, the small rear panel only connects to the larger interior panel, and that bigger interior panel can be removed by sliding out the tilted up sunroof, right? I'm still not clear what attaches the front panel to the metal exterior panel - I mean in oem configuration without your retaining wire add on.
Also, if the panels are positioned roughly in place, but not connected to anything, why would I need to remove the front panel out the tilted sunroof?
The front inside panel is clipped in at both the very front of the sunroof and the middle to a spring loaded pivoting arm which connects both the large and small inner sunroof panels. If this arm disconnects from the small panel, it will fold up behind the larger panel. I'll attach a few pictures to show what I mean.
My pass side arm is actually snapped off at before the large panel clip, so I can't properly tilt my sunroof up, the large panel kinda hangs loosely on the pass side. Also when I pulled the large panel I saw the arm had come loose from the small panel. The wiper metal clip is a really good idea to help retain the arm.
In all pictures right is towards the front of the car. I pictured my intact pivot arm, the bad one has that top tab broken off. Fixing this would mean replacing the entire passenger track assembly and all the work associated with that.
The pivot arm, not attached to anything The pivot arm, correctly attached to the rearward inside panel. The retaining methods on the large panel. The spring to the right clips in at the very front of the panel (the long metal pin can be seen clearly in the very right of pic 2), and the pivot arm hooks on towards the middle of the panel. The spring towards the left just keeps the panel from wobbling around when going over bumps etc.
***EDIT:Ireread up, the "drain channel support" in ericjansen's post is the plastic bit with the tab that the pivot arm pin hooks into. I guess they attach to the smaller sliding panel somehow, the one on my passenger side seems to hold tight to the small panel, but the one on the drivers side moves side-side easily by hand, so it wiggles away from the pivot arm and falls off that tab. The TSB calls that pivot arm the "bell crank lever arm"
Nilanium, How did you get the large and small interior panels off to take these pictures? My sun roof works fine but I need to remove the metal exterior panel. I understand that the large panel is is clipped at the front of the panel and in the middle but I don't understand how to get access to the arms to unclip them.
Tilt sunroof up, pull forward interior panel through the gap towards the back of the car. When it's about halfway out, those tension springs in the middle/left of the last pic will catch on a lip of the sunroof, you just have to push them down by hand to clear that lip. That will make a lot more sense once you're there and pulling the interior panel in person.
Don't forget to realign the metal panel after reinstall.
EricJansen.... if you're out there... your clip idea is brilliant.... your spring ..What part of the old wiper blade did you use? Can you tell us what the dimensions are of this special hand made clip?...ie distance between bends? etc. Any info on your brilliant spring appreciated !
EricJansen.... if you're out there... your clip idea is brilliant.... your spring ..What part of the old wiper blade did you use? Can you tell us what the dimensions are of this special hand made clip?...ie distance between bends? etc. Any info on your brilliant spring appreciated !
Yeah, still around .
First, I can say it still works after ~ 2 years.
Don't drive the car a lot, but use the sunroof a lot, and it still looks are good as once repaired.
If you use a standard wiper, you will see that there are 2 stainless strips around the rubber blades, to keep them in the correct shape.
One of those I used.
I have no notes on the sizes, as I made them on the spot.
Flip your roof open, remove the inner panel (slides backwards through the opening).
I just took a small ruler, 2 strong but small pliers, a steel cutter, a small but long screwdriver or piece of rod, painters tape, and a knife.
Having the idea of what I wanted, I took some rough dimensions, and went for it ... .
Take some over-length on one side, so you got grip for your pliers, you can cut that part at the end.
Biggest challenge is not to drop the thing in the gutter, for that I used the painters tape, and the long rod.
Just tape them together, and you got something to hold on.
Trick is to make the clip in such way that:
- one end fits in the small hole on the outside of the mechanism,
- it is fit and tight, and 'clicks' in place on the inside,
- it is loose enough for the mechanism to move.
I made samples, the 2nd one was right, which I then copied for the other side.
After final installation, just cut the painters tape from the rod and clean it up.
Finally, check that your inner panel is free of these clips.
If I remember well, in my case they just touched to heavily.
The backing material of the panel is very thin though, and I just bent it a bit inwards.
The soft liner covers it anyway, just need to get the hard part out of the way.
Last edited by ericjansen; 09-08-2017 at 10:46 PM.
Thanks Eric !! Especially on the clip material and the caution on making sure that the inner panel is clear of the clips.
I'll be beginning this project today after I find an old wiper.
For the benefit of those who read this thread with all its excellent contributors ....a quick summary ...... this seems to be a common problem for this sunroof..... There are 3 symptoms that "announce " you that you need Eric's BRILLIANT solution:
1. IMMEDIATELY Upon the opening the sunroof one hears a LOUD "snap" /"clunk" that sounds like something has broken. It has !
2. If you then are able to "tilt" the panel you will see that one or both rear sides of the inner (cloth covered) panel are "sagging". This is because the pin in one end of the spring loaded "bell crank" has disengaged from the little hole in the plastic clip device that moves the rear small piece of the inner panel and the other end of the bell crank is no longer holding up the inner trim panel ( this is what Eric's solution prevents) There are a number of great photographs of this on this thread that show this condition.
3. If BOTH sides pins have disengaged , chances are your small rear panel has been left in the rear of the sunroof track mechanism after the roof has been fully moved rearward and then returned forward It must be "fished " back out with a piece of mechanic's wire or coat hangers. ( more on this in this thread from previous posters) By the way, this is MUCH easier to do if you remove the metal roof panel ( see comments below on removal)
VERY IMPORTANT !!!! The small panel MUST be in the correct position when the roof is closed as it is the water drain mechanism that catches and drains any water from the roof seal which always leaks a little to 2 hoses either side of the panel that discharge water immediately in front of the rear wheels . While you're in there it might be wise to pour some water in the panel's inner track on either side and then look in front of each rear wheel to makes sure the water is discharging correctly. If not, you've got a clog in one or both tubes which MUST be cleaned otherwise you will ultimately get water damage and musty stink inside your Jaguar.. we don't want that !
Another VERY IMPORTANT...Once you begin to re-insert the bell crank pins back into the little plastic clips that move the small rear panel you may ( as I did) say" Aw this is simple. I'll just "bend" the bellcrank a little and that's That"..WRONG !! as said in posts from others here.. that bell crank is made of a material that doesn't bend. It BREAKS if you force a bend. Then YOU"RE SCREWED ! Don't do it! Again this is why Eric's solution is so brilliant
Other... while you are in there doing "surgery" on your roof take a minute to lube up the tracks mechanism etc. I use a combo of white lithium grease and silicon spray. Remember to put a nice soaking of silicon spray on the roof panel gasket seal . Its the "correct" lubricant for the gasket that won't actually do more harm than good as other lubricants might do.
If you do decide to remove the actual metal roof panel to make getting "at" things easier ( and it does) , take a sharp object and "scribe" the location of all six tabs ( 3 on each side) so that the alignment of the panel is preserved when you re-install it. Also, be careful not drop any of the six screws that secure the panel as they are a big PITA to ("fish out" )if you drop one.
Ok ! Put on the sunblock...open your now perfectly operating sunroof and enjoy the ride ! Good luck !
02-01-2017, 03:30 PM
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Good luck !
