XJ XJ8 / XJR ( X308 ) 1997 - 2003

XJ8 nearly fires up!!!! Grrrrrrr

 
  #1  
Old 03-17-2019, 04:42 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default XJ8 nearly fires up!!!! Grrrrrrr

Hi all and firstly I would like to thank all that have helped me get this far.
so I have made a clip mainly for the sound
Sorry somehow between Iphone and converter its sideways
But pls have a Listen to it

1.Changed fuel pump (had no pressure)
2. fuel pressure starts at 48 psi drops to 38 (only did test turning ignition on NOT Cranking)
3. I have put oil in cylinders and cranked them
4. Held foot to floor 5-6 times 15-20 sec
5. held foot 1/2 way tried 1/2 doz times
6. foot to floor again kick kick not quite start
7. foot off pedal cranking sounds dead no kick
8. Tried foot to floor kick kicking not quite start then lift foot 1/2 way same kick kick not start, then just cranking sound
continued to regulate (feather up and down no luck)
I haven changed the fuel filter? maybe chack pressure when cranking?
HELP!

 
  #2  
Old 03-17-2019, 04:47 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

When I drag and drop the avi file I can't see it why
is it there?
Here's a short cut to Google drive
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Q65...ew?usp=sharing
 

Last edited by Dutchy; 03-17-2019 at 05:04 PM.
  #3  
Old 03-18-2019, 07:01 AM
Highhorse's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Trying to escape Central Florida
Posts: 2,706
Received 978 Likes on 758 Posts
Default

Have you checked your plugs (the oil could have fouled them) and the CPS (crank positioning sensor) ...it could be dirty or bad? I have not followed this for your prior work you've done, ...how was the engine running before?
Your situation sounds like bore wash. Also, if you have 48 psi at your fuel rail, your filter is pretty much eliminated as a culprit. Have you check your throttle body for fuel?
 
The following 2 users liked this post by Highhorse:
Don B (03-18-2019), Dutchy (03-21-2019)
  #4  
Old 03-18-2019, 03:53 PM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

I cranked it over with the oil in using the old plugs
then I have put new plugs in NGK Iridium's
do you mean to open the butterfly and look in down throttle?
The car was fine when I pulled up in the driveway after 1/2 hr trip from the transmission shop
the next day it coughed and spluttered then feathering it .it died
That's when I found fuel pump was dead
and that's where I am now extremely frustrated

Did you listen to the video?
I will pull the plugs out this afternoon 2pm Australian time
 
  #5  
Old 03-18-2019, 05:00 PM
Highhorse's Avatar
Veteran Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Trying to escape Central Florida
Posts: 2,706
Received 978 Likes on 758 Posts
Default

Yes, I did listen to the video, that's where I became suspect of bore wash, ...but it doesn't preclude the CPS. Yes also to looking down the TB and smelling if fuel is getting there.

If you don't have it, you'll want to bookmark this site... JagRepair.com - Jaguar Repair Information Resource ...a site member owns and maintains it with much info from the site here.
Here's a link on bore wash from there... JagRepair.com - Jaguar Repair Information Resource
Here's the no start procedure... JagRepair.com - Jaguar Repair Information Resource
Be sure to get any codes you can before beginning this. If you don't have a code reader, let us know and we'll try to guide you through that.
 
The following 2 users liked this post by Highhorse:
Don B (03-18-2019), Dutchy (03-21-2019)
  #6  
Old 03-18-2019, 05:05 PM
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: land of the kekistan
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 55 Likes on 36 Posts
Default

It sounds like almost starting.
if your throttle cable is loose than ecu will not think it is floored and wont cut the fuel to injectors so you may want to check the cable or remove fuel pump relay and crank it without it, than if sound like wanna start stop cranking and put relay back in
cranking while floored takes some time just keep your foot there till the end
check if all sensors are still connected and nothing obvious is hanging disconnected somewhere
 
The following 3 users liked this post by xjack:
Don B (03-18-2019), Dutchy (03-21-2019), Jhartz (03-19-2019)
  #7  
Old 03-18-2019, 10:36 PM
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: The Beautiful Mid-South, U.S.A.
Posts: 16,522
Received 7,571 Likes on 4,229 Posts
Default

Hi Dutchy,

I just went through a similar issue with an X308 that I thought was suffering from bore wash, but it turned out that it was low battery voltage while cranking. If your voltage falls much below 11V while cranking, the ECM may not trigger the ignition to fire. Do you have a good voltmeter or other means of testing the cranking voltage sag? Have you tried charging the battery or boosting it with another vehicle? If the battery is nearing the end of its life, it may not be able to start the car even after being charged.

Cheers,

Don
 
The following 3 users liked this post by Don B:
AD2014 (04-01-2019), Dutchy (03-21-2019), Highhorse (03-19-2019)
  #8  
Old 03-19-2019, 03:09 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

Its a new battery and I have made up Jumper leads out of heavy duty welding flex, then I have had it connected to a secondary car that is running the whole time
My volt meter at the battery is 13.86 Volts and around 12-12.3 when cranking
then I have pulled every coil out and tested it with a spark plug connected to chassis all spark on its a bright yellow spark on all plugs.
 
The following users liked this post:
Don B (03-19-2019)
  #9  
Old 03-19-2019, 03:43 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

OK took new plugs out to have a look seem like too much fuel

New plugs bit of fuel on them
Then I decided to crank the engine with only 4 plugs in, so I removed the passenger side bank of plugs (car is RHD) so as I didn't have to remove all the air intake pipes & removed the fuel relay.
Then WOT, and after cranking 2 times to my amazement it fired up (very sickly of course) I had to feather it for a few seconds then turned it off so I put the relay back in thinking no fuel.
overjoyed I put in another plug and same result and another now running by feathering on 6 plugs but only runs for a few seconds, even with the feathering It cut's out.
I tried after it started using the WOT then releasing the accelerator it ran for a bit and cut out.
Then I put 7 & 8 plugs in, didn't want to start at all. so removed the fuel relay thinking flooded.
o back to 6 then add 1 more to 7 kept trying, eventually, it fired again for a brief moment so back in went the fuel relay.
In the end, I have 8 plugs in & starts WOT.
Feathering or releasing it still cuts out after a few seconds
I will try to upload another video if not a link to google drive again.
 
The following 2 users liked this post by Dutchy:
AD2014 (04-01-2019), Don B (03-19-2019)
  #10  
Old 03-19-2019, 04:13 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
The following users liked this post:
Don B (03-19-2019)
  #11  
Old 03-19-2019, 05:06 AM
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: land of the kekistan
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 55 Likes on 36 Posts
Default

Normal pressure is 41 ignition on and stay about that while cranking yours looks quite over pressured and that mad fluctuation is not right, not sure what would cause that but maybe fuel pressure regulator went bad or your new pump was not good (lesser possibility). Try to jump fuel pump relay to run the pump without cranking and observe the pressure, than try to crank with fpr vacuum hose off and observe the pressure, it would give you some more clues
 
The following 2 users liked this post by xjack:
Don B (03-19-2019), Dutchy (03-21-2019)
  #12  
Old 03-19-2019, 05:26 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
The following users liked this post:
Don B (03-19-2019)
  #13  
Old 03-19-2019, 05:34 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

OK Xjack
I will bypass the contacts on the fuel relay and check pressure at the rail
and then remove the fpr vacuum hose
tomorrow arvo thanks will let you know

I had thought the pressure changing from 48 not cranking to 38 when cranking was not what it is supposed to be
I thought it was supposed to be 44 when cranking or is that when the engine is running?
 
  #14  
Old 03-19-2019, 05:57 AM
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: land of the kekistan
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 55 Likes on 36 Posts
Default

41 would be spot on an 2 more or less may be ok, but the wild fluctuation is what is strange and 48 is a too high and may be flooding the engine
 
The following users liked this post:
Dutchy (03-21-2019)
  #15  
Old 03-19-2019, 06:49 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

Flooding would make sense as the motor cuts out or is hard to keep alive after taking WOT off and when I do that take WOT which apparently cuts fuel supply, well wouldn't the fuel start again as I lifted my foot off thus the high pressure floods the engine again.
and so we start again turn key off
turn key on WOT it fires take foot off, floods as so fourth
what do you think?
 
  #16  
Old 03-19-2019, 07:51 AM
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: land of the kekistan
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 55 Likes on 36 Posts
Default

After see your gauge i think you are going in good direction and i would guess bad regulator but depending on type of rail you have they may be pricey so better be sure before dropping new one in
 
The following users liked this post:
Dutchy (03-21-2019)
  #17  
Old 03-20-2019, 12:15 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

Today
I bypassed the fuel regulator and can clearly hear the pump running
I checked pressure at the fuel rail = 48 psi
I then removed the FPR vacuum hose and got someone to crank the engine, it did its usual kick to start then just cranked remembering no one was touching the throttle
the pressure = about 48 the needle bouncing around crazy just like the video I loaded before cranking with a pressure gauge on
seems like the regulator is crook
my FPR as I have read articles on part numbers and hoses too short
well here's a pic of mine I think it is a JLM21358 now there's the talk of, NCA3007CA, NCA5203EA, NNE5203BA
I believe this is to do with the return line hose that goes into the quickfit and off to the tank?
so I am not sure if the hose from the return line just comes off and pushes back onto the regulator I wouldn't think so due to the pressure
anyway, what does everyone else think?

JLM21358, NCA3007CA, NCA5203EA, NNE5203BA Not sure if return line comes off or to buy it all in one piece.
 
  #18  
Old 03-20-2019, 03:29 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default


How is the bracket (on the original with 2 bolt's) fit on to this?
This part must be incorrect From Ebay
FUEL PRESSURE REGULATOR JAGUAR X100 XK8 X308 XJ8 96-06 JLM21358ES


Fuel Pressure Regulator Genuine NEW For Jaguar Vanden Plas XJ8 XK8 XKR NCA3007CA
 

Last edited by Dutchy; 03-20-2019 at 03:36 AM. Reason: incorrect part
  #19  
Old 03-20-2019, 04:07 AM
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: land of the kekistan
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 55 Likes on 36 Posts
Default

It does not, this regulator is for the later rail with the top feed injectors, some shops mix the part numbers and try to sell it as compatible but it is not, yours is the part below.
I don't know how to properly test this thing other than check for diaphragm leak, it is quite expensive for the simple piece it is, so unless you don't mind to drop funds on it, proper checking would be in order.
Some more food for thought, if your fitted recently fuel pump isn't exactly compatible and produces more pressure than prescribed it would put extra strain on fpr and generate pressure spikes you see, also i remember to read somewhere about collapsed fuel line (one that joins left and right bank rail on the engine front
 
The following 2 users liked this post by xjack:
Don B (03-20-2019), Dutchy (03-21-2019)
  #20  
Old 03-20-2019, 07:55 AM
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 219
Received 30 Likes on 21 Posts
Default

The Higher pressure fuel pump is possible.
I do find it strange the fpr to die as the car drove home fine and the next morning coughed and spluttered, then I found the fuel pump gone,
the pump is not genuine but many have been sold.

Collapsed fuel line. Then right bank (from inside the car side) would not get any fuel so it would not have fired up,
as I pulled the plugs out of the left bank fuel inlet side) and then the reg wouldn't get fuel or pressure so I think that would be the last resort for me.

I am weary about purchasing a second-hand reg it may only confuse the issue more they are out there for 1/2 price of new.
But! found one with a guarantee / Return policy for $55 Australian also it has been tested. From autoreserveparts Based in the United Kingdom, has been an eBay member since 11 Mar 2007 I've purchased from them before
ETA 29th Mar-1st Apr
The facts
high standing fuel pressure pump run only
high pressure when cranking the engine.
No change when removing vacuum from the regulator
Possibilities
Fuel pump or regulator
so can someone tell me what the pressure should be as it leaves the pump before it gets to the filter I wonder? that I can check
 

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: XJ8 nearly fires up!!!! Grrrrrrr


Advertising
Featured Sponsors
Vendor Directory

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: