Xj12 series 3 whining sound / vibration
#1
05-13-2019, 11:20 AM
Xj12 series 3 whining sound / vibration
Hi
I have xj12 series 3 1991. About moth ago the engine started to
"whine" between 1500 - 3000 rpm. Inside of car you can hear the
strong"whine". Outside in engine compartment whining sound is bit
damped because of all the other noises engine makes. There is also
notable vibration outside of the car near engine.
Here is the link to the video from inside of the car, where you can
hear the whine.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/st3gz6r6rb...ining.mp4?dl=0
* The jaguar specialist changed all the engine mounts to new ones.
Whine is still there.
* He also all belts away and the sound/vibration was still there.
Whine is still there.
What this could be? We are baffled
Sincerely, Ilkka
I have xj12 series 3 1991. About moth ago the engine started to
"whine" between 1500 - 3000 rpm. Inside of car you can hear the
strong"whine". Outside in engine compartment whining sound is bit
damped because of all the other noises engine makes. There is also
notable vibration outside of the car near engine.
Here is the link to the video from inside of the car, where you can
hear the whine.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/st3gz6r6rb...ining.mp4?dl=0
* The jaguar specialist changed all the engine mounts to new ones.
Whine is still there.
* He also all belts away and the sound/vibration was still there.
Whine is still there.
What this could be? We are baffled
Sincerely, Ilkka
#2
05-13-2019, 09:50 PM
Firstly, welcome to the Forums.
When the Jag is sorted, please do an Intro in the New Members Area.
I am assuming FI in your location is Finland??, so a Euro spec car.
Hard to pick 100%, but I reckon trans oil is low on fluid, OR, way past fluid refresh time. The TH400 (the transmission in that car) is known to whine when low on fluid, or the fluid is simply OLD.
When the Jag is sorted, please do an Intro in the New Members Area.
I am assuming FI in your location is Finland??, so a Euro spec car.
Hard to pick 100%, but I reckon trans oil is low on fluid, OR, way past fluid refresh time. The TH400 (the transmission in that car) is known to whine when low on fluid, or the fluid is simply OLD.
Last edited by Grant Francis; 05-14-2019 at 02:57 AM. Reason: spelling seriously sucks
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Doug (05-13-2019)
#3
05-13-2019, 10:04 PM
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I'm with Grant.
I'll just add that sometimes the transmission filter drops out of place a bit, causing fluid cavitation and whine. This occurs because the rubber joiner-seal between the transmission filter and the fluid pick-up tube weakens with age.
Also, a failing torque converter or transmission pump can whine.
Cheers
DD
I'll just add that sometimes the transmission filter drops out of place a bit, causing fluid cavitation and whine. This occurs because the rubber joiner-seal between the transmission filter and the fluid pick-up tube weakens with age.
Also, a failing torque converter or transmission pump can whine.
Cheers
DD
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Grant Francis (05-14-2019)
#4
05-14-2019, 02:59 PM
Veteran Member
#5
05-17-2019, 01:20 PM
Hi
We found a cause and solved the sound / vibration problem.
The car mechanic Marco found that the source of sound was around oil filter and oil filter assembly.
By changing engine oil from 20W-50 to 20W-60 and changing the oil filter we solved the problem of sound and vibration. It was about 6000 km since the last oil change.
It is still bit unclear exactly what caused the whine: Was it: the oil filter, oil itself or the valve on the oil filter assembly? At least we know where to to look if whine returns.
Thank you all for profound and good help to narrow down the problem.
Sincerely, Ilkka
We found a cause and solved the sound / vibration problem.
The car mechanic Marco found that the source of sound was around oil filter and oil filter assembly.
By changing engine oil from 20W-50 to 20W-60 and changing the oil filter we solved the problem of sound and vibration. It was about 6000 km since the last oil change.
It is still bit unclear exactly what caused the whine: Was it: the oil filter, oil itself or the valve on the oil filter assembly? At least we know where to to look if whine returns.
Thank you all for profound and good help to narrow down the problem.
Sincerely, Ilkka
The following 2 users liked this post by ilkka suppanen:
Grant Francis (05-17-2019),
littlelic69 (05-18-2019)
#7
05-17-2019, 04:49 PM
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Hi
We found a cause and solved the sound / vibration problem.
The car mechanic Marco found that the source of sound was around oil filter and oil filter assembly.
By changing engine oil from 20W-50 to 20W-60 and changing the oil filter we solved the problem of sound and vibration. It was about 6000 km since the last oil change.
It is still bit unclear exactly what caused the whine: Was it: the oil filter, oil itself or the valve on the oil filter assembly? At least we know where to to look if whine returns.
Thank you all for profound and good help to narrow down the problem.
Sincerely, Ilkka
We found a cause and solved the sound / vibration problem.
The car mechanic Marco found that the source of sound was around oil filter and oil filter assembly.
By changing engine oil from 20W-50 to 20W-60 and changing the oil filter we solved the problem of sound and vibration. It was about 6000 km since the last oil change.
It is still bit unclear exactly what caused the whine: Was it: the oil filter, oil itself or the valve on the oil filter assembly? At least we know where to to look if whine returns.
Thank you all for profound and good help to narrow down the problem.
Sincerely, Ilkka
Hmmmm. Interesting. Some sort of fluid cavatation perhaps? Oil pump gears?
Part of me is thinking that the switch to heavier oil cured the symptom but masked the actual problem.
Cheers
DD
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#8
05-18-2019, 10:42 PM
Senior Member
"....The car mechanic Marco found that the source of sound was around oil filter and oil filter assembly.
By changing engine oil from 20W-50 to 20W-60 and changing the oil filter we solved the problem....."
If Marco still has the removed filter, ask him to open it up and see what you fine between the pleats!!!
I don't want to be an alarmist, but not knowing, would keep me awake at night and not looking forward to a long trip.
Once a year general aviation aircraft have their filter changed, not just to have a new filter, but to see what the filter is trapping from the circulating oil.
They have a can opener tool to open sealed "automotive style" metal filters, but it can be done with cold chisel.
I am with Doug on this, the Symptom, may have gone away, but the problem may still be unresolved?
Rgds
David
By changing engine oil from 20W-50 to 20W-60 and changing the oil filter we solved the problem....."
If Marco still has the removed filter, ask him to open it up and see what you fine between the pleats!!!
I don't want to be an alarmist, but not knowing, would keep me awake at night and not looking forward to a long trip.
Once a year general aviation aircraft have their filter changed, not just to have a new filter, but to see what the filter is trapping from the circulating oil.
They have a can opener tool to open sealed "automotive style" metal filters, but it can be done with cold chisel.
I am with Doug on this, the Symptom, may have gone away, but the problem may still be unresolved?
Rgds
David
#9
05-19-2019, 01:51 AM
Agree on the thicker oil "masking" the real issue,
AND
Sleep catch up and another thought.
The o/rings on the SUCTION pipe for the oil pump supply side are well known to shrink/crack as age, lack of fresh oil, etc all come together, and the suction whine from the V12's huge capacity oil pump would be audible, as would slow oil pressure rise etc, but low oil pressure not really, due to, as I said, the enormous capacity of the V12 oil pump, it really is a monster by any engine standard I have dealt with ever.
Doable repair in the chassis, JUST, as both oil pans need to come off, so front suspension cradle removal is the only way, OR, engine out. I did one of the PreHE's in situ, NEVER EVER again, that sucker engine comes OUT if there is a next time.
AND
Sleep catch up and another thought.
The o/rings on the SUCTION pipe for the oil pump supply side are well known to shrink/crack as age, lack of fresh oil, etc all come together, and the suction whine from the V12's huge capacity oil pump would be audible, as would slow oil pressure rise etc, but low oil pressure not really, due to, as I said, the enormous capacity of the V12 oil pump, it really is a monster by any engine standard I have dealt with ever.
Doable repair in the chassis, JUST, as both oil pans need to come off, so front suspension cradle removal is the only way, OR, engine out. I did one of the PreHE's in situ, NEVER EVER again, that sucker engine comes OUT if there is a next time.
#10
05-19-2019, 10:09 AM
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Wow!!
1. I like the idea of the "biopsy". Clamp the hard end of the filter in a vice. Put a pan under it. use a hack saw to cut the thin metal away. Rotate as needed to access .
Inspect the paper and the oil. A magnet might be useful. alloy trash will not respond.
But, it may shine weirdly with a light applied.
2. Never heard of 20-60? A large jump in viscosity, or merely a minor one? New thing for today for me.
3. Engine removal makes me shudder.
Carl
1. I like the idea of the "biopsy". Clamp the hard end of the filter in a vice. Put a pan under it. use a hack saw to cut the thin metal away. Rotate as needed to access .
Inspect the paper and the oil. A magnet might be useful. alloy trash will not respond.
But, it may shine weirdly with a light applied.
2. Never heard of 20-60? A large jump in viscosity, or merely a minor one? New thing for today for me.
3. Engine removal makes me shudder.
Carl
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