Hi. I bought a black fan (EBC 4553) to replace the cracked yellow one on my V12 now trying to fit it to the car, it just wont fit. The yellow fan had a deep dished boss to move the blades forward into the shroud & the boss surrounded the fan clutch, but the black fan has a flat boss & when bolted to the clutch, the blades sit behind the clutch flange & the blades would contact the belts.
It can't be mounted to the clutch the other way as the diameter of the clutch is too big for the fan hub to sit. All this is demonstrated in the photos attached.
The clutch looks right & is a 4 hole version. Yellow fan (which was relegated to the bin some months ago) fitted perfectly.
Anyone please offer me any opinion as to what's wrong? Clutch incorrect too big? Its either original or was fitted by a previous owner.
Black fan isn't marked with "radiator side" or similar. Which way is correct?
Thanks.
Scotty.

 

You are the 2nd person to raise issues with the Black fan and the steel centre hub.

Alan (Orangeblossom) in the UK had exactly this. Then the quality of the fan he obtained was suspect to him, so he returned it.

He is fitting Efans as we type.

I went Efans on all mine 20+ years ago. The cost then of a blade and hub were simply dumb.

I will email him and get him to slide in and explain his findings.

 

My experience is the 'black fan' should, and does, replace the yellow fan perfectly so my conclusion, FWIW, is that you've got the wrong fan. Like, the seller grabbed the wrong item off the shelf and sent it to you. Or it was incorrectly packaged/labeled.

Does the fan have any ID numbers?

Cheers
DD

 

Hi Scottmg

I had exactly the Same problem with 'Stress Cracks' showing on my Yellow Fan and although they were Originally White, they seem to go Yellow with age.

As its been on my Car for 26 Years, you cannot complain about that.

Since you cannot buy a New White Fan, I also ordered a 'Black Fan' EBC 4553 like you did, which was supposed to be OEM, so I had every reason to believe it would be the same as the 'Yellow Fan' apart from being 'Black'

When it arrived I was totally underwhelmed to say the least, as apart from the fact it was a Fan, it really bore little resemblance to the Original OEM White Fans.

No 'Deep Dish' to cover the Clutch and the Hub was only One inch wide, instead of Two inches wide as per the Original.

So I sent it back for a refund and decided to go Electric.

But then after doing some research, I came across an interesting solution.

If you go on Ebay.com (The USA Version) there are loads of Firms on there Selling the 'Deep Dish' White Fans, for the XJS V12.

They also have a Compatibility Chart, which 'DID NOT' include my 1990 Pre-Facelift XJS.

But they 'DO' have Fans for the Facelift 91 onwards.

So what is the 'Big Difference' why won't the Facelift Fans Fit Pre-Facelift Cars?

The Pre-Facelift Fan is 17 inches Tip to Tip.

The Facelift Fan is 18 inches Tip to Tip.

So just in case I had a problem fitting Electric Fans, I bought myself a 'White' OEM Face-Lift Fan and using a Jig Saw, cut half an inch (approx) off each of the Blades, then tidied them up with a Sander.

Although you have to take your time, the end result was 'Perfect' complete with the Deep Dish.

So 'What is not to like?'

Just a little word of 'Warning' If you decide to go this route, you need to be aware that some retailers 'may' still using a Photo of the OEM White Fan even though they are supplying 'Black Fans'

So best to send them an email, to make sure the 'White Fan' has got the 'Deep Dish' and the holes will line up with your 'Fan Clutch' although its fairly certain that they will (but ask just to be sure)
also check that the White Fan will be 18 inches Tip to Tip.

Then just cut the Blades to length and you are good to go!

It worked for me.

 

Thanks Grant, Doug & Orangeblossom for your assistance.
I can't fit electric as the car is on historic rego & in South Oz the rules are pretty draconian. Car has to remain essentially as it left the factory. Modifications from original specification are not allowed. So that leaves me with no option but to stay with the 1 mechanical & 1 electric combination to get through inspection.
Doug, the fan has Jaguar and EBC4553 embossed in the plastic blade, moulded in not engraved after moulding. So its the genuine article and considering I bought it from Sovereign here in Adelaide cost $200, I'd be surprised and annoyed if it wasn't genuine.
Every Jag parts website I've been to list this as the correct replacement for pre facelift XJS V12, superseding all previous part numbers.
I'm thinking that maybe the diameter of the clutch is too big to fit inside the new fan, which would move the blades forward.
Unless anyone else has come across this & can advise otherwise, I think my best option is to go back to Sovereign with the fan & clutch & ask them to advise.

 

Bugga.

The clutch does change part numbers, and the 5.3 and the 6.0 are the same number, as is the fan blade.

That dish is needed, in MY opinion, coz the blade is mounted from the rear of the clutch (I know you know this), and that dish allows the blade to sit forward so it fits the shroud, AND clears the belts.

My only suggestion, not a good one, is the people now making these blades for Jaguar have simply got it wrong.

To make and fit a spacer between the clutch hub, and the bearing flange will get it further forward to achieve the clearances needed. But then the studs will be too short, and so on.

Geoff will find the answer I am sure.

 

$200 You have got to be kidding (Lol) Same Fan in the UK about £40 + delivery = £60

Much cheaper on ebay but how can you stay Original with the Black Fan, as it looks a totally different design altogether.

 

It is an original part for that car. That is the same problem I have with my XJ-S heading for an H-Plate (VER-XJ553H)... This will be a needed thing for my build when I'm ready.

 

Unfortunately these are the sort of prices we often have to pay down here. I did find some really good pricing by some suppliers in the old dart but the shipping costs can be a killer for anything bigger then can be sent as a "small package" by royal mail.

 

Quick update to close this post. I called in to Sovereign & asked if they had come across the same issue, but I got some blank looks, so obviously not.

After checking the part number of the fan to make sure I had the right one, they grabbed a new fan & Dayco clutch & showed how they went together. As suspected, my original clutch is too big to fit the new fan.

Their price on the new clutch was an eye watering $225. I left to have a think about what to do, but at least I had the answer.

In case anyone else needs one, on Ebay a new clutch including freight from the US is about Aus$100, so much much cheaper. Some application guides don't list a fan clutch for the V12, but I found that the 6 cylinder and V12 used the same clutch. It just annoys me that parts in Oz are so expensive.
Thanks to all that offered advice.

 

WELL, what a fiasco.

One would think that if the fan needs a different clutch to make it proper, then that would be explained at the time of purchase/enquiry.

I see that a lot in the Aftermnarket Spare Parts field I still work in, damn annoying.

I will look at the Dayco suppliers site on Monday, as I dont have the passwords at home.

 

Scotty,

EBC 4553, when bought direct from Jaguar is Au$ 158 (There might be some sort of tax?). It doesn't incur any shipping costs if ordered from a Jaguar Dealer down there (I appreciate you might be some distance from a dealer!).

If anyone can show that the fan doesn't fit properly, then give Glen Parkes a ring at Jaguar Classic Parts. If, for some reason, the manufacture of the black fan has ended up with an incorrect sizing spec, then it's really important that someone can show this to Jaguar in order to get the problem resolved. Glen will be keen to hear if there is a problem with this part.

Good luck

Paul

 

Scotty,

EBC 4553, when bought direct from Jaguar is Au$ 158 (There might be some sort of tax?). It doesn't incur any shipping costs if ordered from a Jaguar Dealer down there (I appreciate you might be some distance from a dealer!).

If anyone can show that the fan doesn't fit properly, then give Glen Parkes a ring at Jaguar Classic Parts. If, for some reason, the manufacture of the black fan has ended up with an incorrect sizing spec, then it's really important that someone can show this to Jaguar in order to get the problem resolved. Glen will be keen to hear if there is a problem with this part.

Good luck

Paul

 

Scotty:


Weird, when the politico's define equipment. Here in CA, it is a SMOG
inspection for old "collector" cars. Moving the cut off date from 75 to 81. Aw, my 83 is too young???


So, if you ditch the mechanical fan and go the Efan route, and make it very sanitary, you think an inspector will be so "Jagwise" to detect it? And, even so, would she/he care??? Same car, same use, same effect on the environment, possibly even better!!!


On another list, a fellow dumped the SMOG pump and hid the evidence so well, that the tech never noticed it's abscense. The car passed.


Carl

 

Just FYI, when I made the change to the black plastic fan, it was a direct replacement and didn't require a different style clutch.

Market or parts stock difference between the US and OZ?

EDIT - Apologies, I'd missed your post on the clutch being the issue.

 

HI Mac. Thanks for that info. I assumed that the new fan should a direct swap but I can only assume that my wrong clutch was not the original but had probably been replaced with a cheaper equivalent from a different car but did fit the yellow fan with the bigger hub.

 

HI Carl. Yes unfortunately mods like electric fans would definitely be detected. The inspectors are Jaguar club members that are registered with government licensing department. The department are draconian in their rules & its easier to stay on the legal side of their rules rather than risk the penalties. You can modify your cars here if they are on full registration ($719 a year) but to have an old car on historic registration ( about a fifth the cost of full rego)they have to be pretty much as they left the factory.

 

Hi Paul. The fan has obviously been redesigned & other users haven't had the same problem I have. EBC4553 fits their clutched. I suspect The clutch on my car was probably not the original but possibly a replacement form a different car that happened to fit the yellow fan with the bigger hub. Thanks for investigating the price. I'll have to try a proper Jaguar dealer in the future. I assumed incorrectly that an independent would have been cheaper. Obviously not.

 

Scott, l am over the border and on full rego anyway but since your original post regarding your troubles l had a look at the conditions for club rego in SA. My reading of them did not indicate there would be a problem going electric. What l saw stated something like " has not been modified to any significant extent" have you actually checked. Seems to be authority gone feral if they would penalise somebody for such changes as electric cooling fans.

 

Seems to fit. My daughter and her gal pal feed a couple of colonies of
feral cats. Human near contact OK when fed, o'wise, take off fast....

1. I am with Baxtor, would an inquiry clear the way for a harmless change. Indeed, a print out of this thread and your lack of sucess in finding original parts might get a variance. And, yipes, a strict interpretation would "outlaw" the black fan as not original. It must be white!!!

2. I withdraw my "whining" about our local rules. My Jeep is up for renewal. A SMOG inspection year. Around $60.00 for the inspection
and $84.00 for the registration. I'll try to be more thankful....

Carl