Hi

Knowing the kind of mixed results you tend to get when trying to find a Car Insurance Company for your Classic Car.

I have spent the last few days doing extensive research, as I need to Insure my Jaguar V12 XJS and preferably with an Agreed Valuation.

The one thing I decided that I didn't want to do was to join a Car Club in order to get a discount on my Insurance.

Why? Because a discount on my Insurance is the one and only thing that I would be interested in.

I can get all the discount I want on Spare Parts and am not at all interested in things like 'Track Days' and all that sort of stuff.

So it didn't make any sense to me to spend £40 joining a Car Club to 'maybe' get about the same in the form of a discount on my Insurance.

If I had a Standard Saloon Car, maybe as a Second Car the Company that attracted me most were 'Chaucer Direct' who came up 'Trumps' in my book for the most incredible Customer Service that I could have wished for.

Who also have a number of excellent reviews at the Review Center, as I was put through straight away, (none of this push button 1 stuff) and spoke to an adviser, who literally could not do enough to help me!

My only problem being that as I didn't have any NCB they were unable to Insure my XJS for me (Until I did) As my NCB had lapsed (over two years)

And So my Search Continued and though I don't want to speak too soon, I may have hit the Jackpot! But like all Insurance Companies, the only way to know for sure is if you make a Claim.

Which very obviously none of us would ever want to do if we can help it.
So all I can say is on 'Paper' and on 'The Telephone' they may well be the kind of firm that I and maybe you are looking for.

The Company in question is: Brentacre.co.uk who seem insure the kind of Stuff that other Companies just don't want to touch.

Anyone heard of them?

We are talking 'Hot Rods' as well as 'Modified Cars' as Well as 'Classics' with an Agreed Valuation.

Apart from your driving record and all that kind of Stuff, their quotations seem to be based upon the Engine Size.

Again I was put through straight away where it was clear, that these guys were all on the same page as most 'Petrol Heads'

So when getting a quote for my Jaguar XJS V12 with No NCB! I was literally grinding my teeth in sheer anticipation of the 'whopping premium' that I thought they were going to quote me.

I know they say you only get what you pay for but this was the Cheapest Quotation that I have ever had! Fully Comp with No NCD and an agreed valuation.

I don't want to say how much that was at this Stage in the game, because I've only just sent them the photos they requested and they may not agree with the figure that I had in mind.

So in the event that their valuation is that much lower than mine, then their very low Premium would be no use to me, in which case we won't do business and the Search would be back on.

So what I would like from you guys is a second opinion, so please tell me what you think.

Who knows they may even be better than the Insurance Company that you may be using at the moment.

I will put the links up so you can look and tell me what you think.

One Stumbling Block that could affect 'me' is in their Policy Schedule which seems to Indicate, that Without an MOT my Insurance would be Invalid!
And I don't have any MOT at the moment.

So it doesn't look as if I could drive the Car in order to get one, without getting into all sorts of trouble 'Driving with no Insurance and having my Car seized! Which I actually saw happen to someone on a 'cop show'

As he didn't have an MOT and therefore wasn't Insured!

So that is also something I would need to sort out with them first!

http://www.brentacre.co.uk/

 

I'm not sure how your NCB can lapse unless you have made a claim, I thought that they lasted for ever.
On my classic policy I use the NCB from my everyday car.
You are not required to have an MOT to drive to and from the place where you have your MOT booked so you should be covered.
Another option would be to take out a one day insurance policy for the MOT day.
Or find a good pal with a trailer or a breakdown truck to take you there.
Do you have laid up cover on your cars when they are off the road? If so, who are they insured with, maybe they can help?
If not then you should think about it, falling branches and roof tiles can do a lot of damage!

 

Hi Steve

I was hoping that 'you' would reply, because I like your approach to my various questions.

First off: Car Clubs are a great idea, if you are a 'dyed in the wool' enthusiast, who wants to not only go to their 'meets' but also take advantage of their 'Special Offers'

But I've been there and done that with my MGB though found I could do some much better deals on my own and things like going to 'meet ups' were of no real interest to me.

So not much point in paying something like £40pa in the hope of a bigger discount on your Insurance. I'm not knocking the people who do so, it's just that it isn't for me.

Second: Any no Claims Bonus, automatically lapses after 2 years, this is pretty much industry Standard 'Terms and Conditions'

But you are quite right in saying, that some Insurance Companies will 'Mirror' the NCB you have on your other Car, more often than not in the form of an introductory discount just to get your business.

But you are 'Wrong' 'in this case' when you say you are Covered to drive your Car to get an MOT. And though there 'may' be exceptions with some Insurance Companies. I would want to see that 'written in blood!'

I was watching one of those 'cop shows' and this guy got stopped and done for No Insurance! and on top of that they Seized his Car!
Because he didn't have an MOT which Invalidated his Insurance!

I don't think he did it on purpose, he just stumbled into it on the assumption that he was allowed to do so, though different Companies do seem to have their own rules.

It always pays to have a good look through the Policy Document of any Insurance Company before you sign up with them.

So it looks like my search continues.

 

Have you thought of asking the MOT garage to pick it up? They could drive it on trade plates.

 

OB,

I can't comment on the company you've found but agreed value is more about the formality of doing it rather than the value per se. Insurance premiums tend to be set based on the insurance risk group of the car, and the circumstances of the customer rather than the precise value of the vehicle. My premiums with my companies are the same whether I take the agreed value options or not.

I've never really thought about whether driving an MoT-expired vehicle to a pre-arranged MoT test invalidated your insurance. Interesting. However, as Steve says, you can take out daily insurance from a number of specialist companies. A whole industry has set up in this space over the last 5 years. I've used this route a number of times for test drives, picking up new cars etc. It's fairly cheap on newish cars but a bit more expensive for older classics such as XJSs. It's about £35 for one day on an older XJS, although with searching, you may get that lower.

On an annual policy that's only going to cost you about £250 anyway, I wouldn't go for a company that doesn't cover you for driving to a pre-arranged MoT on your MoT-expired vehicle (unless that is normal for all insurance companies?).

Understand your comments re club membership. I think the broad range of benefits that good club membership gives you is well worth the money, but each to their own as you said, so enough about that!

Good luck with your continued investigations.

Paul

 

Simples....Do what l did and call the DVLA, they will tell you that ofcouse you can drive it to a pre arranged MOT......and the insurance covers it.

 

'Simples'. Crap, you're not infested with meerkats too are you?

 

I've just checked the wording on an AXA insurance policy and whilst I can't find anything that mentions MoTs, the wording in the AXA policy does state:

General exceptions which apply to all sections of this policy
We will not pay:

..........
4. any liability, loss, damage, cost or expense caused if your car:
a) is not taxed and is not registered in the United Kingdom with the DVLA unless your car is in the process of being registered with the DVLA.

That would seem to imply that whilst your insurance might be valid whilst driving to an MoT, it would be invalid if the car wasn't taxed.

And, by the same token, the wording in a GoGirl insurance policy states:

This Policy does not provide cover for any accident, injury, damage or loss when the insured vehicle is:
(a) being driven in an unsafe, un-roadworthy or damaged condition or does not have a valid MOT certificate when needed

So, driving to pre-arranged MoT might negate this, but who knows how an insurance company might try and wriggle out!

It all seems to be a bit of a grey area!

Paul

 

PTJS1
When I opened your post the following line was right at the bottom of the screen and I thought that you were making a joke as I hadn't scrolled down to see the rest of it yet:

General exceptions which apply to all sections of this policy
We will not pay

I thought 'That just about sums it up!
I was quite interested to read the bit about it not being insured if it wasn't taxed even if it had an MOT.
Why?
How much mechanically safer (on an insurance risk level) is your car if it has that little round disc in the window compared to if it hadn't?
I remember having an old MGB (yeah, I know, they are all old) with wing mirrors and I had to move the tax disc because it was blocking my view through the passenger side mirror. Unsafe, up the premium immediately!
You must be insured to drive to and from an MOT station otherwise every single garage would be choked with MOT failures because people couldn't drive them away. It would almost be post apocalyptic (had to think about spelling that correctly), the streets would be jammed with traffic wardens slapping tickets on non taxed cars.
My mind is boggling with possible scenarios, better have more gin.

 

And another thing:
a) being driven in an unsafe, un-roadworthy or damaged condition or does not have a valid MOT certificate when needed
Unroadworthy is obvious, but-
Who is the arbiter of unsafe?
What is the defintion of 'damaged'?
When do you not 'need' a valid MOT?
Maybe when you are driving to a pre-booked MOT test?

 

Steve,

At the risk of hijacking OB's thread, I agree it does seem to be a bit of a grey area. I remember some years ago talking to a police colleague of mine who reminded me that:

- you may be legally technically allowed to drive to a pre-arranged MoT but you could still be charged if stopped and your vehicle found to unroadworthy
- you may be legally allowed to drive home from the MoT if the car has failed but only if it has failed on grounds that are not deemed to be "dangerous". The MoT tester must advise you if the vehicle is deemed to be too dangerous to drive home from the MoT.

So, I think you're right that you may be insured to drive home from a failed MoT, but if the car is deemed to be "dangerous" then you're probably not insured to drive it at any time.

I'll hit the bottle as well now!

Paul

 

I thought that the garage was legally bound to issue you with an unroadworthy certificate if they deemed it unsafe?
It cost me £100 to get a small bit of welding done and replacement of 2 exhaust mounts to get through the MOT yet three weeks later it has turned out to be an absolute shed; collapsed suspension bushes, front subframe like a collander, leaking fuel pipe (don't really notice the difference in consumption on the V12!), knackered caliper seals, semi functioning speedometer (note to self: don't buy any more cars off ebay!).
Needless to say I immediately took the Subaru to the same garage and it passed despite being somewhat lacking in the full number of catalysts.
The guys that are doing the remedial work (otherwise known as the elastic job list) are inisisting that it has a new MOT when they give it back to me which is great (and brilliant customer care) but as I am running out of bits of my body to sell I'm worried that it will fail.

 

ha ah luv em....simples...
I had a friend take a car 2 months early to an MOT and it failed. She didn't understand that as it had failed that day the 2 months she had left on the old MOT were no more. Failed is failed. I believe he told he it was illegal to drive it home after a fail.

 

He is absolutely right, the new certificate outbids the old one everytime.
I have to have a medical every 2 years for work (passed last week, result!) but if in some complete fit of madness I decide to go in a year early and fail then I lose my job: they take the existing certificate off you and destroy it so I can't work.
Why did she go in 2 months early? Did she think that there was something wrong with the car? The only reason that I ask is that the longest you can have an MOT for is 13 months.

 

Ahh the medical....aviation ?

 

Merchant Navy.
The Ford Transit of the pan-global conglomerate.

 

I'd rather stick pins in my eyes!

 

That's an interesting observation that you make about the "new fail" superseding the "old pass". Of course, it seems to make complete sense to me as it's the current status of the roadworthiness of the car. However, my MoT tester categorically told me only last month that if that happened the system still recognised the validity of the old pass as it hadn't expired datewise. And therefore the police ANPR systems will still show the car as having a valid MoT!

It's definitely not "illegal" (as in not having a MoT) to drive the car straight home after a failed MoT, unless the car is deemed by the tester to be "dangerous". For example, you could fail the car on something minor such as the horn not working but that's not deemed to be "dangerous". Yes, you can get stopped on the way home from the test and issued a ticket for the horn not working, but you won't get done for not having an MoT.

I think I'll do some more investigation tomorrow!

Paul

 

You appear to be caught between a rock and another rock.
Schrödinger's Jag: your car is in a state of superposition. It exists because you can see it but it doesn't exist to the insurance company because it doesn't have an MOT.
So does it exist or doesn't it?
Somebody, sooner or later, is going to have to open the box.

 

Lots of people I've spoken to including 'some' on here, have said that it is perfectly fine (or words to that effect) to drive your Car to and from a Pre-Booked MOT.

And this is something I've always thought myself!

BUT! and there's always a BUT! This is a 'Bear Trap' waiting for the unwary to fall into.

Because if you have a look at the Small Print of what is or isn't Covered, many Insurance Companies do not Cover any Car that doesn't have a current MOT.

Now having said that, many People are under the false impression that this only applies to Cars in regular use, rather than a 'One Off Trip' in order to go and get your Car MOT'd.

The Simple answer is NO! it most Certainly doesn't!
If the Insurance Company Specifically excludes, Insurance on a Car with no MOT.

Now I will qualify that by saying, that this may not apply to every Insurance Company Policy in the UK.

But most will put this 'Clause' in just to cover their backs, so they are not thought of as being irresponsible, or it would leave their system open to abuse.

Or this is what will almost certainly happen if you get stopped by being flagged on an APNR Camera.

First you will be asked to produce your Insurance Certificate and if you haven't got it with you, they will phone the Insurance Company to Check.

So assuming You Do! have Insurance, (which of course you think is valid)
They will almost certainly ask the Insurance Company, if Your Insurance Covers a Car with NO MOT.

The likely answer they will be given is NO! (assuming of course it states this in the Policy)

So then you get done for No Insurance and have your Car Seized together with a massive fine and penalty points etc.

Which if you don't get banned as well, would send any future Premiums through the roof!

It would be no good pleading innocence and saying that you were going for a Pre-booked MOT because the whole thing hinges on a 'point of law' rather than what your mates may have been telling you down the pub.

If 'Your Insurance Policy' doesn't cover a Car with NO MOT.
Then 'It's Game Over'! whether you are going to or from a Pre-booked MOT or not!

Because that would invalidate your Insurance! = Your Car is not Insured!
= You are an Uninsured Driver!

Chilling! I know but those are the facts.

Of course there may be exceptions with some Insurance Companies but I would very much doubt it!

So I for one would want to have it in Black and White from the Underwriters giving me express permission to do so.